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Tough technical questions



 
 
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  #11  
Old October 15th 04, 12:49 PM
Repairman
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Use the rubber coated ones and the Permatex to help hold it.
You will get galvanic action between the steel and aluminum with the
non-coated ones. That's why the OEM ones are rubber coated to prevent that
corrosion from happening. You don't want the cases to corrode and get pitted
in the seal area after time goes by.
A 2 stroke motor has retainer plates to hold the seals in as they have
pressurized bottom ends, not a problem with a vented 4 stroke crankcase.
--
John
"anything you say can & will be misquoted & used against you"
'01 FLHR ''Red"
'04 MXZ 600ho
'99 XC700
BRC mem

"Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
...
> Thank you all for your advice.
>
> Do you think a steel cased oil seal will work satisfactorily in aluminum
> alloy if the seal is a good press fit? I would apply a light coat of
> Permatex #1 or Permatex Aviation to the outside diameter before driving it
> home.
>
> I am working on an obsolete motorcycle. The supplier has on hand
> elastomer
> coated o.d. oil seals, but the retention in the bore is problematic. I
> don't think OEM stuff is available and he is supplying generic parts. If
> that is the case, my automotive supplier can special order any seals I
> want
> by size and type specification, so the decision can be made to go with a
> conventional metal case seal. Rubber coated o.d. is supposed to be ideal
> for aluminum alloy, but I don't see any reliability in these seals if I
> can
> literally push into place by hand with essentially no mechanical
> retention.
>



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  #12  
Old October 15th 04, 05:00 PM
Nate Nagel
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Default

Nomen Nescio > wrote in message >. ..
> 1. The application is to install a rotary shaft oil seal in an aluminum
> housing. The configuration of the seal is with a rubber coated outside
> diameter. The fit in the bored housing is a light push fit. I suspect the
> seal will work loose on its own during service. What is the best way to
> install this seal? Options I've considered include replacing this seal
> constructed with a metal o.d., but this is not normally recommended due to
> the high coefficient of expansion. A more promising solution is to "glue"
> the seal in with Loctite 495, cyanoacrylate adhesive. Will that work?


I suppose a seal with a slightly larger o.d. is not available? that
would be the ideal option. The seal ought to need to be pressed or
lightly hammered in to have any hope of reliable retention.

>
> 2. The problem is installing a chain sprocket onto a keyed tapered shaft
> which is then secured with a retaining nut. What is the best practice:
> Install on clean and dry taper, install on greased taper, or apply a high
> strength Loctite 272 to the taper before assembly? The idea is to make a
> good assembly but be able to disassemble with no more than a puller without
> heat. Am I correct in assuming that the key is designed for indexing but
> the torque is taken up by the taper? If the taper is greased, removal is
> easy, but the torque might be passed on to the key and cause localized
> stress and failure. Clean and dry I think is the standard way of assembly,
> but Loctite application may be in common practice too.


FWIW the standard practice for dealing with tapered-end rear axles
with separate hubs (commonly used on Studebaker, AMC and others) is to
install them clean and dry. They require a lot of force to separate
when torqued to spec, so no worries there. I have heard tell of
people lubing the tapers and subsequently splitting the cast iron
hubs.

nate
  #13  
Old October 15th 04, 05:00 PM
Nate Nagel
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Nomen Nescio > wrote in message >. ..
> 1. The application is to install a rotary shaft oil seal in an aluminum
> housing. The configuration of the seal is with a rubber coated outside
> diameter. The fit in the bored housing is a light push fit. I suspect the
> seal will work loose on its own during service. What is the best way to
> install this seal? Options I've considered include replacing this seal
> constructed with a metal o.d., but this is not normally recommended due to
> the high coefficient of expansion. A more promising solution is to "glue"
> the seal in with Loctite 495, cyanoacrylate adhesive. Will that work?


I suppose a seal with a slightly larger o.d. is not available? that
would be the ideal option. The seal ought to need to be pressed or
lightly hammered in to have any hope of reliable retention.

