This Is Ridiculous!!! Isn't It???

'nuther thought.

If you attack plugs/wires patiently on an LT-1 it is messy, your arm needs a
universal halfway between elbow and wrist, but after taking off the front
tires, and plastic "wheel well" and start at it with teh proper tools it was
a 5 hour job for me (I fly a desk and spreadsheets normally). A good chunk
of that time was spend finding the right tool, adapter, universal, try this
try that, etc. Maybe an hour burned that way, So, 4 hours for a rookie. The
dealer should be better than that.

From a reference on this:
Tune-up 3.5 hours, skill level "B" (whatever that means)

You do not know much about what it cost to keep a shop running do you
George? $20.00 an hour, you have fell down and bumped your head!
There is a HUGE shortage of people that can actually diagnose and
repair cars, not people who just change parts.
Like i said the flat rate book is just a guide, there are MANY times
when i wish i could charge how long it actually took.
If you think that HONEST shops are getting rich you are delusional.
I do agree with you about the difference in labor times on warranty
work, that system is screwed up, it ends up costing the manufactures
much more in the long run than it would to just flat rate the repair,
the only exception to that is on a "campaign", when you have one guy
doing the same repair over and over again. The mechanics at the
dealers work the systyem to the extent that they more than make up for
that cut in time.
The best thing about owning my shop is that i can refuse to work on
anyones cars.
Greg
On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 22:51:40 GMT, "George Csahanin"
> wrote:

>Here's a reason I refuse to take my car to a repair shop. These guys are all
>lower than pond slime with that damned "book". I'd gladly pay hourly rate
>for the actual time worked on. Also, at $90/hour I know they're maybe paying
>the guy doing the work , maybe, $20/hout. They have $70/hour in overhead.
>Right...rip off city.
>
>But take a look at the "book". Different times depending on if it is
>warranty or non-warranty.
>
>-GeorgeC 92 LT-1 Red/Red Awstin, TX
>
>"Robotron Tom" > wrote in message
. ..
>> I had a miss throughout the RPM range and MPG dropped. I started by
>> replacing the coil: no change. I purchased new OEM plug wires and Bosch
>> Platinum +4 plugs and started installing them. Huge pain to do, I must
>> admit. I got the 4 pass side wires on and new plugs in #2 and #4
>> cylinders: no change. Dropped it at the nearby dealership this morning
>> and they found #1 plug was dead. They installed the remaining parts(4
>> wires and 6 plugs) for me and car runs great now.
>>
>> The bill: $425!!!!
>> Did I get a hosing on this one?
>>
>> The mechanic was telling me he cut the labor in half because I had
>> already done most of one side. So...how did I get charged for 3 hours
>> labor for a tune-up if he cut the labor in half? A tune-up on a 93
>> Corvette is 6 hours??? There was a 1 hour charge for diagnostic($89), so
>> that made it 4 hours total labor.
>>
>> Should I complain or just be happy it runs right again?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> --
>> Robotron Tom *remove nospam to email*
>> See the Flashback Arcade at: http:// www.arcadeguy.net
>>
>> Standing for right when it is unpopular is a true test of moral
>> character.
>> -M. Smith
>

You do not know much about what it cost to keep a shop running do you
George? $20.00 an hour, you have fell down and bumped your head!
There is a HUGE shortage of people that can actually diagnose and
repair cars, not people who just change parts.
Like i said the flat rate book is just a guide, there are MANY times
when i wish i could charge how long it actually took.
If you think that HONEST shops are getting rich you are delusional.
I do agree with you about the difference in labor times on warranty
work, that system is screwed up, it ends up costing the manufactures
much more in the long run than it would to just flat rate the repair,
the only exception to that is on a "campaign", when you have one guy
doing the same repair over and over again. The mechanics at the
dealers work the systyem to the extent that they more than make up for
that cut in time.
The best thing about owning my shop is that i can refuse to work on
anyones cars.
Greg
On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 22:51:40 GMT, "George Csahanin"
> wrote:

