Follow up to 12/12 post -- "All the oil ran out of my new 2007 CR-V"

When I last posted, I had decided to accept Honda's offer to repair the
blown crank seal and give me an extended warranty. (The original post is
copied below.) Since that time I have been tracking the gas mileage, as a
possible way to see if there is any engine damage. I am now quite sure that
there was damage and it has increased the engine friction.

Prior to the oil leak, I drove a total of 900 miles. The mileage, as
indicated on the dashboard, was 19.8 mpg. I just tracked the mileage over
two fillups. The mileage is now 18.5. This is a decrease of 6.5%. Both of
these figures are over the same suburban roads, doing the same errands, day
after day. This is a statistically significant change, and the only
explanation for it is internal engine damager. (I verified that the
dashboard indicator is correct, by comparing it to my own calculations from
the pump. The indicated mpg is within 0.5% of the calculated mpg. I also
verified the car's odometer against measured mile sticks.)

I plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or a new car.
Comments/advice appreciated.

Chuck Connell
http://www.chc-3.com -- My home page


+++++++++++++++++++++

I have a one-month old 07 CRV with about 900 miles. Last night I noticed
the oil light blinking randomly. I checked the oil level as soon as I got
home, just a couple miles later. It was down, so I added a quart. I did
another short errand (5 miles), then checked the oil again. Still low, so I
added another quart and parked it for the night. This morning I checked the
stick and it showed nothing. So I added two more quarts, bringing the level
up to full (2nd hole in the stick). I drove the car directly to the dealer
this morning (about 5 miles) with no oil light coming on.

I now realize that the oil has been running out for a week or more. There
are oil spots where I park my car at work, and two large spots in my
driveway. The oil level was down 4 quarts!

I'm not entirely sure that this change is really significant. Sure, a
real change of 6.5% but I have reservations. I know you said that you
travel on the same roads doing the same errandstime of day but still to
me it seems like there are too many variables--speed, traffic, pump
readings(same pump? is the pump's meter completely constant? same brand
gas?). And, I'd consider the temperature drop as we get further into
winter--certainly this is a well established mileage decreaser.
As far as your plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or car, I
truly hope that you are successful with that. Because you already
accepted Honda's off and had the seal repaired they may not have a
positive response, unless you had discussed their willingness to take
back the car if the repair wasn't successful. In any case, I wish you
good luck and keep us posted.

Ken

Chuck Connell wrote:
> When I last posted, I had decided to accept Honda's offer to repair the
> blown crank seal and give me an extended warranty. (The original post is
> copied below.) Since that time I have been tracking the gas mileage, as a
> possible way to see if there is any engine damage. I am now quite sure that
> there was damage and it has increased the engine friction.
>
> Prior to the oil leak, I drove a total of 900 miles. The mileage, as
> indicated on the dashboard, was 19.8 mpg. I just tracked the mileage over
> two fillups. The mileage is now 18.5. This is a decrease of 6.5%. Both of
> these figures are over the same suburban roads, doing the same errands, day
> after day. This is a statistically significant change, and the only
> explanation for it is internal engine damager. (I verified that the
> dashboard indicator is correct, by comparing it to my own calculations from
> the pump. The indicated mpg is within 0.5% of the calculated mpg. I also
> verified the car's odometer against measured mile sticks.)
>
> I plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or a new car.
> Comments/advice appreciated.
>
> Chuck Connell
> http://www.chc-3.com -- My home page
>
>
> +++++++++++++++++++++
>
> I have a one-month old 07 CRV with about 900 miles. Last night I noticed
> the oil light blinking randomly. I checked the oil level as soon as I got
> home, just a couple miles later. It was down, so I added a quart. I did
> another short errand (5 miles), then checked the oil again. Still low, so I
> added another quart and parked it for the night. This morning I checked the
> stick and it showed nothing. So I added two more quarts, bringing the level
> up to full (2nd hole in the stick). I drove the car directly to the dealer
> this morning (about 5 miles) with no oil light coming on.
>
> I now realize that the oil has been running out for a week or more. There
> are oil spots where I park my car at work, and two large spots in my
> driveway. The oil level was down 4 quarts!
>
>
>

I guess I'm not sure that a decrease in gas mileage is totally
indicative of engine issues. There are so many variables involed with
gas mileage - driving conditions, type of gas, time of year, heat/A/C
use, etc.... For example, many states allow or mandate the use of
different additives in gas during different times of the year. That
could have an impact on your mileage. And the 900 miles you drove
before your initial problem may not really be enough of a baseline. The
car wasn't really broken in for most of the period. You may have
subconciously been 'taking it easy' during the first 500 miles, for
example.

