Owner can set off sudden acceleration in a Toyota (Don't try this athome!)

"David Z" > wrote in message
...

> I'm not confident that Toyota has "found the problem" and "designed the
> fix" in a couple of days. The pressure they are under is more conducive
> to getting it "right away" rather than getting it right.


********
We will see. I heard an interview with a dealership owner and Avalon driver
today
and he was asked point blank if he were certain this will be a fix. What
else could
he say but "yes". He had never had an issue with his Avalon.

Neither have I .

I am going to assume that this WILL be a fix, but I will not forget how to
shift to
neutral, brake, and punch the button.

"hls" > wrote in message
...
>
> "David Z" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>> I'm not confident that Toyota has "found the problem" and "designed the
>> fix" in a couple of days. The pressure they are under is more conducive
>> to getting it "right away" rather than getting it right.
>
>
> ********
> We will see. I heard an interview with a dealership owner and Avalon
> driver today
> and he was asked point blank if he were certain this will be a fix. What
> else could
> he say but "yes". He had never had an issue with his Avalon.
>
> Neither have I .
>
> I am going to assume that this WILL be a fix, but I will not forget how to
> shift to
> neutral, brake, and punch the button.

That's another unanswered question I have. I can understand that the patrol
officer was unaware that you need to hold the start button down for at least
3 seconds to shut the engine off. But how could he, or any of the other 3
(?) people in the car, not know how to shift the car into neutral?

Also, you snipped and ignored my main question -- why isn't the ES350
included in the recall since it was an ES350 that initially publicized this
problem?

David Z wrote:
> "hls" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "David Z" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>> I'm not confident that Toyota has "found the problem" and "designed the
>>> fix" in a couple of days. The pressure they are under is more conducive
>>> to getting it "right away" rather than getting it right.
>>
>> ********
>> We will see. I heard an interview with a dealership owner and Avalon
>> driver today
>> and he was asked point blank if he were certain this will be a fix. What
>> else could
>> he say but "yes". He had never had an issue with his Avalon.
>>
>> Neither have I .
>>
>> I am going to assume that this WILL be a fix, but I will not forget how to
>> shift to
>> neutral, brake, and punch the button.
>
> That's another unanswered question I have. I can understand that the patrol
> officer was unaware that you need to hold the start button down for at least
> 3 seconds to shut the engine off. But how could he, or any of the other 3
> (?) people in the car, not know how to shift the car into neutral?
>
> Also, you snipped and ignored my main question -- why isn't the ES350
> included in the recall since it was an ES350 that initially publicized this
> problem?

it had a different cause of sticking accelerator: The rug. IT was
covered by a different recall.

"David Z" > wrote in message
...
> "Jeff Strickland" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Ad absurdum per aspera" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>>
>>> Meanwhile, NHTSA is looking at (not jumping to conclusions about,
>>> just looking at) electronic reasons for these accidents, even as the
>>> field efforts focus upon floor mats and mechanical-advantage issues
>>> regarding the pedal linkage: http://tinyurl.com/y9x5cg6
>>>
>>
>> I'm not jumping to conclusions either, but I agree that the problem is
>> related to the fly-by-wire gas pedal system more so than to the floor
>> mats. FOR THE RECORD, I don't have one of the affected vehicles, so my
>> opinion and a quarter will get you a free cup of coffee.
>>
>> My gut instinct is that there is a combination of electrical inputs that
>> is creating an error to the logic, the result being that the car is being
>> told to speed up through the computer system somehow.
>>
>> My car -- a '94 BMW -- tells me on occasion that the radio has been
>> stolen, or it has been in a wreck (the emergency flashers turn on for no
>> apparent reason), or the window rolls itself down a half-inch at a time.
>> All of this stuff comes about due to an electrical problem that I've not
>> been able to get my arms around. I can't help but wonder if the
>> fly-by-wire fuel system is being affected by a similar kind of gremlin
>> that works over my BMW from time to time.
>
> I'm not confident that Toyota has "found the problem" and "designed the
> fix" in a couple of days. The pressure they are under is more conducive
> to getting it "right away" rather than getting it right.
>
> There are a lot of unanswered questions in my mind, many of which have
> been discussed here. Here's one question that I haven't seen addressed.
> The original incident that made the news was about a highway patrol
> officer's 911 call in which he was unable to stop a Lexus ES350. Why
> isn't the ES350 included in the recall?
>

There are two different recalls to remedy two different causes for a similar
condition. The first recall was to remedy floor mat entrapment of the
throttle pedal, and the ES350 was recalled under this campaign.