>
> 2. The problem is installing a chain sprocket onto a keyed tapered shaft
> which is then secured with a retaining nut. What is the best practice:
> Install on clean and dry taper, install on greased taper, or apply a high
> strength Loctite 272 to the taper before assembly? The idea is to make a
> good assembly but be able to disassemble with no more than a puller without
> heat. Am I correct in assuming that the key is designed for indexing but
> the torque is taken up by the taper? If the taper is greased, removal is
> easy, but the torque might be passed on to the key and cause localized
> stress and failure. Clean and dry I think is the standard way of assembly,
> but Loctite application may be in common practice too.


FWIW the standard practice for dealing with tapered-end rear axles
with separate hubs (commonly used on Studebaker, AMC and others) is to
install them clean and dry. They require a lot of force to separate
when torqued to spec, so no worries there. I have heard tell of
people lubing the tapers and subsequently splitting the cast iron
hubs.

nate
  #14  
Old October 15th 04, 09:59 PM
Bill Putney
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Default

Nate Nagel wrote:

> ...I have heard tell of
> people lubing the tapers and subsequently splitting the cast iron
> hubs.
>
> nate


Precisely the point I was making.

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
adddress with the letter 'x')


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  #15  
Old October 15th 04, 09:59 PM
Bill Putney
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Posts: n/a
Default

Nate Nagel wrote:

> ...I have heard tell of
> people lubing the tapers and subsequently splitting the cast iron
> hubs.
>
> nate


Precisely the point I was making.

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
adddress with the letter 'x')


----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
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  #16  
Old October 20th 04, 10:03 PM
Refinish_King1
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Use a thin coat of Permatex clear silicone sealer/adhesive:

It would hold bananas to ice-cream and seal them as well. I use it on cars
with problematic intake manifold front and rear seal leaks. A trick from
drag racing days, with angle cut heads, and no way to use the manifold
sealing strips.

I hope this helps?

Refinish King


"Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
...
> Thank you all for your advice.
>
> Do you think a steel cased oil seal will work satisfactorily in aluminum
> alloy if the seal is a good press fit? I would apply a light coat of
> Permatex #1 or Permatex Aviation to the outside diameter before driving it
> home.
>
> I am working on an obsolete motorcycle. The supplier has on hand
> elastomer
> coated o.d. oil seals, but the retention in the bore is problematic. I
> don't think OEM stuff is available and he is supplying generic parts. If
> that is the case, my automotive supplier can special order any seals I
> want
> by size and type specification, so the decision can be made to go with a
> conventional metal case seal. Rubber coated o.d. is supposed to be ideal
> for aluminum alloy, but I don't see any reliability in these seals if I
> can
> literally push into place by hand with essentially no mechanical
> retention.
>



  #17  
Old October 20th 04, 10:03 PM
Refinish_King1
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Use a thin coat of Permatex clear silicone sealer/adhesive:

It would hold bananas to ice-cream and seal them as well. I use it on cars
with problematic intake manifold front and rear seal leaks. A trick from
drag racing days, with angle cut heads, and no way to use the manifold
sealing strips.

I hope this helps?

Refinish King


"Nomen Nescio" > wrote in message
...
> Thank you all for your advice.
>
> Do you think a steel cased oil seal will work satisfactorily in aluminum
> alloy if the seal is a good press fit? I would apply a light coat of
> Permatex #1 or Permatex Aviation to the outside diameter before driving it
> home.
>
> I am working on an obsolete motorcycle. The supplier has on hand
> elastomer
> coated o.d. oil seals, but the retention in the bore is problematic. I
> don't think OEM stuff is available and he is supplying generic parts. If
> that is the case, my automotive supplier can special order any seals I
> want
> by size and type specification, so the decision can be made to go with a
> conventional metal case seal. Rubber coated o.d. is supposed to be ideal
> for aluminum alloy, but I don't see any reliability in these seals if I
> can
> literally push into place by hand with essentially no mechanical
> retention.
>



 




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