"I do wish he wasn't coming to Germany"

Not sure what your point is (yes, misc ramblings). GM and Ford produce vast
volumes of cars in Europe and elsewhere, and one sees few US-style GMs and
Fords here. A poster just above was going on about the presence (lack of) of
US cars in Europe.

Which Chrysler plant are you talking about? The one associated with
Daimler-Benz/Mercedes? Ok, they are starting on Chryslers now. In that
sense you can add the Crossfire, made entirely by Karmann, Osnabrueck,
Germany.

Please give me a fact to contradict my contention that (these new
developments excepting) Chrysler did not produce in Europe for years.

Not sure what VAG has to with this, but as you mention it, perhaps you could
explain what you mean by "old-school Czech engines". I was not aware there
were any.

DAS

For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
---

"Richard Ehrenberg" > wrote in message
...
> Misc. ramblings....
>
> Are you sure about that...? Did Daimler take away the Graz (Austria
> [Osterrich]) plant from Chrysler? I thought it was alive and well (Jeeps,
> Minivans, etc.) only that Merc SUV production was ADDED there.
>
> GM paid Fiat many $bil very recently to weasel out of an old agreement
> that
> would have required them to purchase a majority stake.
>
> Funny that the most reliable VAG products have old-school Czech engines,
> huh?
> http://www.skoda.co.uk/skoda3g/conte...snew/news.aspx
>
> Rick
[...]

As far as I know, Cherokees and GCs, as well as minivans, have been built in Graz, Austria for 15+ years. With Steyr diesel powertrains.

Skodas, one of the VAG groups cars, seem to always get much higher JD Power numbers than "real" VWs and Audis. This was in reference to earlier posts about VW, Audi, BMW, and Benz quality. Most Skodas have original-CZ-design Skoda engines and all are built, as far as I know, in Mlada Bloeslav (SP?) Czech Rep. I've driven quite a few Skodas and I was always impressed. I also drove a 2.0L 5-speed New Beetle of a friend, about 2,000 miles seat time, and it was non-stop trouble - and it was a nearly new car.

As I said, these are just misc. ramblings, not wanting to ignite any kind of flame war!

Rick

"Dori A Schmetterling" > wrote in message ...
> Not sure what your point is (yes, misc ramblings). GM and Ford produce vast
> volumes of cars in Europe and elsewhere, and one sees few US-style GMs and
> Fords here. A poster just above was going on about the presence (lack of) of
> US cars in Europe.
>
> Which Chrysler plant are you talking about? The one associated with
> Daimler-Benz/Mercedes? Ok, they are starting on Chryslers now. In that
> sense you can add the Crossfire, made entirely by Karmann, Osnabrueck,
> Germany.
>
> Please give me a fact to contradict my contention that (these new
> developments excepting) Chrysler did not produce in Europe for years.
>
> Not sure what VAG has to with this, but as you mention it, perhaps you could
> explain what you mean by "old-school Czech engines". I was not aware there
> were any.
>
> DAS
>
> For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
> ---
>
> "Richard Ehrenberg" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Misc. ramblings....
> >
> > Are you sure about that...? Did Daimler take away the Graz (Austria
> > [Osterrich]) plant from Chrysler? I thought it was alive and well (Jeeps,
> > Minivans, etc.) only that Merc SUV production was ADDED there.
> >
> > GM paid Fiat many $bil very recently to weasel out of an old agreement
> > that
> > would have required them to purchase a majority stake.
> >
> > Funny that the most reliable VAG products have old-school Czech engines,
> > huh?
> > http://www.skoda.co.uk/skoda3g/conte...snew/news.aspx
> >
> > Rick
> [...]
>
>

I think you are talking about Steyr-Puch, a contract manufacturer. Chrysler
withdrew from factories in Europe years ago. Steyr-Puch has/had deals with
VW, Chrysler and Mercedes to build 4x4 systems, as well as with Fiat. Jeep
Grand Cherokee has been made here since 1994, tho' there is no info on
volumes (e.g. as a percentage of total sold globally or in Europe).

