Minn. Uses Astroturf for Quieter Highways

February 14, 2005
Minn. Uses Astroturf for Quieter Highways
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

MINNEAPOLIS (AP) -- Minnesota highway officials have found the key to
creating a skid-resistant -- and quiet -- concrete highway: AstroTurf.

Officials drag the wiry, plastic grass over a highway's surface to
rough it up and make it skid-resistant. The result is a different
texture that is quieter to drive on than the grooves that had been
previously placed in concrete.

The Federal Highway Administration said Minnesota is the first state to
eliminate the old-fashioned grooves in favor of using AstroTurf.

The new texture appears to be just as safe as the grooves, said Curt
Turgeon, pavement engineer for the Minnesota Department of
Transportation.

"We have looked at accident data and we haven't been able to see any
difference," he said.

Miles of quieter concrete lanes now are opening in the Twin Cities,
including on new sections of Interstate 694 and Highway 100.

"It's a different hum, much better," said Bernice Swanberg of Golden
Valley, who regularly drives the new stretch of Highway 100. She said
when she recently drove over the old-fashioned grooved concrete on
Interstate 35, "I thought 'What in the world was wrong with my car?'"

In the late 1970s, the Federal Highway Administration required grooves
to be raked across concrete pavement to drain water and improve
traction. However, tires passing over the grooves made such a loud
noise that it became a public concern, said David Rettner, a former
pavement research engineer for MnDOT.

With some legislators threatening to ban new concrete highways, MnDOT
increased efforts to silence the whine.

"We had been building pavement with AstroTurf drag for lower-volume
roads for a lot of years and it had always measured quiet, but it
wasn't allowed by Federal Highway (on freeways) until we could
demonstrate the skid resistance," Rettner said. "So we asked for
permission to do a research project to see if we could make it quieter
and make it skid-resistant."

The right texture was found after three years of testing. One formula
offered good traction at first, but then wore down. On the next try,
researchers made the surface so rough that it could withstand years of
snow plowing, Rettner said.

"What we have out there now, if you were riding a bike and fell on it,
it would rip all the meat off your bones. It is very skid resistant,"
said Rettner, who now is principal engineer for American Engineering
Testing Inc. in St. Paul.

MnDOT won approval from the Federal Highway Administration to eliminate
grooves on new concrete lanes in Minnesota. In new construction since
1999, Minnesota contractors have textured highways with AstroTurf or a
similar technique employing stiff-bristled brushes.

If it would "rip the meat off your bones", what does it do to tires?

> Hmm... I wonder how costly it is to replace, and how often the
> replacement must take place? How well does it stand up to Trucker
> traffic?

Replace what? They're just using the astroturf to texture the
pavement, not cover it.

Who in their right mind thinks a ****ing CONCRETE HIGHWAY is a good idea???

Someone MUST be getting blown somewhere!

John Harlow wrote:
> Who in their right mind thinks a ****ing CONCRETE HIGHWAY is a good
idea???
>
> Someone MUST be getting blown somewhere!

What's wrong with concrete? I've seen lots of asphalt fail in a year
or less, whereas there's stretches of concrete highway near where I
grew up that were built around the time I was *born* that are still
usable.

nate

On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, John Harlow wrote:

> Who in their right mind thinks a ****ing CONCRETE HIGHWAY is a good
> idea???

Lots of people, 'cause it is. What's your problem with it?

>> Who in their right mind thinks a ****ing CONCRETE HIGHWAY is a good
>> idea???
>
> Lots of people, 'cause it is. What's your problem with it?

Maybe in your climate. Here in Virgina, they tend to last about 2 years.
The highway department is CONSTANTLY blocking the roads putting in little
patches; the roads look like a quilt. They're giving up in many sections;
just ripping it up and paving it. It is SO nice to go from the noisy, bumpy
harsh patched concrete to the quiet, smooth asphalt.

Probably the worst thing about concrete is the stupid seams; the 2 hz bump
is very fatiguing.

John Harlow wrote:
> >> Who in their right mind thinks a ****ing CONCRETE HIGHWAY is a
good
> >> idea???
> >
> > Lots of people, 'cause it is. What's your problem with it?
>
> Maybe in your climate. Here in Virgina, they tend to last about 2
years.
> The highway department is CONSTANTLY blocking the roads putting in
little
> patches; the roads look like a quilt. They're giving up in many
sections;
> just ripping it up and paving it. It is SO nice to go from the
noisy, bumpy
> harsh patched concrete to the quiet, smooth asphalt.
>
> Probably the worst thing about concrete is the stupid seams; the 2 hz
bump
> is very fatiguing.

You mean I-66? I think that's likely the original concrete, and even
concrete has a finite lifespan. I don't know the exact date of the
construction of I-66, but ISTR it was sometime in the 1970s? I don't
know of any asphalt that would last that long.

The problem really is that it is literally impossible to shut down I-66
between Fair Lakes and the Beltway for resurfacing without major
traffic headaches (read: gridlock)

nate

On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, John Harlow wrote:

> >> Who in their right mind thinks a ****ing CONCRETE HIGHWAY is a good
> >> idea???

> > Lots of people, 'cause it is. What's your problem with it?

> Maybe in your climate. Here in Virgina, they tend to last about 2
> years.

That's an implementation problem (VDOT doing it wrong), not a concept
problem. Confusing the two kinds of problem is a common error.

In article ich.edu>, Daniel J. Stern wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Feb 2005, John Harlow wrote:
>
>> >> Who in their right mind thinks a ****ing CONCRETE HIGHWAY is a good
>> >> idea???
>
>> > Lots of people, 'cause it is. What's your problem with it?
>
>> Maybe in your climate. Here in Virgina, they tend to last about 2
>> years.
>
> That's an implementation problem (VDOT doing it wrong), not a concept
> problem. Confusing the two kinds of problem is a common error.

Yep. There are concrete roads that last forever and half in the chicago
area. The weather doesn't get much worse for a road surface. Of course
they are few and far between. Most are done half assed and don't last
very long regardless of the material type.