>Here's a reason I refuse to take my car to a repair shop. These guys are all
>lower than pond slime with that damned "book". I'd gladly pay hourly rate
>for the actual time worked on. Also, at $90/hour I know they're maybe paying
>the guy doing the work , maybe, $20/hout. They have $70/hour in overhead.
>Right...rip off city.
>
>But take a look at the "book". Different times depending on if it is
>warranty or non-warranty.
>
>-GeorgeC 92 LT-1 Red/Red Awstin, TX
>
>"Robotron Tom" > wrote in message
. ..
>> I had a miss throughout the RPM range and MPG dropped. I started by
>> replacing the coil: no change. I purchased new OEM plug wires and Bosch
>> Platinum +4 plugs and started installing them. Huge pain to do, I must
>> admit. I got the 4 pass side wires on and new plugs in #2 and #4
>> cylinders: no change. Dropped it at the nearby dealership this morning
>> and they found #1 plug was dead. They installed the remaining parts(4
>> wires and 6 plugs) for me and car runs great now.
>>
>> The bill: $425!!!!
>> Did I get a hosing on this one?
>>
>> The mechanic was telling me he cut the labor in half because I had
>> already done most of one side. So...how did I get charged for 3 hours
>> labor for a tune-up if he cut the labor in half? A tune-up on a 93
>> Corvette is 6 hours??? There was a 1 hour charge for diagnostic($89), so
>> that made it 4 hours total labor.
>>
>> Should I complain or just be happy it runs right again?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> --
>> Robotron Tom *remove nospam to email*
>> See the Flashback Arcade at: http:// www.arcadeguy.net
>>
>> Standing for right when it is unpopular is a true test of moral
>> character.
>> -M. Smith
>

try reading for content. he stated that the 20 was going to the wrencher.
the shop overhead was the rest of the 90.

> wrote in message
news
> You do not know much about what it cost to keep a shop running do you
> George? $20.00 an hour, you have fell down and bumped your head!
> There is a HUGE shortage of people that can actually diagnose and
> repair cars, not people who just change parts.
> Like i said the flat rate book is just a guide, there are MANY times
> when i wish i could charge how long it actually took.
> If you think that HONEST shops are getting rich you are delusional.
> I do agree with you about the difference in labor times on warranty
> work, that system is screwed up, it ends up costing the manufactures
> much more in the long run than it would to just flat rate the repair,
> the only exception to that is on a "campaign", when you have one guy
> doing the same repair over and over again. The mechanics at the
> dealers work the systyem to the extent that they more than make up for
> that cut in time.
> The best thing about owning my shop is that i can refuse to work on
> anyones cars.
> Greg
> On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 22:51:40 GMT, "George Csahanin"
> > wrote:
>
>>Here's a reason I refuse to take my car to a repair shop. These guys are
>>all
>>lower than pond slime with that damned "book". I'd gladly pay hourly rate
>>for the actual time worked on. Also, at $90/hour I know they're maybe
>>paying
>>the guy doing the work , maybe, $20/hout. They have $70/hour in overhead.
>>Right...rip off city.
>>
>>But take a look at the "book". Different times depending on if it is
>>warranty or non-warranty.
>>
>>-GeorgeC 92 LT-1 Red/Red Awstin, TX
>>
>>"Robotron Tom" > wrote in message
.. .
>>> I had a miss throughout the RPM range and MPG dropped. I started by
>>> replacing the coil: no change. I purchased new OEM plug wires and Bosch
>>> Platinum +4 plugs and started installing them. Huge pain to do, I must
>>> admit. I got the 4 pass side wires on and new plugs in #2 and #4
>>> cylinders: no change. Dropped it at the nearby dealership this morning
>>> and they found #1 plug was dead. They installed the remaining parts(4
>>> wires and 6 plugs) for me and car runs great now.
>>>
>>> The bill: $425!!!!
>>> Did I get a hosing on this one?
>>>
>>> The mechanic was telling me he cut the labor in half because I had
>>> already done most of one side. So...how did I get charged for 3 hours
>>> labor for a tune-up if he cut the labor in half? A tune-up on a 93
>>> Corvette is 6 hours??? There was a 1 hour charge for diagnostic($89), so
>>> that made it 4 hours total labor.
>>>
>>> Should I complain or just be happy it runs right again?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> --
>>> Robotron Tom *remove nospam to email*
>>> See the Flashback Arcade at: http:// www.arcadeguy.net
>>>
>>> Standing for right when it is unpopular is a true test of moral
>>> character.
>>> -M. Smith
>>
>

try reading for content. he stated that the 20 was going to the wrencher.
the shop overhead was the rest of the 90.

