Does 2003 Shinsen include "sport" supspension?

Grant Edwards wrote:
> On 2009-10-13, Me > wrote:
>
>>>>> Is there an easy way to visually identify sport vs. standard
>>>>> suspension?
>>>> Somebody suggested looking for a sticker on the passenger side
>>>> door sill. 2003s don't seem to have that sticker, so I'm
>>>> still in the dark.
>>> The OEM shocks are black. The sport suspension came with
>>> yellow Bilstein shocks, so this must be the standard
>>> suspension. I think.
>> That sounds correct - Bilsteins are usually yellow. The link
>> you gave also said that the suspension package for the LS only
>> came with 6 speed, so either something's awry with the
>> description, or the car you've got isn't a Shinsen, but
>> perhaps has some extras.
>
> It had Shinsen badges on the fenders, Shinsen floormats,
> Shinsen hats, the Shinsen interior uphostery and trim, Shinsen
> exterior paint color, and Shinsen roof. The window sticker
> said Shinsen. I'm pretty sure it's a Shinsen model.
>
> I believe that the descriptions I've found on the web for
> Shinsens are wrong (at least they don't match up with any of
> the Shinsens I looked at when I bought mine in early 2004). I
> sent corrections to one of the authors of such a feature list
> but was ignored.
>
I believe you. Perhaps someone should edit the Wikipedia site, as the
information on the main page is a bit ambiguous as to Ls and shinsen.

>
>> Unlikely anyone would change a 6 for 5 speed, but people do
>> strange things at times.
>
> I looked at three Shinsens. They all had 5-speed transmissions.
>
>> There /should/ be a sticker on the chassis inside the door
>> panel. If it's not there, it was probably taken off for a
>> reason.
>
> According to my research, Mazda stopped putting those stickers
> in Miatas sometime in 2002. Nobody with a 2003 reports finding
> such a sticker.
>
I didn't realise that they stopped in 02, but yes.
Mazda have a database is at mazda.co.jp, but of course it's password
protected and on a secure server. The local parts counter guy checked
mine, printed it out, and gave me a copy - suggested to keep in the car
as easy reference if I need parts. That detailed options for trans,
diff, suspension as well as SE/LE trim packages, and also listed deleted
options - ie "W/O 10th-Anniv" for my '98 car.
They look up using VIN, so I guess they could do this if anyone was
looking at a used car, and wanted confirmation of factory options
fitted. Get the VIN, and head down to Mazda. A new NC was parked right
next to the parts counter - damn it - I want reasons not to like them,
and couldn't find any there...

I got my '03 Shinsen a couple years ago, and like you have found there
is a lot of conflicting info on the internet regarding its specs. But
mine is definitely a 5-speed, unless you count reverse. My shocks are
not yellow, either, nor do I have any sort of "sport" identifier on
the door jam sticker, and I've assumed the car doesn't have the sport
suspension. I think the main thing about the Shinsen is its
distinctive look, but there is not much performance-related difference
over the base model. At least one website does say it has a limited
slip iirc, I'm still sort of wondering about this.

With ~43K miles on the clock I've been looking at my shock options,
too – trying to strike a nice balance between streetability, autocross
(which I got into this year), and at some point maybe a few track
days. Thus far I am leaning toward the Konis, with Bilstein maybe the
main other contender, if I can figure out which Bilstein would be
appropriate. I have a vague feeling the Konis may be the most
versatile for covering my needs right now.

