Question for Europeans

"Mark Hewitt" > wrote in message
...
> Very true. However you also tend to drive huge cars

Depends on your definition of "huge car". The Toyota Corolla, Ford
Focus, and Honda Civic are very popular here, and they are not huge cars.

Actually, it seems like the huge cars are a dying breed, having a
reputation as either cars for pimps or old geezers. They are even thinking
of axing the Buick brand, and Oldsmobile is already gone. Even big cars
like the Chrysler 300 are smaller than some of the "land yachts" of the
past.

If you want a "huge car" in the US you invariably buy a sport utility
vehicle. But if you actually look at the number of SUV's on the road, they
are still only about 1/4 of the vehicles we drive.

>with very poor fuel
> efficiency.

Some of it is due to our environmental laws, which put more emphasis on
pollution than in Europe (remember, you had lead in gas for ages). Many
fuel efficient engine designs you have in Europe are not available in the US
because it would raise the average corporate emissions for an automobile
company.

"Brent P" > wrote in message
...
> In article > , Christian
> McArdle wrote:
>
>
>> People grumble about the price, but deep down know that petroleum use is
>> bad
>> due to climate change, so the grumbling is not as loud as it might be.
>
> I am having problems believing the measured warming is due to CO2.
> Because other planets and satelites (moons) in the solor system are
> warming. I think the scale of the issue of climate change is much bigger.
>

The whole global warming issue is one of the bigger left lies. The problem
is, as always with the liberals and leftists, that as much as they try to
help the poor, they end up screwing them. One of the reasons gas prices are
high in the U.S. is that a new refinery was not built for 30 years. The
leftist and the environmentalists do not allow new ones to go up. That's ok,
we are building 17 new Ethanol plants in the US, doubling our output to 8
billion gallons of ethanol a year. Plus, having 100 ethanol plants is better
than 10 oil refineries - less of a terrorist target, and also less of a
threat if a few of them stop working. Plus, ethanol is finally energy
positive to produce!

"Magnulus" > wrote in message
.. .
>
> "Mark Hewitt" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Very true. However you also tend to drive huge cars
>
> Depends on your definition of "huge car". The Toyota Corolla, Ford
> Focus, and Honda Civic are very popular here, and they are not huge cars.
>

Ford have 2 cars smaller than the Focus, the Fiesta and Ka in Europe, VW are the
same with the Polo and Lupo (soon to be replaced with the fox but no relation to
the VW fox sold in the US in the '90s) smaller than the Golf. Both Toyota and
Honda do a single vehicle smaller than the models you list (Yaris and Jazz
respectively), I guess none of them are sold in the USA or at least in no great
numbers.

In article >, Dan J.S. wrote:
> One of the reasons gas prices are
> high in the U.S. is that a new refinery was not built for 30 years.

And the oil companies have closed/torn down some.

> The leftist and the environmentalists do not allow new ones to go up.

I used to believe it was mostly NIMBY stuff and that generally companies
weren't responsible and allowed things to spew. Then as windpower has
become more viable, I see it being opposed. I realize now what is going
on is a question of power. Of controling energy. NIMBY plays a role
still, but the overall view is one of energy control.

As I posted before, if a totally clean, limitless, dirt cheap to free
energy source was found, it would be opposed on some trivial or even
manufactured grounds.

Going one step further, squashing new energy is good for those benefiting
from the status quo.

> That's ok,
> we are building 17 new Ethanol plants in the US, doubling our output to 8
> billion gallons of ethanol a year.

What is the effeciency of the these plants, or do they run off of
electricity from nukes or wind or something of that order?

> Plus, ethanol is finally energy positive to produce!

That's good news. Do you have cite I can look at? E85 is good for
performance engines because of the antiknock properties.

The reason I ask the earlier question is that even if ethanol is just
break even, if it can be made using a source that isn't good to power
vehicles, ethanol, being a liquid fuel would be a useful way to store the
energy for use in vehicles. The limits of battery technology could be
avoided this way.

"Brimstone" > wrote in message
...
>
> My comment referred to the fact that commuting has been made easier.

By deteriorating roads?

> On the contrary UK roads are mostly very well maintained.

Bar the 3/4 that aren't.

Depresion wrote:
> "Brimstone" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> My comment referred to the fact that commuting has been made easier.
>
> By deteriorating roads?
>
>> On the contrary UK roads are mostly very well maintained.
>
> Bar the 3/4 that aren't.

Provide examples including photos. Alternatively stop talking crap.

"Brimstone" > wrote in message
...
> Depresion wrote:
>> "Brimstone" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> Contrary to popular mythology roads have been improved to allow
>>> faster
>>> speeds and railways are now carrying more people than ever before,
>>> despite significant reductions in track mileage.
>>>
>>
>> 3/4 or UK's local roads are deteriorating year on year. We are £8.3
>> billon behind in road maintenance. By last year the plan was to have
>> halted the deterioration but it hasn't happened and by 2010 we were
>> to have caught up and removed the backlog unfortunately the first
>> part was no where near achieved as about 50% of the money allocated
>> for maintenance is being spent elsewhere on things like speed
>> cushions, bus lanes, and what's laughably called our education system
>> by local authorities. It's about time that money allocated by the
>> national government for road maintenance is reserved only for use in
>> actually maintaining roads.
>
> I wasn't talking about maintenance, but then you were aware of that before
> your petulant little rant weren't you?.

How can you make claims about "roads have been improved" when 3/4's of them are
so badly maintained they are deteriorating and there is more than a six year
backlog in fixing them.

"Martin Brown" > wrote in message
...
>
> But the exact price in Europe varies from country to country as does
> preference for petrol/diesel/LPG. Belgium for instance is a diesel country
> whereas France tends towards petrol/essence. UK is actually headed towards
> diesel now due to changes in company car tax rules.

Company car tax is due to change again next year increasing tax on diesels. This
just makes things even more complex as if I understand correctly it will only be
on new cars purchased next year thus giving another band of tax that needs to be
calculated.

"Brimstone" > wrote in message
...
> Depresion wrote:
>> "Brimstone" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> My comment referred to the fact that commuting has been made easier.
>>
>> By deteriorating roads?
>>
>>> On the contrary UK roads are mostly very well maintained.
>>
>> Bar the 3/4 that aren't.
>
> Provide examples including photos. Alternatively stop talking crap.

Why not contact the Institution of Civil Engineers the people who published the
report on the failing state of our roads. Maybe you can provide a contrary
report.

You could also watch the bbc report on there website:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/video/39..._boquet_vi.ram

Here is a summery ICE report:
http://www.ice.org.uk/rtfpdf/ICE_LTS_PR_280803.pdf

>
>> Plus, ethanol is finally energy positive to produce!
>
> That's good news. Do you have cite I can look at? E85 is good for
> performance engines because of the antiknock properties.

Just go to news.google.com and check some of the articles on 'brazil and
ethanol' also I subscribed to the Ethanol articles as they come in. For
example, in brazil they burn the husks to heat the process to make ethanol,
adding no extra energy to the process -- this is crude and ok in a 3rd world
country, however here in the U.S. some of the ethanol produced is used to
make more. It was even as of 2 years ago, now the process is actually
positive. So you produce more than burn up. You still need corn, cane, or
other products, but in terms of energy, the technology has made huge gains.
I am also looking at Archer - Midland - Daniels (NYSE - ADM) and their
progress in this field. Really fascinating stuff.