> wrote in message
news
> You do not know much about what it cost to keep a shop running do you
> George? $20.00 an hour, you have fell down and bumped your head!
> There is a HUGE shortage of people that can actually diagnose and
> repair cars, not people who just change parts.
> Like i said the flat rate book is just a guide, there are MANY times
> when i wish i could charge how long it actually took.
> If you think that HONEST shops are getting rich you are delusional.
> I do agree with you about the difference in labor times on warranty
> work, that system is screwed up, it ends up costing the manufactures
> much more in the long run than it would to just flat rate the repair,
> the only exception to that is on a "campaign", when you have one guy
> doing the same repair over and over again. The mechanics at the
> dealers work the systyem to the extent that they more than make up for
> that cut in time.
> The best thing about owning my shop is that i can refuse to work on
> anyones cars.
> Greg
> On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 22:51:40 GMT, "George Csahanin"
> > wrote:
>
>>Here's a reason I refuse to take my car to a repair shop. These guys are
>>all
>>lower than pond slime with that damned "book". I'd gladly pay hourly rate
>>for the actual time worked on. Also, at $90/hour I know they're maybe
>>paying
>>the guy doing the work , maybe, $20/hout. They have $70/hour in overhead.
>>Right...rip off city.
>>
>>But take a look at the "book". Different times depending on if it is
>>warranty or non-warranty.
>>
>>-GeorgeC 92 LT-1 Red/Red Awstin, TX
>>
>>"Robotron Tom" > wrote in message
.. .
>>> I had a miss throughout the RPM range and MPG dropped. I started by
>>> replacing the coil: no change. I purchased new OEM plug wires and Bosch
>>> Platinum +4 plugs and started installing them. Huge pain to do, I must
>>> admit. I got the 4 pass side wires on and new plugs in #2 and #4
>>> cylinders: no change. Dropped it at the nearby dealership this morning
>>> and they found #1 plug was dead. They installed the remaining parts(4
>>> wires and 6 plugs) for me and car runs great now.
>>>
>>> The bill: $425!!!!
>>> Did I get a hosing on this one?
>>>
>>> The mechanic was telling me he cut the labor in half because I had
>>> already done most of one side. So...how did I get charged for 3 hours
>>> labor for a tune-up if he cut the labor in half? A tune-up on a 93
>>> Corvette is 6 hours??? There was a 1 hour charge for diagnostic($89), so
>>> that made it 4 hours total labor.
>>>
>>> Should I complain or just be happy it runs right again?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> --
>>> Robotron Tom *remove nospam to email*
>>> See the Flashback Arcade at: http:// www.arcadeguy.net
>>>
>>> Standing for right when it is unpopular is a true test of moral
>>> character.
>>> -M. Smith
>>
>

I take my C5 to the shop because - they do the job in half the time it would
take me, and $90 per hour is less than my billing rate of $150). Just good
financial sense.


"George Csahanin" > wrote in message
. ..
> Here's a reason I refuse to take my car to a repair shop. These guys are
all
> lower than pond slime with that damned "book". I'd gladly pay hourly rate
> for the actual time worked on. Also, at $90/hour I know they're maybe
paying
> the guy doing the work , maybe, $20/hout. They have $70/hour in overhead.
> Right...rip off city.
>
> But take a look at the "book". Different times depending on if it is
> warranty or non-warranty.
>
> -GeorgeC 92 LT-1 Red/Red Awstin, TX
>
> "Robotron Tom" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I had a miss throughout the RPM range and MPG dropped. I started by
> > replacing the coil: no change. I purchased new OEM plug wires and Bosch
> > Platinum +4 plugs and started installing them. Huge pain to do, I must
> > admit. I got the 4 pass side wires on and new plugs in #2 and #4
> > cylinders: no change. Dropped it at the nearby dealership this morning
> > and they found #1 plug was dead. They installed the remaining parts(4
> > wires and 6 plugs) for me and car runs great now.
> >
> > The bill: $425!!!!
> > Did I get a hosing on this one?
> >
> > The mechanic was telling me he cut the labor in half because I had
> > already done most of one side. So...how did I get charged for 3 hours
> > labor for a tune-up if he cut the labor in half? A tune-up on a 93
> > Corvette is 6 hours??? There was a 1 hour charge for diagnostic($89), so
> > that made it 4 hours total labor.
> >
> > Should I complain or just be happy it runs right again?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > --
> > Robotron Tom *remove nospam to email*
> > See the Flashback Arcade at: http:// www.arcadeguy.net
> >
> > Standing for right when it is unpopular is a true test of moral
> > character.
> > -M. Smith
>
>

I take my C5 to the shop because - they do the job in half the time it would
take me, and $90 per hour is less than my billing rate of $150). Just good
financial sense.