Eric

wrote:
> I got my '03 Shinsen a couple years ago, and like you have found there
> is a lot of conflicting info on the internet regarding its specs. But
> mine is definitely a 5-speed, unless you count reverse. My shocks are
> not yellow, either, nor do I have any sort of "sport" identifier on
> the door jam sticker, and I've assumed the car doesn't have the sport
> suspension. I think the main thing about the Shinsen is its
> distinctive look, but there is not much performance-related difference
> over the base model. At least one website does say it has a limited
> slip iirc, I'm still sort of wondering about this.
>
As per my other post, that /should/ show up on a VIN # search of the
Mazda database that your Mazda dealer can access.
If you've got a door jamb sticker, mine (NB8a) shows LSD identified as
Drive : Type 2. But not sure if that applies to US models, or later NBs.
>
>
> With ~43K miles on the clock I've been looking at my shock options,
> too – trying to strike a nice balance between streetability, autocross
> (which I got into this year), and at some point maybe a few track
> days. Thus far I am leaning toward the Konis, with Bilstein maybe the
> main other contender, if I can figure out which Bilstein would be
> appropriate. I have a vague feeling the Konis may be the most
> versatile for covering my needs right now.
>
> Eric

Mr. Me, I'm confused as to why you would call your car a '98. My
understanding is that (at least in the US) there were no '98's. Enlighten
me.

Chris
99BBB

"Me" > wrote in message
...
> Grant Edwards wrote:
>> On 2009-10-13, Me > wrote:
>>
>>>>>> Is there an easy way to visually identify sport vs. standard
>>>>>> suspension?
>>>>> Somebody suggested looking for a sticker on the passenger side
>>>>> door sill. 2003s don't seem to have that sticker, so I'm
>>>>> still in the dark.
>>>> The OEM shocks are black. The sport suspension came with
>>>> yellow Bilstein shocks, so this must be the standard
>>>> suspension. I think.
>>> That sounds correct - Bilsteins are usually yellow. The link
>>> you gave also said that the suspension package for the LS only
>>> came with 6 speed, so either something's awry with the
>>> description, or the car you've got isn't a Shinsen, but
>>> perhaps has some extras.
>>
>> It had Shinsen badges on the fenders, Shinsen floormats,
>> Shinsen hats, the Shinsen interior uphostery and trim, Shinsen
>> exterior paint color, and Shinsen roof. The window sticker
>> said Shinsen. I'm pretty sure it's a Shinsen model.
>>
>> I believe that the descriptions I've found on the web for
>> Shinsens are wrong (at least they don't match up with any of
>> the Shinsens I looked at when I bought mine in early 2004). I
>> sent corrections to one of the authors of such a feature list
>> but was ignored.
>>
> I believe you. Perhaps someone should edit the Wikipedia site, as the
> information on the main page is a bit ambiguous as to Ls and shinsen.
>
> >
>>> Unlikely anyone would change a 6 for 5 speed, but people do
>>> strange things at times.
>>
>> I looked at three Shinsens. They all had 5-speed transmissions.
>>
>>> There /should/ be a sticker on the chassis inside the door
>>> panel. If it's not there, it was probably taken off for a
>>> reason.
>>
>> According to my research, Mazda stopped putting those stickers
>> in Miatas sometime in 2002. Nobody with a 2003 reports finding
>> such a sticker.
>>
> I didn't realise that they stopped in 02, but yes.
> Mazda have a database is at mazda.co.jp, but of course it's password
> protected and on a secure server. The local parts counter guy checked
> mine, printed it out, and gave me a copy - suggested to keep in the car as
> easy reference if I need parts. That detailed options for trans, diff,
> suspension as well as SE/LE trim packages, and also listed deleted
> options - ie "W/O 10th-Anniv" for my '98 car.
> They look up using VIN, so I guess they could do this if anyone was
> looking at a used car, and wanted confirmation of factory options fitted.
> Get the VIN, and head down to Mazda. A new NC was parked right next to
> the parts counter - damn it - I want reasons not to like them, and
> couldn't find any there...

Eric, if your suspension is a 'non-sport' version, I want to put in a good
word for the KYB AGX adjustables. IIRC the Koni's are not easy to adjust and
the KYB's definitely are. It's nice to be able to go softer on the road and
firm it up when it's time to get serious. I ended up putting the MSM springs
and shocks on my 99 and while I think it's the perfect 'all around' set up,
my wife isn't very happy riding in the car and that effects my time in the
car and that's a BAD THING!

Good luck and update us when / if you change up.

Chris
99BBB

> wrote in message
...

