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#1
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Annoying intermittant power loss
Okay, this is really starting to bug me... this is the third '87 Accord
in a row now that's had this problem (all carbed, first had A/C and P/S, second P/S and non-working A/C, latest has neither. My first one was running great, really peppy, until I had a "fuel system service" done, and after that it seemed sluggish. Both of the subsequent cars have had the same issue: sometimes they're just "oomph-less" - bog down off the line, punching the gas accelerates only slowly, and pushing the clutch in for an upshift results in an immediate feeling of deceleration, almost as if something was dragging. And then for no apparent reason, often after idling for a couple minutes, like at a long stop light, the power is just there - sharp off the line, hitting the gas at cruise puts you back in the seat at just about any speed/RPM, and it keeps coasting smoothly when the clutch is lowered. I'd almost suspect a fuel delivery or ignition timing issue if it weren't for that "dragging" issue. I don't think it's the brakes; if they were sticking that badly they should be heating up as well, and they're not. Anyone got any thoughts? --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0604-1, 01/24/2006 Tested on: 1/25/2006 10:14:17 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
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#2
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Annoying intermittant power loss
I suggest you reconsider dismissing your idea of dragging brakes.
Sounds right to me. Next time this phenomenon occurs... I would wait until it happens several times and then pull over... and go around and feel all four brake rotors. Obviously you'd be looking for one (or more) that is hotter than the others. You certainly could have a caliper that is not releasing properly. I have seen this happen intermittently on more than several occations. Just a thought... Professor www.telstar-electronics.com |
#3
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Annoying intermittant power loss
"Matt Ion" > wrote in message news:dePBf.444555$ki.201021@pd7tw2no... > Okay, this is really starting to bug me... this is the third '87 Accord > in a row now that's had this problem (all carbed, first had A/C and P/S, > second P/S and non-working A/C, latest has neither. > > My first one was running great, really peppy, until I had a "fuel system > service" done, and after that it seemed sluggish. Both of the > subsequent cars have had the same issue: sometimes they're just > "oomph-less" - bog down off the line, punching the gas accelerates only > slowly, and pushing the clutch in for an upshift results in an immediate > feeling of deceleration, almost as if something was dragging. > > And then for no apparent reason, often after idling for a couple > minutes, like at a long stop light, the power is just there - sharp off > the line, hitting the gas at cruise puts you back in the seat at just > about any speed/RPM, and it keeps coasting smoothly when the clutch is > lowered. > > I'd almost suspect a fuel delivery or ignition timing issue if it > weren't for that "dragging" issue. I don't think it's the brakes; if > they were sticking that badly they should be heating up as well, and > they're not. > > Anyone got any thoughts? > > > --- > avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. > Virus Database (VPS): 0604-1, 01/24/2006 > Tested on: 1/25/2006 10:14:17 AM > avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. > http://www.avast.com > > > Had a sluggish loss in power and loss of fire problem. All would be well after a restart. Problem turned out to be an intermittently clogged (nut & bolt catcher) screen at the fuel pump (tank) inlet. Replacing the pump/screen--all one unit at the time, fixed the problem. MLD |
#4
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Annoying intermittant power loss
MLD wrote:
> "Matt Ion" > wrote in message > news:dePBf.444555$ki.201021@pd7tw2no... > >>Okay, this is really starting to bug me... this is the third '87 Accord >>in a row now that's had this problem (all carbed, first had A/C and P/S, >>second P/S and non-working A/C, latest has neither. >> >>My first one was running great, really peppy, until I had a "fuel system >>service" done, and after that it seemed sluggish. Both of the >>subsequent cars have had the same issue: sometimes they're just >>"oomph-less" - bog down off the line, punching the gas accelerates only >>slowly, and pushing the clutch in for an upshift results in an immediate >>feeling of deceleration, almost as if something was dragging. >> >>And then for no apparent reason, often