http://www.eurotruck-importers.com/pinzgauer.htm


Then there is Magna Steyr:
http://www.magnasteyr.com/index_en.html

Note that the current name is Steyr-Daimler-Puch (owned by General
Dynamics):
http://www.steyr-ssf.com/english/index.htm

"Steyr-Daimler-Puch AG (Steyr), the Austrian agent for Fiat, Lancia and Alfa
cars, manufactures tractors, four wheel drive vehicles & mopeds, as well as
components & parts for these (particularly drive units) in addition to
providing a range of technical and engineering services. The manufacture of
four wheel drive vehicles for other car producers like Daimler Benz and
Chrysler has become a major part of the company's business. Subsidiaries of
Steyr produce military technology, motor vehicles, agricultural machinery,
engines and small arms. The company has mainly domestic subsidiaries but
does have some foreign subsidiaries in Switzerland and Germany, and also has
interests in Turkey, Malaysia, Thailand and Nigeria. Vehicle manufacture
accounted for 42% of 1997 revenues; trade, 28%; components, 22%;
engineering, 4%, services, 3% and other, 1%."
(Quoted from
http://www.business.com/directory/au...ch_ag/profile/)

Here is a list of SDP's contract clients:
http://www.hsrshk.asn-graz.ac.at/bri...ler_puch_e.htm

Here is another good profile:
http://www.automotive-business.com/i...ature_oem.html

This is to underline my point about Chrysler manufacture in Europe. So far,
anyway. With the takeover by DC I am sure that production in Europe will
rise, perhaps even at a dedicated plant one day.


I thought that VW introduced VW engines made in Germany into Skodas almost
immediately on takeover. I don't think VW would have tolerated old Skoda
engines for much more than the time it would take to sell the stock
pipeline. The link to the Skoda website you gave says nothing about engine
design.

Maybe they are built in CZ now. That, to me, does not pass any so-what?
test.

DAS

For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
---

"Richard Ehrenberg" > wrote in message
...
As far as I know, Cherokees and GCs, as well as minivans, have been built in
Graz, Austria for 15+ years. With Steyr diesel powertrains.

Skodas, one of the VAG groups cars, seem to always get much higher JD Power
numbers than "real" VWs and Audis. This was in reference to earlier posts
about VW, Audi, BMW, and Benz quality. Most Skodas have original-CZ-design
Skoda engines and all are built, as far as I know, in Mlada Bloeslav (SP?)
Czech Rep. I've driven quite a few Skodas and I was always impressed. I also
drove a 2.0L 5-speed New Beetle of a friend, about 2,000 miles seat time,
and it was non-stop trouble - and it was a nearly new car.

As I said, these are just misc. ramblings, not wanting to ignite any kind of
flame war!

Rick

"Dori A Schmetterling" > wrote in message
...
> Not sure what your point is (yes, misc ramblings). GM and Ford produce
> vast
> volumes of cars in Europe and elsewhere, and one sees few US-style GMs and
> Fords here. A poster just above was going on about the presence (lack of)
> of
> US cars in Europe.
>
> Which Chrysler plant are you talking about? The one associated with
> Daimler-Benz/Mercedes? Ok, they are starting on Chryslers now. In that
> sense you can add the Crossfire, made entirely by Karmann, Osnabrueck,
> Germany.
>
> Please give me a fact to contradict my contention that (these new
> developments excepting) Chrysler did not produce in Europe for years.
>
> Not sure what VAG has to with this, but as you mention it, perhaps you
> could
> explain what you mean by "old-school Czech engines". I was not aware
> there
> were any.
>
> DAS
>
> For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
> ---
>
> "Richard Ehrenberg" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Misc. ramblings....
> >
> > Are you sure about that...? Did Daimler take away the Graz (Austria
> > [Osterrich]) plant from Chrysler? I thought it was alive and well
> > (Jeeps,
> > Minivans, etc.) only that Merc SUV production was ADDED there.
> >
> > GM paid Fiat many $bil very recently to weasel out of an old agreement
> > that
> > would have required them to purchase a majority stake.
> >
> > Funny that the most reliable VAG products have old-school Czech engines,
> > huh?
> > http://www.skoda.co.uk/skoda3g/conte...snew/news.aspx
> >
> > Rick
> [...]
>
>