'05 Dragging Rear Brake (revisited)

In article .com>,
> wrote:
:
:sf/gf wrote:
:> Bob:
:>
:> I have not followed all of your posts on this, but has the dealer replaced
:> or at least checked the right rear brake hose? I have seen hoses swell on
:> the inside while looking normal on the outside. The swollen hose keeps
:> brake fluid pressure from returning to normal, thus causing the brakes to
:> drag on the affected wheel.
:
:That sort of thing would be consistent with the symptoms. Or say a
:kinked hose, or dented in rigid brake line- the high pressure in the
:line during braking would force its way thru to the caliper, but maybe
:some residual pressure would remain when the pedal is released, keeping
:the piston in the caliper pressing the brake pad against the disc.
:
:So the lines from the right rear to where they join with the left rear
:should be inspected inch by inch.
:
:-Paul

Great comments, guys...thanks very much. The dealer, to my knowledge,
has not inspected or replaced the right rear brake hose. Getting them
to do so without coming across as suggesting that is the problem might
be a tough thing to do if I follow Jim's advice on simply stating the
symptoms rather than suggesting a solution. I'm really at a loss here
on how to properly deal with this.

The dragging noise happened again this morning and I applied the
e-brake slightly and did not hear any change in the noise (I was
hesitant to apply it too much though). What is odd is that I have to
back out of a parking stall and I don't hear it when I am going
backwards to back out, only when I am out and move forward, and again,
I only hear the noise for a short time until I get above 5-10 mph.

Well, I will stand "somewhat" corrected..... You must realize, though, that
I am present (far too many times) with a customer request to do one thing or
another.... even though it is readily apparent that what they ask will not
affect their concern...

With the information you have added, I will take it a step further.... once
we see that there is an abnormal condition, such as the evidence of
overheating that you state, it is important that the tech doesn't simply
replace parts in the manner that you indicate... the root cause of the
concern needs to be established otherwise it will simply manifest itself
again. Stiff/sticking caliper pins are easy to discover.... retracting the
caliper pistons would show any binding (if the caliper isn't leaking or
binding or otherwise obviously damaged, why would we replace it?).

When faced with a brake that is obviously overheated, the concientious tech
will do some testing to try to find out why.... Something as simple as
applying the brake hard while still on the hoist and then giving the suspect
wheel(s) a spin by hand immediately after can be quite telling... Any brake
work demands a comprehensive post repair road test.... if signs of
overheating were seen at the time of the repair, it would be a simple matter
to hand check each wheel to compare apparent temps with each other... all of
this should be a no-brainer for the tech....

FWIW, in your case (no matter how the concern is expressed), all that is
happening is someone is treating the symptoms and not treating the
"disease"....


"Bob" > wrote in message
...
> In article .com>,
> > wrote:
> :
> :sf/gf wrote:
> :> Bob:
> :>
> :> I have not followed all of your posts on this, but has the dealer
> replaced
> :> or at least checked the right rear brake hose? I have seen hoses swell
> on
> :> the inside while looking normal on the outside. The swollen hose keeps
> :> brake fluid pressure from returning to normal, thus causing the brakes
> to
> :> drag on the affected wheel.
> :
> :That sort of thing would be consistent with the symptoms. Or say a
> :kinked hose, or dented in rigid brake line- the high pressure in the
> :line during braking would force its way thru to the caliper, but maybe
> :some residual pressure would remain when the pedal is released, keeping
> :the piston in the caliper pressing the brake pad against the disc.
> :
> :So the lines from the right rear to where they join with the left rear
> :should be inspected inch by inch.
> :
> :-Paul
>
> Great comments, guys...thanks very much. The dealer, to my knowledge,
> has not inspected or replaced the right rear brake hose. Getting them
> to do so without coming across as suggesting that is the problem might
> be a tough thing to do if I follow Jim's advice on simply stating the
> symptoms rather than suggesting a solution. I'm really at a loss here
> on how to properly deal with this.
>
> The dragging noise happened again this morning and I applied the
> e-brake slightly and did not hear any change in the noise (I was
> hesitant to apply it too much though). What is odd is that I have to
> back out of a parking stall and I don't hear it when I am going
> backwards to back out, only when I am out and move forward, and again,
> I only hear the noise for a short time until I get above 5-10 mph.