OTOH, I would document very carefully anything that could be an
indicator of an internal problem, and with all of the above said, if
there are other indicators (for example, unusual oil consumption,
overheating, etc) I would for sure contact Honda.

Just my 2 cents, FWIW!

Dan D
'07 Ody EX
Central NJ USA

I don't think you will get anywhere with Honda using this tactic. I have
more variation in mileage than that from tankful to tankful with my '06 CRV
& I'm pretty sure there is nothing wrong with it.

With only 900 miles on it, its not fully broken in and mileage is still an
open question. You need to average the mileage over several tankfuls to get
any idea what it really gets. The real question you should be asking is
whether it uses any oil and that even needs to be measured over at least
1,000 miles.


On 1/18/07 9:44 AM, in article
, "Chuck Connell"
> wrote:

> When I last posted, I had decided to accept Honda's offer to repair the
> blown crank seal and give me an extended warranty. (The original post is
> copied below.) Since that time I have been tracking the gas mileage, as a
> possible way to see if there is any engine damage. I am now quite sure that
> there was damage and it has increased the engine friction.
>
> Prior to the oil leak, I drove a total of 900 miles. The mileage, as
> indicated on the dashboard, was 19.8 mpg. I just tracked the mileage over
> two fillups. The mileage is now 18.5. This is a decrease of 6.5%. Both of
> these figures are over the same suburban roads, doing the same errands, day
> after day. This is a statistically significant change, and the only
> explanation for it is internal engine damager. (I verified that the
> dashboard indicator is correct, by comparing it to my own calculations from
> the pump. The indicated mpg is within 0.5% of the calculated mpg. I also
> verified the car's odometer against measured mile sticks.)
>
> I plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or a new car.
> Comments/advice appreciated.
>
> Chuck Connell
> http://www.chc-3.com -- My home page
>
>
> +++++++++++++++++++++
>
> I have a one-month old 07 CRV with about 900 miles. Last night I noticed
> the oil light blinking randomly. I checked the oil level as soon as I got
> home, just a couple miles later. It was down, so I added a quart. I did
> another short errand (5 miles), then checked the oil again. Still low, so I
> added another quart and parked it for the night. This morning I checked the
> stick and it showed nothing. So I added two more quarts, bringing the level
> up to full (2nd hole in the stick). I drove the car directly to the dealer
> this morning (about 5 miles) with no oil light coming on.
>
> I now realize that the oil has been running out for a week or more. There
> are oil spots where I park my car at work, and two large spots in my
> driveway. The oil level was down 4 quarts!
>
>
>

The car is too new and still in the break in time frame. Even if it's not I
would think that you're seeing a typical variation. I think that it's
unrealistic to expect that you'd get the same exact mileage every time.
What conclusions would you have drawn if the mileage was slightly above the
pre-oil loss time frame?--that the oil loss made the engine a better
performer. Using this data to try and get a new engine is next to none or
less.
MLD
"Chuck Connell" > wrote in message
et...
> When I last posted, I had decided to accept Honda's offer to repair the
> blown crank seal and give me an extended warranty. (The original post is
> copied below.) Since that time I have been tracking the gas mileage, as a
> possible way to see if there is any engine damage. I am now quite sure
that
> there was damage and it has increased the engine friction.
>
> Prior to the oil leak, I drove a total of 900 miles. The mileage, as
> indicated on the dashboard, was 19.8 mpg. I just tracked the mileage over
> two fillups. The mileage is now 18.5. This is a decrease of 6.5%. Both of
> these figures are over the same suburban roads, doing the same errands,
day
> after day. This is a statistically significant change, and the only
> explanation for it is internal engine damager. (I verified that the
> dashboard indicator is correct, by comparing it to my own calculations
from
> the pump. The indicated mpg is within 0.5% of the calculated mpg. I also
> verified the car's odometer against measured mile sticks.)
>
> I plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or a new car.
> Comments/advice appreciated.
>
> Chuck Connell
> http://www.chc-3.com -- My home page
>
>
> +++++++++++++++++++++
>
> I have a one-month old 07 CRV with about 900 miles. Last night I noticed
> the oil light blinking randomly. I checked the oil level as soon as I got
> home, just a couple miles later. It was down, so I added a quart. I did
> another short errand (5 miles), then checked the oil again. Still low, so
I
> added another quart and parked it for the night. This morning I checked
the
> stick and it showed nothing. So I added two more quarts, bringing the
level
> up to full (2nd hole in the stick). I drove the car directly to the
dealer
> this morning (about 5 miles) with no oil light coming on.
>
> I now realize that the oil has been running out for a week or more. There
> are oil spots where I park my car at work, and two large spots in my
> driveway. The oil level was down 4 quarts!
>
>
>