after idling for a couple >>minutes, like at a long stop light, the power is just there - sharp off >>the line, hitting the gas at cruise puts you back in the seat at just >>about any speed/RPM, and it keeps coasting smoothly when the clutch is >>lowered. >> >>I'd almost suspect a fuel delivery or ignition timing issue if it >>weren't for that "dragging" issue. I don't think it's the brakes; if >>they were sticking that badly they should be heating up as well, and >>they're not. >> >>Anyone got any thoughts? >> >> >>--- >>avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. >>Virus Database (VPS): 0604-1, 01/24/2006 >>Tested on: 1/25/2006 10:14:17 AM >>avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. >>http://www.avast.com >> >> >> > > Had a sluggish loss in power and loss of fire problem. All would be well > after a restart. Problem turned out to be an intermittently clogged (nut & > bolt catcher) screen at the fuel pump (tank) inlet. Replacing the > pump/screen--all one unit at the time, fixed the problem. > MLD Yeah, but on three different cars? Besides, being carbed, a clogged intake filter shouldn't affect it in this way. In normal running it feeds off the float bowl; performance doesn't rely on constant pressure. --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0604-2, 01/25/2006 Tested on: 1/25/2006 4:07:21 PM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#5
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Annoying intermittant power loss
Professor wrote:
> I suggest you reconsider dismissing your idea of dragging brakes. > Sounds right to me. Next time this phenomenon occurs... I would wait > until it happens several times and then pull over... and go around and > feel all four brake rotors. Obviously you'd be looking for one (or > more) that is hotter than the others. You certainly could have a > caliper that is not releasing properly. I have seen this happen > intermittently on more than several occations. Just a thought... Well... or sticky shoes on the back (drum brakes). I guess ideally I need to whip the thing up on a jack and make sure everything spins freely. --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0604-2, 01/25/2006 Tested on: 1/25/2006 4:08:36 PM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#6
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Annoying intermittant power loss
"Matt Ion" > wrote in message news:epUBf.220802$tl.14061@pd7tw3no... > MLD wrote: > > "Matt Ion" > wrote in message > > news:dePBf.444555$ki.201021@pd7tw2no... > > > >>Okay, this is really starting to bug me... this is the third '87 Accord > >>in a row now that's had this problem (all carbed, first had A/C and P/S, > >>second P/S and non-working A/C, latest has neither. > >> > >>My first one was running great, really peppy, until I had a "fuel system > >>service" done, and after that it seemed sluggish. Both of the > >>subsequent cars have had the same issue: sometimes they're just > >>"oomph-less" - bog down off the line, punching the gas accelerates only > >>slowly, and pushing the clutch in for an upshift results in an immediate > >>feeling of deceleration, almost as if something was dragging. > >> > >>And then for no apparent reason, often after idling for a couple > >>minutes, like at a long stop light, the power is just there - sharp off > >>the line, hitting the gas at cruise puts you back in the seat at just > >>about any speed/RPM, and it keeps coasting smoothly when the clutch is > >>lowered. > >> > >>I'd almost suspect a fuel delivery or ignition timing issue if it > >>weren't for that "dragging" issue. I don't think it's the brakes; if > >>they were sticking that badly they should be heating up as well, and > >>they're not. > >> > >>Anyone got any thoughts? > >> > >> > >>--- > >>avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. > >>Virus Database (VPS): 0604-1, 01/24/2006 > >>Tested on: 1/25/2006 10:14:17 AM > >>avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. > >>http://www.avast.com > >> > >> > >> > > > > Had a sluggish loss in power and loss of fire problem. All would be well > > after a restart. Problem turned out to be an intermittently clogged (nut & > > bolt catcher) screen at the fuel pump (tank) inlet. Replacing the > > pump/screen--all one unit at the time, fixed the problem. > > MLD > > Yeah, but on three different cars? > > Besides, being carbed, a clogged intake filter shouldn't affect it in > this way. In normal running it feeds off the float bowl; performance > doesn't rely on constant pressure. > I agree that to happen on three (of your) cars seems unlikely and unusual--having said that "why do you think that auto companies have recalls? If you have a design problem eventually it will begins to show up in the field. In my case (and maybe or maybe not) your case it takes a long time for a screen to rust and clog to the point where it can intermittently effect fuel flow. If you saw what came out of my gas tank you wouldn't believe that it was a fuel filter. Have you considered looking at and/or changing the fuel filter that feeds the carb in the engine compartment? With respect to your comment re-fuel bowl---- if it is a fuel delivery problem maybe the float bowl is not getting filled with fuel, runs dry and when stopped has a chance to refill? Just throwing out some comments-- MLD |