The second recall is to fix the sticking throttle pedal assembly. The ES350
was not included in this campaign because the throttle pedal assembly
supplier is different from the producer for vehicles produced in North
America.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

"dr_jeff" > wrote in message
news
> David Z wrote:
>> "hls" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> "David Z" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>
>>>> I'm not confident that Toyota has "found the problem" and "designed the
>>>> fix" in a couple of days. The pressure they are under is more
>>>> conducive to getting it "right away" rather than getting it right.
>>>
>>> ********
>>> We will see. I heard an interview with a dealership owner and Avalon
>>> driver today
>>> and he was asked point blank if he were certain this will be a fix.
>>> What else could
>>> he say but "yes". He had never had an issue with his Avalon.
>>>
>>> Neither have I .
>>>
>>> I am going to assume that this WILL be a fix, but I will not forget how
>>> to shift to
>>> neutral, brake, and punch the button.
>>
>> That's another unanswered question I have. I can understand that the
>> patrol officer was unaware that you need to hold the start button down
>> for at least 3 seconds to shut the engine off. But how could he, or any
>> of the other 3 (?) people in the car, not know how to shift the car into
>> neutral?
>>
>> Also, you snipped and ignored my main question -- why isn't the ES350
>> included in the recall since it was an ES350 that initially publicized
>> this problem?
>
> it had a different cause of sticking accelerator: The rug. IT was covered
> by a different recall.

That's where I get real skeptical. Are we supposed to believe that these
problems are unrelated? It's possible, but it stretches credulity.

David Z wrote:
> "dr_jeff" > wrote in message
> news
>> David Z wrote:
>>> "hls" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> "David Z" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>
>>>>> I'm not confident that Toyota has "found the problem" and "designed the
>>>>> fix" in a couple of days. The pressure they are under is more
>>>>> conducive to getting it "right away" rather than getting it right.
>>>> ********
>>>> We will see. I heard an interview with a dealership owner and Avalon
>>>> driver today
>>>> and he was asked point blank if he were certain this will be a fix.
>>>> What else could
>>>> he say but "yes". He had never had an issue with his Avalon.
>>>>
>>>> Neither have I .
>>>>
>>>> I am going to assume that this WILL be a fix, but I will not forget how
>>>> to shift to
>>>> neutral, brake, and punch the button.
>>> That's another unanswered question I have. I can understand that the
>>> patrol officer was unaware that you need to hold the start button down
>>> for at least 3 seconds to shut the engine off. But how could he, or any
>>> of the other 3 (?) people in the car, not know how to shift the car into
>>> neutral?
>>>
>>> Also, you snipped and ignored my main question -- why isn't the ES350
>>> included in the recall since it was an ES350 that initially publicized
>>> this problem?
>> it had a different cause of sticking accelerator: The rug. IT was covered
>> by a different recall.
>
> That's where I get real skeptical. Are we supposed to believe that these
> problems are unrelated? It's possible, but it stretches credulity.

It's quite possible. We'll see.

On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 17:37:47 -0500, "David Z" > wrote:

>
>That's another unanswered question I have. I can understand that the patrol
>officer was unaware that you need to hold the start button down for at least
>3 seconds to shut the engine off. But how could he, or any of the other 3
>(?) people in the car, not know how to shift the car into neutral?
>
I think Tegger answered that question. Something about different
shift modes on the shifter. More unnecessary complication.

--Vic

Toyota guy Ray LaHood, at first he said, Park your Toyotas.A few hours
later he said he made a mistatement.What he had meant to say was take
your Toyota to the dealer, they have the parts to fix it.

I saw on local tv news today, Chevrolet/Toyota dealership around here,
they are getting the parts and are staying open late, working overtime
to fix peoples Toyotas.
cuhulin

"Vic Smith" > wrote in message
news
> On Wed, 3 Feb 2010 17:37:47 -0500, "David Z" > wrote:
>
>>
>>That's another unanswered question I have. I can understand that the
>>patrol
>>officer was unaware that you need to hold the start button down for at
>>least
>>3 seconds to shut the engine off. But how could he, or any of the other 3
>>(?) people in the car, not know how to shift the car into neutral?
>>
> I think Tegger answered that question. Something about different
> shift modes on the shifter. More unnecessary complication.

What does that mean?

Is he saying that, in some "shift mode," the ES doesn't allow you to shift
from Drive to Neutral? at high speed? What "shift mode" would that be?

On Wed, 03 Feb 2010 17:21:04 -0500, David Z wrote:

>> My car -- a '94 BMW -- tells me on occasion that the radio has been
>> stolen, or it has been in a wreck (the emergency flashers turn on for no
>> apparent reason), or the window rolls itself down a half-inch at a time.
>> All of this stuff comes about due to an electrical problem that I've not
>> been able to get my arms around. I can't help but wonder if the
>> fly-by-wire fuel system is being affected by a similar kind of gremlin
>> that works over my BMW from time to time.
>
> I'm not confident that Toyota has "found the problem" and "designed the
> fix" in a couple of days. The pressure they are under is more conducive
> to getting it "right away" rather than getting it right.


The affected vehicles have pedals made (or supplied through) a US company.
Japanese sourced vehicles have not exhibited the problem.

ALWAYS buy a "J" VIN Toyota!