In article >,
says...
> When I last posted, I had decided to accept Honda's offer to repair the
> blown crank seal and give me an extended warranty. (The original post is
> copied below.) Since that time I have been tracking the gas mileage, as a
> possible way to see if there is any engine damage. I am now quite sure that
> there was damage and it has increased the engine friction.
>
> Prior to the oil leak, I drove a total of 900 miles. The mileage, as
> indicated on the dashboard, was 19.8 mpg. I just tracked the mileage over
> two fillups. The mileage is now 18.5. This is a decrease of 6.5%. Both of
> these figures are over the same suburban roads, doing the same errands, day
> after day. This is a statistically significant change, and the only
> explanation for it is internal engine damager.

No, there is the distinct possibility that it is due to the weather,
particularly the temperature, which had been unseasonably warm here in
the northeast through December. Cold temperatures affect mileage
greatly. Since Hondas turn on the A/C when the defroster is used, that
alone could explain the difference.

> I plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or a new car.

Well, good luck with that. If they extended the drive train warranty
past the standard 5 year/60,000 miles, you probably shouldn't worry too
much.

--Gene

> Comments/advice appreciated.
>
> Chuck Connell
> http://www.chc-3.com -- My home page
>
>
> +++++++++++++++++++++
>
> I have a one-month old 07 CRV with about 900 miles. Last night I noticed
> the oil light blinking randomly. I checked the oil level as soon as I got
> home, just a couple miles later. It was down, so I added a quart. I did
> another short errand (5 miles), then checked the oil again. Still low, so I
> added another quart and parked it for the night. This morning I checked the
> stick and it showed nothing. So I added two more quarts, bringing the level
> up to full (2nd hole in the stick). I drove the car directly to the dealer
> this morning (about 5 miles) with no oil light coming on.
>
> I now realize that the oil has been running out for a week or more. There
> are oil spots where I park my car at work, and two large spots in my
> driveway. The oil level was down 4 quarts!
>
>
>
>

On Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:44:53 -0500, Chuck Connell wrote:

> When I last posted, I had decided to accept Honda's offer to repair the
> blown crank seal and give me an extended warranty. (The original post is
> copied below.) Since that time I have been tracking the gas mileage, as a
> possible way to see if there is any engine damage. I am now quite sure that
> there was damage and it has increased the engine friction.
>
> Prior to the oil leak, I drove a total of 900 miles. The mileage, as
> indicated on the dashboard, was 19.8 mpg. I just tracked the mileage over
> two fillups. The mileage is now 18.5. This is a decrease of 6.5%. Both of
> these figures are over the same suburban roads, doing the same errands, day
> after day. This is a statistically significant change, and the only
> explanation for it is internal engine damager. (I verified that the
> dashboard indicator is correct, by comparing it to my own calculations from
> the pump. The indicated mpg is within 0.5% of the calculated mpg. I also
> verified the car's odometer against measured mile sticks.)
>
> I plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or a new car.
> Comments/advice appreciated.
>
> Chuck Connell
> http://www.chc-3.com -- My home page
>
>
> +++++++++++++++++++++
>
> I have a one-month old 07 CRV with about 900 miles. Last night I noticed
> the oil light blinking randomly. I checked the oil level as soon as I got
> home, just a couple miles later. It was down, so I added a quart. I did
> another short errand (5 miles), then checked the oil again. Still low, so I
> added another quart and parked it for the night. This morning I checked the
> stick and it showed nothing. So I added two more quarts, bringing the level
> up to full (2nd hole in the stick). I drove the car directly to the dealer
> this morning (about 5 miles) with no oil light coming on.
>
> I now realize that the oil has been running out for a week or more. There
> are oil spots where I park my car at work, and two large spots in my
> driveway. The oil level was down 4 quarts!

