The 6-cyl Mustang is a dog

Terrible performance for a six in this day
and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
the Japanese route and provide real power
(I don't even believe the current rating for the
6 at all) only to the V8.
-Rich

On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 00:04:45 -0400, RichA > wrote:

>Terrible performance for a six in this day
>and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
>the Japanese route and provide real power
>(I don't even believe the current rating for the
>6 at all) only to the V8.
>-Rich


ford is not smart enough to compete with the asian market

i like it

h
u
r
c
a
s
t

wrote:
> On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 00:04:45 -0400, RichA > wrote:

> >Terrible performance for a six in this day
> >and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
> >the Japanese route and provide real power
> >(I don't even believe the current rating for the
> >6 at all) only to the V8.
> >-Rich

> ford is not smart enough to compete with the asian market

Sure about that? Might want to double check the latest JD Power
survey.

> i like it

And you like servicing men too, so pardon us if we don't listen to you.

Patrick
'93 Cobra
'03 Focus ZX3

RichA wrote:
> Terrible performance for a six in this day
> and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
> the Japanese route and provide real power
> (I don't even believe the current rating for the
> 6 at all) only to the V8.

For a recent vintage Mustang, Vortech makes a supercharger kit that adds
about 80-90HP and about 60 ft/lbs of torque. So that's a bit more power
than the stock 260hp 4.6L V8 (until they upped the V8 to 300hp
recently). If you're stuck with a V6, that might be an alternative for you.

My advice, if you're into making a fast car, is to start out with the
4.6 (or the 5.0 if you're into fox body Mustangs). It's a lot
cheaper/easier to make those engines perform than it is to squeeze extra
ponies out of the 3.8.

Cheers,

RichA wrote:
> Terrible performance for a six in this day
> and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
> the Japanese route and provide real power
> (I don't even believe the current rating for the
> 6 at all) only to the V8.

Rich,

The 6 delivers performance comparable to early the 5-ohs cars of 20
years ago, and the early 4.6 cars. Low 90 mph trap speeds for a base
model that retail for under $20Gs is pretty damn good.

If you're not satisfied with that answer, then realize the sales of all
those less horsepowered, lower cost, 6-cylinders are helping finance
the V8s we all want to own.

Patrick
'93 Cobra
'03 Focus ZX3

On 5 Jul 2005 17:39:30 -0700, wrote:

>RichA wrote:
>> Terrible performance for a six in this day
>> and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
>> the Japanese route and provide real power
>> (I don't even believe the current rating for the
>> 6 at all) only to the V8.
>
>Rich,
>
>The 6 delivers performance comparable to early the 5-ohs cars of 20
>years ago, and the early 4.6 cars. Low 90 mph trap speeds for a base
>model that retail for under $20Gs is pretty damn good.
>
>If you're not satisfied with that answer, then realize the sales of all
>those less horsepowered, lower cost, 6-cylinders are helping finance
>the V8s we all want to own.
>

The V6 in Canada is $23k
The V8 in Canada is $36k.

It's not subsidizing anything. Lets be realistic here; The Ford
Mustang uses old, long paid-for technology. It's practically the only
car you can "update" from time to time with minimal cost, especially
the engines. Cubic inches and not technology drives it's power, so
the idea that there is some cost involved such as would be the cost to
develop a 3L Acura V6 putting out 270hp is a bit silly.
-Rich
>Patrick
>'93 Cobra
>'03 Focus ZX3

"RichA" > wrote in message
...
> On 5 Jul 2005 17:39:30 -0700, wrote:
>
>>RichA wrote:
>>> Terrible performance for a six in this day
>>> and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
>>> the Japanese route and provide real power
>>> (I don't even believe the current rating for the
>>> 6 at all) only to the V8.
>>
>>Rich,
>>
>>The 6 delivers performance comparable to early the 5-ohs cars of 20
>>years ago, and the early 4.6 cars. Low 90 mph trap speeds for a base
>>model that retail for under $20Gs is pretty damn good.
>>
>>If you're not satisfied with that answer, then realize the sales of all
>>those less horsepowered, lower cost, 6-cylinders are helping finance
>>the V8s we all want to own.
>>
>
> The V6 in Canada is $23k
> The V8 in Canada is $36k.
>
> It's not subsidizing anything. Lets be realistic here; The Ford
> Mustang uses old, long paid-for technology. It's practically the only
> car you can "update" from time to time with minimal cost, especially
> the engines. Cubic inches and not technology drives it's power, so
> the idea that there is some cost involved such as would be the cost to
> develop a 3L Acura V6 putting out 270hp is a bit silly.
> -Rich
>>Patrick
>>'93 Cobra
>>'03 Focus ZX3
>

Gah? Do you mean the $42K Canadian Acura TL? Wow, a guy could do a lot to a
6 Mustang for an extra $20K. Let's be realistic here...

Brad

PS: Ask GM if the 6 subsidizes the 8.

