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Genuine Shop Manuals Standard Equipment on All Cars



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 6th 04, 11:38 PM
Eugene
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Nomen Nescio wrote:

> It now costs the big three exactly a buck fifty to supply a genuine shop
> manual for each and every car and truck they sell.
>
> That's what two CD-ROMs would cost them. One CD for shop procedures. One
> CD for parts catalogue. Those CD-ROMs should be sandwiched in the owner's
> manual.
>
> Do-it-yourselfers need them and so do old ladies. Why old ladies?
> Simple. When she breaks down someplace out of town, those discs will come
> in handy for the independent repair shop and his NAPA supplier.
>
> Never mind the paper edition. That's for dealerships and enthusiasts with
> money burning holes in their pockets.
>
> I'm waiting now for the complaint even $1.50 is a lot on a $30,000 car.
> Okay! Then we need a quick and dirty FEDERAL LAW MANDATING CD-ROM manuals
> in the interests of public safety. Improperly repaired cars are dangerous
> to your health and painful to your pocketbook as well. Let them charge
> $30,001.50 after the passage of this badly needed law. Too many laws on
> the books you say? Of course. At least 10000 of them, so what's one
> more? As bad as laws sometimes are, they are needed to keep the fat cats
> of Detroit on good behavior.
>
> If the Government can take it on to legislate the side wall markings on
> bicycle tires, they surely can mandate two simple CD-ROMs for every car.
> And you'll thank me for for it a thousand times over.

You don't know much about producing a product do you? If a cd costs $1.50
then how are you going to pay the salary for the people who write the text
for the manual, the editors who check them for errors, the project managers
who make sure they get done on time when the vehicle is released? Do you
think all cars are made by slaves in China so the shop manuals can be too?

Ads
  #2  
Old December 6th 04, 11:38 PM
Eugene
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Posts: n/a
Default

Nomen Nescio wrote:

> It now costs the big three exactly a buck fifty to supply a genuine shop
> manual for each and every car and truck they sell.
>
> That's what two CD-ROMs would cost them. One CD for shop procedures. One
> CD for parts catalogue. Those CD-ROMs should be sandwiched in the owner's
> manual.
>
> Do-it-yourselfers need them and so do old ladies. Why old ladies?
> Simple. When she breaks down someplace out of town, those discs will come
> in handy for the independent repair shop and his NAPA supplier.
>
> Never mind the paper edition. That's for dealerships and enthusiasts with
> money burning holes in their pockets.
>
> I'm waiting now for the complaint even $1.50 is a lot on a $30,000 car.
> Okay! Then we need a quick and dirty FEDERAL LAW MANDATING CD-ROM manuals
> in the interests of public safety. Improperly repaired cars are dangerous
> to your health and painful to your pocketbook as well. Let them charge
> $30,001.50 after the passage of this badly needed law. Too many laws on
> the books you say? Of course. At least 10000 of them, so what's one
> more? As bad as laws sometimes are, they are needed to keep the fat cats
> of Detroit on good behavior.
>
> If the Government can take it on to legislate the side wall markings on
> bicycle tires, they surely can mandate two simple CD-ROMs for every car.
> And you'll thank me for for it a thousand times over.

You don't know much about producing a product do you? If a cd costs $1.50
then how are you going to pay the salary for the people who write the text
for the manual, the editors who check them for errors, the project managers
who make sure they get done on time when the vehicle is released? Do you
think all cars are made by slaves in China so the shop manuals can be too?

  #3  
Old December 7th 04, 01:35 AM
Ted
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Default Genuine Shop Manuals Standard Equipment on All Cars

I'm with you on this one. Unfortunately neither Reps nor Dems will
be.....it's ironic that most aircraft service documentation is in the
public domain whereas most auto docs are not.

  #4  
Old December 7th 04, 03:02 AM
Denny
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Hey Nomen, try alldatapro.com

Denny

"Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
...
> It now costs the big three exactly a buck fifty to supply a genuine shop
> manual for each and every car and truck they sell.



  #5  
Old December 7th 04, 03:02 AM
Denny
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Hey Nomen, try alldatapro.com

Denny

"Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
...
> It now costs the big three exactly a buck fifty to supply a genuine shop
> manual for each and every car and truck they sell.



  #6  
Old December 7th 04, 08:03 PM
RustYŠ
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"Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
...
> It now costs the big three exactly a buck fifty to supply a genuine shop
> manual for each and every car and truck they sell.



That is correct - they have all this info on file anyway so they could dish
them out as freely as AOL do with theirs. One problem we have in the UK
though is that Ford dealers go out of their way not to tell you such
information as our American 'buddies' tend to sue them every time they do
something stupid and damage their car or themselves. It would seem that it
is 'reckless' to allow anyone who is not a trained mechanic access to such
information so its just easier to say no.
--
For Welsh Military Flying visit .......
www.groups.yahoo.com/group/V-A-S/


  #7  
Old December 7th 04, 08:03 PM
RustYŠ
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
...
> It now costs the big three exactly a buck fifty to supply a genuine shop
> manual for each and every car and truck they sell.