There are several other factors that can change the mileage.

Are you in a northern climate? if so, your gas station likely changes
formulations for the winter, which will give you lower fuel efficiency.

Has it been colder out since you got the car back? Weather can affect MPG.

Hell, even if you are just accelerating at a different rate than you were
before, or getting caught at more lights, you will affect your mileage...

"Chuck Connell" > wrote in message
et...
> When I last posted, I had decided to accept Honda's offer to repair the
> blown crank seal and give me an extended warranty. (The original post is
> copied below.) Since that time I have been tracking the gas mileage, as a
> possible way to see if there is any engine damage. I am now quite sure
> that there was damage and it has increased the engine friction.
>
> Prior to the oil leak, I drove a total of 900 miles. The mileage, as
> indicated on the dashboard, was 19.8 mpg. I just tracked the mileage over
> two fillups. The mileage is now 18.5. This is a decrease of 6.5%. Both of
> these figures are over the same suburban roads, doing the same errands,
> day after day. This is a statistically significant change, and the only
> explanation for it is internal engine damager. (I verified that the
> dashboard indicator is correct, by comparing it to my own calculations
> from the pump. The indicated mpg is within 0.5% of the calculated mpg. I
> also verified the car's odometer against measured mile sticks.)
>
> I plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or a new car.
> Comments/advice appreciated.
>
> Chuck Connell

I also feel you are jumping the gun. Oil starvation doesn't usually show up
as increased fuel consumption. If the lower fuel efficiency is from
increased engine friction it will be clear very soon as the robbed power
destroys the affected part. By the time you've used up a tank of gas the
engine would be making some shocking noises.

Mike (the voice of second hand experience on that!)

Your milage sounds normal.

A mechanic should be able to determine if your car has damage. If it
was starved of oil there will be burns on the cams, burns on the
cylinder walls, or low compression. Only the valve cover and spark
plugs need to be removed for this inspection so it's pretty quick.

I doubt there's any damage as long as the oil light wasn't on
continuously. Most likely you had air bubbles and some foaming that
made pressure intermittent. I've seen a few engines blow up and they
keep running for a few minutes before the oil dries up.


In article >,
"Chuck Connell" > wrote:

> When I last posted, I had decided to accept Honda's offer to repair the
> blown crank seal and give me an extended warranty. (The original post is
> copied below.) Since that time I have been tracking the gas mileage, as a
> possible way to see if there is any engine damage. I am now quite sure that
> there was damage and it has increased the engine friction.
>
> Prior to the oil leak, I drove a total of 900 miles. The mileage, as
> indicated on the dashboard, was 19.8 mpg. I just tracked the mileage over
> two fillups. The mileage is now 18.5. This is a decrease of 6.5%. Both of
> these figures are over the same suburban roads, doing the same errands, day
> after day. This is a statistically significant change, and the only
> explanation for it is internal engine damager. (I verified that the
> dashboard indicator is correct, by comparing it to my own calculations from
> the pump. The indicated mpg is within 0.5% of the calculated mpg. I also
> verified the car's odometer against measured mile sticks.)
>
> I plan to contact Honda and ask for a new engine or a new car.
> Comments/advice appreciated.
>
> Chuck Connell
> http://www.chc-3.com -- My home page
>
>
> +++++++++++++++++++++
>
> I have a one-month old 07 CRV with about 900 miles. Last night I noticed
> the oil light blinking randomly. I checked the oil level as soon as I got
> home, just a couple miles later. It was down, so I added a quart. I did
> another short errand (5 miles), then checked the oil again. Still low, so I
> added another quart and parked it for the night. This morning I checked the
> stick and it showed nothing. So I added two more quarts, bringing the level
> up to full (2nd hole in the stick). I drove the car directly to the dealer
> this morning (about 5 miles) with no oil light coming on.
>
> I now realize that the oil has been running out for a week or more. There
> are oil spots where I park my car at work, and two large spots in my
> driveway. The oil level was down 4 quarts!

OK. I am convinced by your unanimous responses to wait on this. The engine
sounds fine. I will track the mileage some more before making any
conclusion about it.

Chuck