Echo vs Corolla Fuel Economy, the truth?

Dear All;

Anyone knows the truth about fuel economy of new Corolla vs Echo hatchback?

Corolla is 20% heavier than Echo hatchback.
Corolla has 20% more peak horspower than Echo hatchback.
Corolla has 20% larger engine displacement than Echo hatchback.

Yet, Corolla has only 6% higher city fuel consumption, according to Industry
Canada.
Yet, Corolla has only 2% higher highway fuel consumption, according to
Industry Canada.

Any ideas?

Free energy discovered by Toyota?

Thank you all in advance, Albin.

"Albin Dzurnak" > wrote in message
...
> Dear All;
>
> Anyone knows the truth about fuel economy of new Corolla vs Echo hatchback?
>
> Corolla is 20% heavier than Echo hatchback.
> Corolla has 20% more peak horspower than Echo hatchback.
> Corolla has 20% larger engine displacement than Echo hatchback.
>
> Yet, Corolla has only 6% higher city fuel consumption, according to
> Industry Canada.
> Yet, Corolla has only 2% higher highway fuel consumption, according to
> Industry Canada.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Free energy discovered by Toyota?
>
> Thank you all in advance, Albin.
>
I have heard that the VVTi engine in Echos hurt its fuel economy, but my
automatic 2000 Echo gets 38 city, 41 highway. Probably helps that I don't
drive like a raped ape

Natalie

> I have heard that the VVTi engine in Echos hurt its fuel economy, but my
> automatic 2000 Echo gets 38 city, 41 highway. Probably helps that I don't
> drive like a raped ape
>
> Natalie
>

My buddy drives his like a raped gorilla (2001 5spd) and still gets 500km+
to a tank. My '01 (auto) Corolla with VVTi gets 450km to a tank when I baby
the hell out of it and my '97 5spd Corolla gets even less.

On Sun, 3 Apr 2005 00:28:24 -0500, "Albin Dzurnak"
> wrote:

>Dear All;
>
>Anyone knows the truth about fuel economy of new Corolla vs Echo hatchback?
>
>Corolla is 20% heavier than Echo hatchback.
>Corolla has 20% more peak horspower than Echo hatchback.
>Corolla has 20% larger engine displacement than Echo hatchback.
>
>Yet, Corolla has only 6% higher city fuel consumption, according to Industry
>Canada.
>Yet, Corolla has only 2% higher highway fuel consumption, according to
>Industry Canada.
>
>Any ideas?
>
>Free energy discovered by Toyota?
>
>Thank you all in advance, Albin.
>


Since they are almost the same size, wouldn't air drag difference
between the two be very little? As for weight, isn't that a major
factore when changing, speed, direction, etc, so at crusing speed the
small difference in weight is almost unnoticiable?


Just curious, maybe the numbers aren't addressing the reall killers of
fuel economy, like size, shape, and engine stats.

later,

tom

"Albin Dzurnak" > wrote in message
...
> Dear All;
>
> Anyone knows the truth about fuel economy of new Corolla vs Echo
> hatchback?
>
> Corolla is 20% heavier than Echo hatchback.
> Corolla has 20% more peak horspower than Echo hatchback.
> Corolla has 20% larger engine displacement than Echo hatchback.
>
> Yet, Corolla has only 6% higher city fuel consumption, according to
> Industry Canada.
> Yet, Corolla has only 2% higher highway fuel consumption, according to
> Industry Canada.
>
> Any ideas?
>
> Free energy discovered by Toyota?
>
> Thank you all in advance, Albin.
A big factor in fuel economy is how hard the engine has to work to do its
job. You have done quite a bit of homework and calculations, you may want
to calculate engine peak horsepower vs. curb weight and engine peak torque
vs. curb weight. An engine with more power will not have to work as hard to
accelerate and maintain a cruise than one with less power, although it will
generally consume more fuel than one with less power. Transmission and
differential gear ratios affect fuel economy and engine performance, as does
coefficient of drag and tires. The real answer to the lack of difference
is probably a combination of all these factors.
--
Ray O
correct the return address punctuation to reply

> A big factor in fuel economy is how hard the engine has to work to do its
> job. You have done quite a bit of homework and calculations, you may want
> to calculate engine peak horsepower vs. curb weight and engine peak torque
> vs. curb weight. An engine with more power will not have to work as hard
to
> accelerate and maintain a cruise than one with less power, although it
will
> generally consume more fuel than one with less power. Transmission and
> differential gear ratios affect fuel economy and engine performance, as
does
> coefficient of drag and tires. The real answer to the lack of difference
> is probably a combination of all these factors.
> --

Very true. A good example is shown in Jeep 2.5L vs 4.2L high output. Huge
difference in possible consumption but because of the increased power needed
to move that block of metal the gas mileage is pretty much equal.

Yes, driving style is an important factor in fuel efficiency. It tends to
be younger and less-educated morons on the roads who accelerate in front of
city lights, who dont know th elogic of signal switching, who honk behind
you only to discover the speed they gain is converted into useless heat when
they brake for th enext liight and it's always amusing on Riverside Drive in
New York City so many pass me only to find themselves again next to my body
at the next light. Morons

Also, like myself you probably made every effort to remove non-essential
weight. I am went to extreme and removed spare tire from the day i rilled
out of dealer's lot due to 3-year Roadside assistance (FREE) which covers
all even batteries and flat tires that one would think is customer's
responsibility, they said if I get a flat they come and replace free, so...
i also get upward 40mpg and my car is heavier than yours and much b etter -
2004 Nissan Sentra .8S with upraded package, though I admit Aluminum Alloy
wheels also help save fuel (acceleration/braking takes less unspruing weight
to rotate)

griffin wrote:
> > A big factor in fuel economy is how hard the engine has to work to
do its
> > job. You have done quite a bit of homework and calculations, you
may want
> > to calculate engine peak horsepower vs. curb weight and engine peak
torque
> > vs. curb weight. An engine with more power will not have to work
as hard
> to
> > accelerate and maintain a cruise than one with less power, although
it
> will
> > generally consume more fuel than one with less power. Transmission
and
> > differential gear ratios affect fuel economy and engine
performance, as
> does
> > coefficient of drag and tires. The real answer to the lack of
difference
> > is probably a combination of all these factors.
> > --
>
> Very true. A good example is shown in Jeep 2.5L vs 4.2L high output.
Huge
> difference in possible consumption but because of the increased power
needed
> to move that block of metal the gas mileage is pretty much equal.

Corolla is a sulev type engine, while Echo is still ulev type engine.
To be certified as sulev type engine has to be 10% more fuel efficient
then ulev type engine. Perhapes new 2006 echo/vitz will be sulev type
engine, as it's brand new model.

Albin Dzurnak wrote:

> Dear All;
>
> Anyone knows the truth about fuel economy of new Corolla vs Echo hatchback?
>
> Corolla is 20% heavier than Echo hatchback.
> Corolla has 20% more peak horspower than Echo hatchback.
> Corolla has 20% larger engine displacement than Echo hatchback.
>
> Yet, Corolla has only 6% higher city fuel consumption, according to Industry
> Canada.
> Yet, Corolla has only 2% higher highway fuel consumption, according to
> Industry Canada.
>
> Any ideas?

Gearing and compression ratios. The Corolla has a larger engine
and they de-tune it to get more efficiency. The Echo, though,
is souped up a bit to deliver enough power to not get blown
off the road, so it gets a bit worse mileage.