RichA wrote:
> On 5 Jul 2005 17:39:30 -0700, wrote:

> >RichA wrote:
> >> Terrible performance for a six in this day
> >> and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
> >> the Japanese route and provide real power
> >> (I don't even believe the current rating for the
> >> 6 at all) only to the V8.

> >The 6 delivers performance comparable to early the 5-ohs cars of 20
> >years ago, and the early 4.6 cars. Low 90 mph trap speeds for a base
> >model that retail for under $20Gs is pretty damn good.

> >If you're not satisfied with that answer, then realize the sales of all
> >those less horsepowered, lower cost, 6-cylinders are helping finance
> >the V8s we all want to own.

> The V6 in Canada is $23k
> The V8 in Canada is $36k.

> It's not subsidizing anything.

A higher horsepower base model would likely cost additional dollars and
lower fuel economy numbers -- two things that may cause some entry
level buyers to look elsewhere. Fewer overall sales means, higher
prices for the rest.

> Lets be realistic here; The Ford Mustang uses old, long paid-for technology.

You mean the 4.6 that continues to get refined/improved? The one and
only component I can think of is the solid axle.

> It's practically the only car you can "update" from time to time with minimal > cost, especially the engines. Cubic inches and not technology drives it's
> power, so the idea that there is some cost involved such as would be the cost
> to develop a 3L Acura V6 putting out 270hp is a bit silly.

How much horsepower do you feel the base model needs? It already has
210... so what, 260-280...? And then the GT will need... 325-350?

Patrick
'93 Cobra
'03 Focus ZX3


> -Rich
> >Patrick
> >'93 Cobra
> >'03 Focus ZX3

On 6 Jul 2005 06:04:07 -0700, wrote:

>RichA wrote:
>> On 5 Jul 2005 17:39:30 -0700, wrote:
>
>> >RichA wrote:
>> >> Terrible performance for a six in this day
>> >> and age. Ford has clearly decided to not take
>> >> the Japanese route and provide real power
>> >> (I don't even believe the current rating for the
>> >> 6 at all) only to the V8.
>
>> >The 6 delivers performance comparable to early the 5-ohs cars of 20
>> >years ago, and the early 4.6 cars. Low 90 mph trap speeds for a base
>> >model that retail for under $20Gs is pretty damn good.
>
>> >If you're not satisfied with that answer, then realize the sales of all
>> >those less horsepowered, lower cost, 6-cylinders are helping finance
>> >the V8s we all want to own.
>
>> The V6 in Canada is $23k
>> The V8 in Canada is $36k.
>
>> It's not subsidizing anything.
>
>A higher horsepower base model would likely cost additional dollars and
>lower fuel economy numbers -- two things that may cause some entry
>level buyers to look elsewhere. Fewer overall sales means, higher
>prices for the rest.
>
>> Lets be realistic here; The Ford Mustang uses old, long paid-for technology.
>
>You mean the 4.6 that continues to get refined/improved? The one and
>only component I can think of is the solid axle.
>
>> It's practically the only car you can "update" from time to time with minimal > cost, especially the engines. Cubic inches and not technology drives it's
>> power, so the idea that there is some cost involved such as would be the cost
>> to develop a 3L Acura V6 putting out 270hp is a bit silly.
>
>How much horsepower do you feel the base model needs? It already has
>210... so what, 260-280...? And then the GT will need... 325-350?
>
>Patrick
>'93 Cobra
>'03 Focus ZX3

How come when the Mustang v8 sported about 210hp (1986?) it ran a
second faster 0-60 than the "210" hp v6 does now? That 210 (I'd say)
is highly optimistic.
I should point out something anyway; I'm not advocating the v6 get
more power, I only pointed out that it lacks power, nothing more.
In fact, it's insurance cost is only 2/3 or less that of the GT thanks
to it's price and lack of power so maybe the market sector serviced by
it would be hurt if it sported more h.p?
-Rich

"RichA" > wrote in message
...
> On 6 Jul 2005 06:04:07 -0700, wrote:
> How come when the Mustang v8 sported about 210hp (1986?) it ran a
> second faster 0-60 than the "210" hp v6 does now? That 210 (I'd say)
> is highly optimistic.

I'm sure both cars make ~210 HP. The engines probably have comparable HP
levels, but the thing is that the 6 banger is a torqueless wonder. It takes
toqque to move cars. 6 bangers don't have the torque of a V8, which is why
you will often see base model V6 cars have lower gearing than V8 cars,
either in the rear or as a first gear ratio in the transmission. They need
that additional torque multiplication to maintain reasonable performance.
The V8 cars have more torque to begin with and can therefore do without the
lower gear ratios. This is why many V6 and V8 models only have a couple MPG
difference. In some cases you will find V6 cars get a more MPG in the city
while V8 cars get a more MPG on the highway.

To get back to the particular topic at hand, fuel economy for the '05
Mustang between the V6 and V8 models with automatics transmissions is
negligible, with what might amount to a noticeable difference between the
manual transmission versions on the highway.

V6 auto: 19/25
V8 auto: 17/25
V6 manual: 19/28
V8 manual: 18/23