"George Csahanin" > wrote in message
. ..
> Here's a reason I refuse to take my car to a repair shop. These guys are
all
> lower than pond slime with that damned "book". I'd gladly pay hourly rate
> for the actual time worked on. Also, at $90/hour I know they're maybe
paying
> the guy doing the work , maybe, $20/hout. They have $70/hour in overhead.
> Right...rip off city.
>
> But take a look at the "book". Different times depending on if it is
> warranty or non-warranty.
>
> -GeorgeC 92 LT-1 Red/Red Awstin, TX
>
> "Robotron Tom" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I had a miss throughout the RPM range and MPG dropped. I started by
> > replacing the coil: no change. I purchased new OEM plug wires and Bosch
> > Platinum +4 plugs and started installing them. Huge pain to do, I must
> > admit. I got the 4 pass side wires on and new plugs in #2 and #4
> > cylinders: no change. Dropped it at the nearby dealership this morning
> > and they found #1 plug was dead. They installed the remaining parts(4
> > wires and 6 plugs) for me and car runs great now.
> >
> > The bill: $425!!!!
> > Did I get a hosing on this one?
> >
> > The mechanic was telling me he cut the labor in half because I had
> > already done most of one side. So...how did I get charged for 3 hours
> > labor for a tune-up if he cut the labor in half? A tune-up on a 93
> > Corvette is 6 hours??? There was a 1 hour charge for diagnostic($89), so
> > that made it 4 hours total labor.
> >
> > Should I complain or just be happy it runs right again?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > --
> > Robotron Tom *remove nospam to email*
> > See the Flashback Arcade at: http:// www.arcadeguy.net
> >
> > Standing for right when it is unpopular is a true test of moral
> > character.
> > -M. Smith
>
>

Charles Spitzer spoke thusly...
> try reading for content. he stated that the 20 was going to the wrencher.
> the shop overhead was the rest of the 90.

Charles:

Where do you find a good wrench for $20 an hour?? Around here, you
MAYBE pay that to the oil/brakes changer, if he's inexperienced enough.
A good diagnostic technition is going to get at least double
that...more if he can bang out the work (QUALITY work) and make the shop
money. For $20 an hour you can get "Bubba", that guy from the old AAMCO
(I think) TV ad. You know, the guy trying to get the water hose to work
and he's saying "I always wanted to fix a transmisheown".

--
-|>|- Diode -|<|-
'68 L-79 Coupe
'79 Triumph Bonneville
Shut up, dave.
Professional driver on a closed course. Do not attempt.
Actual mileage may vary.

Charles Spitzer spoke thusly...
> try reading for content. he stated that the 20 was going to the wrencher.
> the shop overhead was the rest of the 90.

Charles:

Where do you find a good wrench for $20 an hour?? Around here, you
MAYBE pay that to the oil/brakes changer, if he's inexperienced enough.
A good diagnostic technition is going to get at least double
that...more if he can bang out the work (QUALITY work) and make the shop
money. For $20 an hour you can get "Bubba", that guy from the old AAMCO
(I think) TV ad. You know, the guy trying to get the water hose to work
and he's saying "I always wanted to fix a transmisheown".

--
-|>|- Diode -|<|-
'68 L-79 Coupe
'79 Triumph Bonneville
Shut up, dave.
Professional driver on a closed course. Do not attempt.
Actual mileage may vary.

Diode spoke thusly...

> A good diagnostic technition

Oops, sorry, that's "technician". [I'm watching the debate].

--
-|>|- Diode -|<|-
'68 L-79 Coupe
'79 Triumph Bonneville
Shut up, dave.
Professional driver on a closed course. Do not attempt.
Actual mileage may vary.