I got my '03 Shinsen a couple years ago, and like you have found there
is a lot of conflicting info on the internet regarding its specs. But
mine is definitely a 5-speed, unless you count reverse. My shocks are
not yellow, either, nor do I have any sort of "sport" identifier on
the door jam sticker, and I've assumed the car doesn't have the sport
suspension. I think the main thing about the Shinsen is its
distinctive look, but there is not much performance-related difference
over the base model. At least one website does say it has a limited
slip iirc, I'm still sort of wondering about this.

With ~43K miles on the clock I've been looking at my shock options,
too – trying to strike a nice balance between streetability, autocross
(which I got into this year), and at some point maybe a few track
days. Thus far I am leaning toward the Konis, with Bilstein maybe the
main other contender, if I can figure out which Bilstein would be
appropriate. I have a vague feeling the Konis may be the most
versatile for covering my needs right now.

Eric

On 2009-10-14, Me > wrote:
> wrote:

>> I got my '03 Shinsen a couple years ago, and like you have
>> found there is a lot of conflicting info on the internet
>> regarding its specs. But mine is definitely a 5-speed, unless
>> you count reverse. My shocks are not yellow, either, nor do I
>> have any sort of "sport" identifier on the door jam sticker,
>> and I've assumed the car doesn't have the sport suspension. I
>> think the main thing about the Shinsen is its distinctive
>> look, but there is not much performance-related difference
>> over the base model. At least one website does say it has a
>> limited slip iirc, I'm still sort of wondering about this.

I've found similar mentions of an LSD on various sites, but I
don't think mine has one based on observations of behavior on
ice/snow: park with one wheel on ice and the other on cement,
and it will quite happily spin the wheel that's on ice.

I don't know where people get all of the misinformation they
post, but there seems to be a lot of it -- and they won't even
deign to correct it when provided with the facts.

> As per my other post, that /should/ show up on a VIN # search
> of the Mazda database that your Mazda dealer can access.

My Mazda dealer's service department has never proven to be
competent in the past. In my 6 or 7 dealings with them they've
botched something every time -- on one occasion they lied about
it in an attempt to avoid correcting things. If they did
manage to access the database, I wouldn't trust them to come up
with the right answer.

> If you've got a door jamb sticker, mine (NB8a) shows LSD
> identified as Drive: Type 2. But not sure if that applies to
> US models, or later NBs.

As we've already established, Mazda stopped putting such
stickers in Miatas sometime in 2002. 2003 models do not have
such stickers.

>> With ~43K miles on the clock I've been looking at my shock
>> options, too? trying to strike a nice balance between
>> streetability, autocross (which I got into this year), and at
>> some point maybe a few track days. Thus far I am leaning
>> toward the Konis, with Bilstein maybe the main other
>> contender, if I can figure out which Bilstein would be
>> appropriate. I have a vague feeling the Konis may be the most
>> versatile for covering my needs right now.

I put KYB AGX adjustable shocks in my NA a few years back and
liked them. I'm leaning towards another set of AGX shocks for
the Shinsen. They would allow one to have different damping
for street, autocross, and track. The AGX's for NAs had 8
settings -- the ones for NBs have 4.

This time I think I'll pay somebody else to do the work.

--
Grant

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 17:38:14 -0500, Chris D'Agnolo wrote:

> Eric, if your suspension is a 'non-sport' version, I want to put in a
> good word for the KYB AGX adjustables. IIRC the Koni's are not easy to
> adjust and the KYB's definitely are. It's nice to be able to go softer
> on the road and firm it up when it's time to get serious. I ended up
> putting the MSM springs and shocks on my 99 and while I think it's the
> perfect 'all around' set up, my wife isn't very happy riding in the
> car and that effects my time in the car and that's a BAD THING!

That's interesting. I have an MSM so presumably MSM springs and shocks
as well. To me the handling is too soft, with too much body roll.
Finances preclude any changes for the time being, but at some point I
would like to firm things up a notch or two without destroying the ride.
And I'm really not sure what I should upgrade, cost/benefit wise.

