British traffic signal lights

In article ws.net>,
Ted B. > wrote:
>
>"Paul Hirose" > wrote in message
link.net...
>> On TV news footage from London today I noticed something unusual about the
>> traffic lights. A couple times I saw the lights change from red and yellow
>> (both illuminated) to green. I have never seen such a thing here in the
>> States. What does simultaneous red and yellow mean in Britain?
>
>It's the opposite of a yellow light in the US, I believe. In other words,
>it's saying that green is coming soon. Keep in mind that most cars over
>there are supposedly manual transmissions, and parking brakes must be set at
>traffic lights. -Dave


I have driven standard transmission cars in the US for the past 22 years
(automatic for only 3) and I cannot recall a single incident when I
needed a "get ready" feature. I have also driven in much of Western
Europe without any need for such an aid. I seriously doubt this was the
motivation. Also, there is no need to engage the parking brake at a light.
If the road is level, just put the car in neutral (as most of us do). If
you are on a slope, stand on a brake (as automatic drivers always do).

If you have trouble getting into gear at a traffic light, you have serious
problems when you need to moved into second gear!


--

Surendar Jeyadev

The 1 in the email address is fake

In article >,
Pooh Bear > wrote:
>
>
>Jan Kalin wrote:
>
>> Uhm, the middle pedal is the brake pedal. It doesn't stop working on inclined
>> surfaces...
>
>Fine - you bring the vehicle to a halt using the footbrake.
>
>To drive off in a vehicle with manual transmission you need to use the accelerator and
>clutch.
>
>If you know of a way of holding the car braked on a hill whilst using the accelerator
>and clutch that doesn't involve 3 feet please let me know !

Surely you must have heard of "heel and toe". Read about it in Pat Moss's
(Stirling's daughter) book "The Art and Technique of Driving" (1965) a long
time before I ever drove. It was one of the first "tricks" I learnt.

>Any intelligent person sets the handbrake on a hill after coming to a halt. Thereafter
>you don't need to use the brake pedal.

Yes. Might as well use it if it is there .........

--

Surendar Jeyadev

The 1 in the email address is fake

> > How are you going to do that, lacking the proper skills to use the
clutch
> > and accelerator pedal effectively?
>
> Again, nice try, very slick, but you're shifting the topic. You did NOT
> posit that it's necessary to have the proper skills to "use the clutch and
> accelerator pedal effectively". You posited that "One of the first things
> any manual tranny driver -should- learn is how to hold a car steady on an
> incline using JUST the clutch and accelerator."

YES, and if you can't do that, then you don't know how to use the clutch and
accelerator properly. Any driver knows that, So I'm shocked that anyone
would argue the point. -Dave

"Daniel J. Stern" wrote:

> On Tue, 26 Jul 2005, Ted B. wrote:
>
> > > Well, gee, what I do next is keep my foot on the brake (or, if I'm in
> > > the UK, apply the handbrake) until the light turns green, at which
> > > point I drive off.
> > >
> > > Nice try, but you specifically started this subtopic of *HOLDING* the
> > > car on a grade using only the clutch and accelerator, and now you're
> > > going to have to see it through.
>
> > How are you going to do that, lacking the proper skills to use the clutch
> > and accelerator pedal effectively?
>
> Again, nice try, very slick, but you're shifting the topic. You did NOT
> posit that it's necessary to have the proper skills to "use the clutch and
> accelerator pedal effectively". You posited that "One of the first things
> any manual tranny driver -should- learn is how to hold a car steady on an
> incline using JUST the clutch and accelerator." It was then pointed out to
> you that holding a car steady on an incline using the clutch and
> accelerator is very poor practice, which you acknowledged.
>
> That being the case, your shift of the argument from "All drivers should
> know how to hold a car steady on an incline using just the clutch and
> accelerator" to "All drivers should know how to use the clutch and
> accelerator effectively" is disingenuous.
>
> Care to try again? Or shall we just send a runner down to the hardware
> store for some paint remover so you can get out of that corner?

Spot on and nicely put ! ;-)

Graham

Surendar Jeyadev wrote:

> In article >,
> Pooh Bear > wrote:
>
>
> >Jan Kalin wrote:
> >
> >> Uhm, the middle pedal is the brake pedal. It doesn't stop working on inclined
> >> surfaces...
> >
> >Fine - you bring the vehicle to a halt using the footbrake.
> >
> >To drive off in a vehicle with manual transmission you need to use the accelerator and
> >clutch.
> >
> >If you know of a way of holding the car braked on a hill whilst using the accelerator
> >and clutch that doesn't involve 3 feet please let me know !
>
> Surely you must have heard of "heel and toe". Read about it in Pat Moss's
> (Stirling's daughter) book "The Art and Technique of Driving" (1965) a long
> time before I ever drove. It was one of the first "tricks" I learnt.