#7
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Annoying intermittant power loss
Matt
Had a similar problem with an '85 carburated, so here is one more idea(long-shot). Is there(or should be) a snorkel hose from the exahust manifold to the air cleaner in the '87?. If so make sure it's intact and in place, and that the blend air door in the air cleaner operates. in the '85 I had, the linkage form the blend door vacuum motor to the door got disconnected resulting in loss of power especially on humid days. |
#8
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Annoying intermittant power loss
MLD wrote:
> "Matt Ion" > wrote in message > news:epUBf.220802$tl.14061@pd7tw3no... > >>MLD wrote: >> >>>"Matt Ion" > wrote in message >>>news:dePBf.444555$ki.201021@pd7tw2no... >>> >>> >>>>Okay, this is really starting to bug me... this is the third '87 Accord >>>>in a row now that's had this problem (all carbed, first had A/C and P/S, >>>>second P/S and non-working A/C, latest has neither. >>>> >>>>My first one was running great, really peppy, until I had a "fuel system >>>>service" done, and after that it seemed sluggish. Both of the >>>>subsequent cars have had the same issue: sometimes they're just >>>>"oomph-less" - bog down off the line, punching the gas accelerates only >>>>slowly, and pushing the clutch in for an upshift results in an immediate >>>>feeling of deceleration, almost as if something was dragging. >>>> >>>>And then for no apparent reason, often after idling for a couple >>>>minutes, like at a long stop light, the power is just there - sharp off >>>>the line, hitting the gas at cruise puts you back in the seat at just >>>>about any speed/RPM, and it keeps coasting smoothly when the clutch is >>>>lowered. >>>> >>>>I'd almost suspect a fuel delivery or ignition timing issue if it >>>>weren't for that "dragging" issue. I don't think it's the brakes; if >>>>they were sticking that badly they should be heating up as well, and >>>>they're not. >>>> >>>>Anyone got any thoughts? >>>> >>>> >>>>--- >>>>avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. >>>>Virus Database (VPS): 0604-1, 01/24/2006 >>>>Tested on: 1/25/2006 10:14:17 AM >>>>avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. >>>>http://www.avast.com >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>>Had a sluggish loss in power and loss of fire problem. All would be > > well > >>>after a restart. Problem turned out to be an intermittently clogged > > (nut & > >>>bolt catcher) screen at the fuel pump (tank) inlet. Replacing the >>>pump/screen--all one unit at the time, fixed the problem. >>>MLD >> >>Yeah, but on three different cars? >> >>Besides, being carbed, a clogged intake filter shouldn't affect it in >>this way. In normal running it feeds off the float bowl; performance >>doesn't rely on constant pressure. >> > > > I agree that to happen on three (of your) cars seems unlikely and > unusual--having said that "why do you think that auto companies have > recalls? If you have a design problem eventually it will begins to show up > in the field. The only recalls on this car are for the fuel filler tube rusting out, and the seatbelt buckles having broken plastic bits. If there were going to be a recall on this, it should have been issued a long time ago on a 20-year-old design. > In my case (and maybe or maybe not) your case it takes a long > time for a screen to rust and clog to the point where it can intermittently > effect fuel flow. If you saw what came out of my gas tank you wouldn't > believe that it was a fuel filter. Have you considered looking at and/or > changing the fuel filter that feeds the carb in the engine compartment? > With respect to your comment re-fuel bowl---- if it is a fuel delivery > problem maybe the float bowl is not getting filled with fuel, runs dry and > when stopped has a chance to refill? Nope. Low fuel flow and the float bowl not refilling would more likely manifest as sputtering and dropouts at high rpms. It doesn't do that at all - it's just an overall lost of acceleration power across the band. --- avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 0604-3, 01/26/2006 Tested on: 1/26/2006 9:25:07 AM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. http://www.avast.com |