That is correct - they have all this info on file anyway so they could dish
them out as freely as AOL do with theirs. One problem we have in the UK
though is that Ford dealers go out of their way not to tell you such
information as our American 'buddies' tend to sue them every time they do
something stupid and damage their car or themselves. It would seem that it
is 'reckless' to allow anyone who is not a trained mechanic access to such
information so its just easier to say no.
--
For Welsh Military Flying visit .......
www.groups.yahoo.com/group/V-A-S/


  #8  
Old December 7th 04, 08:41 PM
Mark Olson
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Default

In alt.autos.ford "RustY?" > wrote:
> "Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
> ...
>> It now costs the big three exactly a buck fifty to supply a genuine shop
>> manual for each and every car and truck they sell.


> That is correct - they have all this info on file anyway so they could dish
> them out as freely as AOL do with theirs. One problem we have in the UK
> though is that Ford dealers go out of their way not to tell you such
> information as our American 'buddies' tend to sue them every time they do
> something stupid and damage their car or themselves. It would seem that it
> is 'reckless' to allow anyone who is not a trained mechanic access to such
> information so its just easier to say no.


Are you saying that Ford won't release repair info to their UK customers,
and Ford's reason for this is somehow related to the behavior of Ford's
customers in the USA?

I'm not following you at all. I'm in the US and I can purchase the
genuine Ford factory workshop manuals and/or CDs (from Helm, Inc.) without
any restrictions (other than the cost).

  #9  
Old December 7th 04, 08:41 PM
Mark Olson
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Posts: n/a
Default

In alt.autos.ford "RustY?" > wrote:
> "Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
> ...
>> It now costs the big three exactly a buck fifty to supply a genuine shop
>> manual for each and every car and truck they sell.


> That is correct - they have all this info on file anyway so they could dish
> them out as freely as AOL do with theirs. One problem we have in the UK
> though is that Ford dealers go out of their way not to tell you such
> information as our American 'buddies' tend to sue them every time they do
> something stupid and damage their car or themselves. It would seem that it
> is 'reckless' to allow anyone who is not a trained mechanic access to such
> information so its just easier to say no.


Are you saying that Ford won't release repair info to their UK customers,
and Ford's reason for this is somehow related to the behavior of Ford's
customers in the USA?

I'm not following you at all. I'm in the US and I can purchase the
genuine Ford factory workshop manuals and/or CDs (from Helm, Inc.) without
any restrictions (other than the cost).

  #10  
Old December 8th 04, 01:38 AM
Bill Putney
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Posts: n/a
Default

Nomen Nescio wrote:
>
> I'm waiting now for the complaint even $1.50 is a lot on a $30,000 car.
> Okay! Then we need a quick and dirty FEDERAL LAW MANDATING CD-ROM manuals
> in the interests of public safety. Improperly repaired cars are dangerous
> to your health and painful to your pocketbook as well. Let them charge
> $30,001.50 after the passage of this badly needed law...


You are ignoring an important factor. The $1.50 number you are giving
is the **recurring** cost (how much $$ it takes to procure the blank
disc and burn and pacakge the finished product or contract someone to do
same on a mass scale). You have failed to factor in the non-recurring
cost of creating the information and formating that goes into the manual
(the up-front development cost that comes right off the corporate bottom
line before the recurring cost of the first unit is recovered).

Pass a law that the manual has to be supplied with each vehicle, and the
development cost of the manual amortized over each vehicle will be a lot
more than $1.50 - and a lot less than the $100 that you pay for a
typical FSM now on an individual basis. But at least now, that moderate
per-unit cost is not being forced on those who have no desire or use for
it. It is being borne by those who both want it and are getting value
for what they are paying. Mandate it with every car, and the person who
can't even spell FSM will be forced to pay for something that is useless
to them.

IOW, pass that law, and the person for whom the manual is a useless item
is subsidizing the one who will really use and benefit from it. As it
is now, the total cost is carried by those who are getting something of
value that they, by their freedom of will, are willing to pay for.

One other aspect: The information that the manufacturer puts in the
manual is intellectual property. They can charge big bucks for it or
give it away. The customer has the right to buy the competitor's
product instead if they choose to punish the manufacturer who they think
is gouging them. IOW, if one manufaturer wants $600 or $700 for an FSM,
which some in fact do, and another wants only $92, I can make that a
zero, small, big, or sole factor in my decision on whose product to
purchase. It's called a free-market system.

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
adddress with the letter 'x')
 




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