I've heard of it but never used it. A rallying technique as much as anything IIRC. I can't
imagine it being very practical for everyday road use in bsy ftraffic though.


> >Any intelligent person sets the handbrake on a hill after coming to a halt. Thereafter
> >you don't need to use the brake pedal.
>
> Yes. Might as well use it if it is there .........

Absolutely.

If you fancy a real test of ability try driving a car with a non-functioning clutch ! It's
do-able ( just ).

Graham

Garth Almgren wrote:

> Though I can see the reasoning for using the handbrake for every stop,
> Americans simply aren't taught to do so (if they're even /taught/ to
> drive a stick at all!). Even if they were taught to do so, most are too
> lazy to do it every time.

I used to not do it at all. Now I do it almost every single time. I am
coordinated enough to do a hill start without rolling back more than a
few inches at most, but with the parking brake, I don't go back at all.
I also can start faster since I don't have to deal with the small
degree of velocity in the opposite direction that I want to travel.

Pooh Bear wrote:
> Surendar Jeyadev wrote:
>
> > In article >,
> > Pooh Bear > wrote:
> >
> >
> > >Jan Kalin wrote:
> > >
> > >> Uhm, the middle pedal is the brake pedal. It doesn't stop working on inclined
> > >> surfaces...
> > >
> > >Fine - you bring the vehicle to a halt using the footbrake.
> > >
> > >To drive off in a vehicle with manual transmission you need to use the accelerator and
> > >clutch.
> > >
> > >If you know of a way of holding the car braked on a hill whilst using the accelerator
> > >and clutch that doesn't involve 3 feet please let me know !
> >
> > Surely you must have heard of "heel and toe". Read about it in Pat Moss's
> > (Stirling's daughter) book "The Art and Technique of Driving" (1965) a long
> > time before I ever drove. It was one of the first "tricks" I learnt.
>
> I've heard of it but never used it. A rallying technique as much as anything IIRC. I can't
> imagine it being very practical for everyday road use in bsy ftraffic though.
>
>
> > >Any intelligent person sets the handbrake on a hill after coming to a halt. Thereafter
> > >you don't need to use the brake pedal.
> >
> > Yes. Might as well use it if it is there .........
>
> Absolutely.
>
> If you fancy a real test of ability try driving a car with a non-functioning clutch ! It's
> do-able ( just ).
>
> Graham

Not "just". It only takes some practice of rev matching. The only
real problem is getting the vehicle moving from a dead stop.

Harry K

"Harry K" > wrote in
ups.com:

>
>
> Pooh Bear wrote:
>>
>> If you fancy a real test of ability try driving a car with a
>> non-functioning clutch ! It's do-able ( just ).
>>
>> Graham
>
> Not "just". It only takes some practice of rev matching. The only
> real problem is getting the vehicle moving from a dead stop.
>
> Harry K
>
>

Floating gears is the way truckers do it. After starting up, no more use
for a clutch.

Doug

On Tue, 26 Jul 2005, Dave C. wrote:

> > Again, nice try, very slick, but you're shifting the topic. You did
> > NOT posit that it's necessary to have the proper skills to "use the
> > clutch and accelerator pedal effectively". You posited that "One of
> > the first things any manual tranny driver -should- learn is how to
> > hold a car steady on an incline using JUST the clutch and
> > accelerator."

> YES, and if you can't do that, then you don't know how to use the clutch
> and accelerator properly.

Since holding the car steady on an incline using just the clutch and
accelerator is uniformly acknowledged as poor practice, knowing how to do
so is, *prima facie*, not part of knowing how to use the clutch and
accelerator properly.

> I'm shocked that anyone would argue the point.

There's a surprise...

Harry K wrote:

> Pooh Bear wrote:
>
> > If you fancy a real test of ability try driving a car with a non-functioning clutch ! It's
> > do-able ( just ).
> >
> > Graham
>
> Not "just". It only takes some practice of rev matching. The only
> real problem is getting the vehicle moving from a dead stop.
>
> Harry K

The only way I know is cranking in 1st gear ! Yeah, cringe, but it works. I once spent the best
part of an afternoon driving like that until I found a shop that could fit a new cable that same
day. Funny thing is - they were a Ford franchise but I had a GM car. Apparently they liked
working on my car for a change ! They also charged less than the GM franchise wanted !

Graham