On Oct 12, 3:18*pm, Grant Edwards > wrote:
> I'm shopping for shocks for my '03 Shinsen, and I'm finding
> conflicting info on whether the Shinsen has the standard
> supsension (which will fit KYB AGX shocks) or the "sport"
> supsension, (which requires different shocks than the standard).
>
> For example, both miatamania.com andhttp://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/5361/03.html
> say that that the Shinsen comes with a 6-speed transmission and
> sport suspension. *Mine came with a 5-speed, so does that mean
> it's _not_ the sport supsension?
>
> Is there an easy way to visually identify sport vs. standard
> suspension?
>
> --
> Grant Edwards * * * * * * * * * grante * * * * * * Yow! My LESLIE GORE record
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * at * * * * * * * is BROKEN ...
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *visi.com * * * * * *

OK Grant, here we go !!! I have 2003 shop manual and on page :
02-14-3 under "Rear Supention" , a section Rear Shock Absorber and
Coil SpringInstallation Note
1. Install the rear shock absorber and coil spring so that the part
number label ( by Showa) or caution label ( by Bilstein) on the shock
absorber faces outside of the vehicle.

I would guess that you could find that info on the shock to tell you
what you have.

Now you can also measure the front brake disk. The Sport ( 16 in.
wheel ) disk will measure 10.6 inches in dia. ** Standard brakes are
10.00 inches ** ALSO, the brake pads do NOT have little springs to
hold the pads apart on the Sport Brakes, Std pads HAVE springs.

Now go under the rear of the car. the "U" shape brace under the
suspension. The 16inch wheel vehicle, have two cross braces more than
the std suspension cars. One is midway at the first joint and the
other one is at the fwd end of the brace.

I could go on and on, but this should give you enough info to tell.
Oh, all of the 2003 LS cars have the Sport Suspension systems.

Bruce

Chris D'Agnolo wrote:
> Mr. Me, I'm confused as to why you would call your car a '98. My
> understanding is that (at least in the US) there were no '98's.
> Enlighten me.
>
Outside the US there were '98 NBs. Mine was made in August 98 for
Japanese domestic market, and imported used to NZ, with about 40,000
miles on the clock. I don't know the date first registered in Japan,
but probably '98 rather than '99.
Model designation is VS SE. VS (V-spec) seems to refer to light tan
interior, leather seats, elect windows/mirrors, Nardi wooden steering
wheel, shifter, and parking brake handle, and tan hood. I think the Na
V-spec models were mainly (all?) BRG, but NB8a seem to come in various
colours. The SE bit specifies special options. My car has 6 speed and
LSD, but otherwise a standard nb8b. (they made nb6a & nb6b 1600s for
Japan and Europe).
It's actually just called a Mazda Roadster, no MX5 or Miata badges.
There are other differences. Japanese Nb8a don't have EGR fitted. The
intake manifold is cast and partly machined for it, but it's not fitted.
(I kind of hope that keeps some heat off my coil packs) The exhaust
manifold in Japan and some markets other than North America is a long
4:2:1 header, the last Y joint about a foot from the cat under the car.
There's also a different intake cam used, apparently the same cam as the
later MSM intake cam. Tacho red line, and limiter are 7500rpm rather
than 7000/7200. There's also no OBDII, and a different ECU is used.

Me > wrote:

> Outside the US there were '98 NBs. Mine was made in August 98 for
> Japanese domestic market, and imported used to NZ, with about 40,000
> miles on the clock. I don't know the date first registered in Japan,
> but probably '98 rather than '99.

Although it won't tell you the date of first Japanese registration this
site will tell you the date of manufacture - just enter the chassis
number

<http://www.japan-partner.com/check-manufacture-year.php>

AFAIK this site ONLY details JDM vehicles, it won't hold info for, say,
an MX5 that was built for the UK or NZ market.

As you know the month of manufacture I suspect that you may already know
of this site, details posted for anyone who doesn't.

--
Rob - Shropshire
So many cats,
So few recipes...