#10
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Annoying intermittant power loss
For the heck of it I Goggled "intermittent power loss Honda". Got lots of
hits with many interesting reasons and causes. Some fuel pumps, rusted fuel filter, electrical (wires/plugs) etc. among them. A very hard one to find turned out to be the oxygen sensor. Quote from the write-up "Three days after the car first rolled in the shop, the problem was finally solved with a simple oxygen sensor replacement. Those darn intermittent." Suggest you try this path, might find your exact problem or at least something that will lead you to the solution. MLD "Matt Ion" > wrote in message news:aC7Cf.224771$tl.120433@pd7tw3no... > MLD wrote: > > "Matt Ion" > wrote in message > > news:epUBf.220802$tl.14061@pd7tw3no... > > > >>MLD wrote: > >> > >>>"Matt Ion" > wrote in message > >>>news:dePBf.444555$ki.201021@pd7tw2no... > >>> > >>> > >>>>Okay, this is really starting to bug me... this is the third '87 Accord > >>>>in a row now that's had this problem (all carbed, first had A/C and P/S, > >>>>second P/S and non-working A/C, latest has neither. > >>>> > >>>>My first one was running great, really peppy, until I had a "fuel system > >>>>service" done, and after that it seemed sluggish. Both of the > >>>>subsequent cars have had the same issue: sometimes they're just > >>>>"oomph-less" - bog down off the line, punching the gas accelerates only > >>>>slowly, and pushing the clutch in for an upshift results in an immediate > >>>>feeling of deceleration, almost as if something was dragging. > >>>> > >>>>And then for no apparent reason, often after idling for a couple > >>>>minutes, like at a long stop light, the power is just there - sharp off > >>>>the line, hitting the gas at cruise puts you back in the seat at just > >>>>about any speed/RPM, and it keeps coasting smoothly when the clutch is > >>>>lowered. > >>>> > >>>>I'd almost suspect a fuel delivery or ignition timing issue if it > >>>>weren't for that "dragging" issue. I don't think it's the brakes; if > >>>>they were sticking that badly they should be heating up as well, and > >>>>they're not. > >>>> > >>>>Anyone got any thoughts? > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>--- > >>>>avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. > >>>>Virus Database (VPS): 0604-1, 01/24/2006 > >>>>Tested on: 1/25/2006 10:14:17 AM > >>>>avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. > >>>>http://www.avast.com > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>Had a sluggish loss in power and loss of fire problem. All would be > > > > well > > > >>>after a restart. Problem turned out to be an intermittently clogged > > > > (nut & > > > >>>bolt catcher) screen at the fuel pump (tank) inlet. Replacing the > >>>pump/screen--all one unit at the time, fixed the problem. > >>>MLD > >> > >>Yeah, but on three different cars? > >> > >>Besides, being carbed, a clogged intake filter shouldn't affect it in > >>this way. In normal running it feeds off the float bowl; performance > >>doesn't rely on constant pressure. > >> > > > > > > I agree that to happen on three (of your) cars seems unlikely and > > unusual--having said that "why do you think that auto companies have > > recalls? If you have a design problem eventually it will begins to show up > > in the field. > > The only recalls on this car are for the fuel filler tube rusting out, > and the seatbelt buckles having broken plastic bits. If there were > going to be a recall on this, it should have been issued a long time ago > on a 20-year-old design. > > > In my case (and maybe or maybe not) your case it takes a long > > time for a screen to rust and clog to the point where it can intermittently > > effect fuel flow. If you saw what came out of my gas tank you wouldn't > > believe that it was a fuel filter. Have you considered looking at and/or > > changing the fuel filter that feeds the carb in the engine compartment? > > With respect to your comment re-fuel bowl---- if it is a fuel delivery > > problem maybe the float bowl is not getting filled with fuel, runs dry and > > when stopped has a chance to refill? > > Nope. Low fuel flow and the float bowl not refilling would more likely > manifest as sputtering and dropouts at high rpms. It doesn't do that at > all - it's just an overall lost of acceleration power across the band. > > > --- > avast! Antivirus: Outbound message clean. > Virus Database (VPS): 0604-3, 01/26/2006 > Tested on: 1/26/2006 9:25:07 AM > avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2005 ALWIL Software. > http://www.avast.com > > > |
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