Bob wrote:
> In article .com>,
> > wrote:
> :
> :sf/gf wrote:
> :> Bob:
> :>
> :> I have not followed all of your posts on this, but has the dealer replaced
> :> or at least checked the right rear brake hose? I have seen hoses swell on
> :> the inside while looking normal on the outside. The swollen hose keeps
> :> brake fluid pressure from returning to normal, thus causing the brakes to
> :> drag on the affected wheel.
> :
> :That sort of thing would be consistent with the symptoms. Or say a
> :kinked hose, or dented in rigid brake line- the high pressure in the
> :line during braking would force its way thru to the caliper, but maybe
> :some residual pressure would remain when the pedal is released, keeping
> :the piston in the caliper pressing the brake pad against the disc.
> :
> :So the lines from the right rear to where they join with the left rear
> :should be inspected inch by inch.
> :
> :-Paul
>
> Great comments, guys...thanks very much. The dealer, to my knowledge,
> has not inspected or replaced the right rear brake hose. Getting them
> to do so without coming across as suggesting that is the problem might
> be a tough thing to do if I follow Jim's advice on simply stating the
> symptoms rather than suggesting a solution. I'm really at a loss here
> on how to properly deal with this.
>
> The dragging noise happened again this morning and I applied the
> e-brake slightly and did not hear any change in the noise (I was
> hesitant to apply it too much though). What is odd is that I have to
> back out of a parking stall and I don't hear it when I am going
> backwards to back out, only when I am out and move forward, and again,
> I only hear the noise for a short time until I get above 5-10 mph.

That's interesting- drum brakes do work better in the forward direction
than in reverse. I think your mechanic really needs to rotate that
wheel by hand to figure this out.
-Paul

> That's interesting- drum brakes do work better in the forward direction
> than in reverse. I think your mechanic really needs to rotate that
> wheel by hand to figure this out.
> -Paul

Try going in reverse and hitting the parking brake a few times. Thats
how the drum brakes self adjust themsleves.
Another thought, could it be the ABS module? Maybe it is pressurizing
that wheel's line just enough to drag. Try disconnecting the fuse for
the ABS and see if it still drags.

In article <XPQ6h.14321$C94.4932@edtnps82>,
Jim Warman > wrote:
:Well, I will stand "somewhat" corrected..... You must realize, though, that
:I am present (far too many times) with a customer request to do one thing or
:another.... even though it is readily apparent that what they ask will not
:affect their concern...
:
:With the information you have added, I will take it a step further.... once
:we see that there is an abnormal condition, such as the evidence of
verheating that you state, it is important that the tech doesn't simply
:replace parts in the manner that you indicate... the root cause of the
:concern needs to be established otherwise it will simply manifest itself
:again. Stiff/sticking caliper pins are easy to discover.... retracting the
:caliper pistons would show any binding (if the caliper isn't leaking or
:binding or otherwise obviously damaged, why would we replace it?).
:
:When faced with a brake that is obviously overheated, the concientious tech
:will do some testing to try to find out why.... Something as simple as
:applying the brake hard while still on the hoist and then giving the suspect
:wheel(s) a spin by hand immediately after can be quite telling... Any brake
:work demands a comprehensive post repair road test.... if signs of
verheating were seen at the time of the repair, it would be a simple matter
:to hand check each wheel to compare apparent temps with each other... all of
:this should be a no-brainer for the tech....
:
:FWIW, in your case (no matter how the concern is expressed), all that is
:happening is someone is treating the symptoms and not treating the
:"disease"....

And I could not agree more...

Bob

Sounds to me like it might be a pinched brake line...

When you apply the brake it works but doesn't allow the pressure to release

"Mikepier" > wrote in message
ps.com...
>
>> That's interesting- drum brakes do work better in the forward direction
>> than in reverse. I think your mechanic really needs to rotate that
>> wheel by hand to figure this out.
>> -Paul
>
> Try going in reverse and hitting the parking brake a few times. Thats
> how the drum brakes self adjust themsleves.
> Another thought, could it be the ABS module? Maybe it is pressurizing
> that wheel's line just enough to drag. Try disconnecting the fuse for
> the ABS and see if it still drags.
>

In article <gEH7h.330568$1T2.124151@pd7urf2no>,
brad > wrote:
:Sounds to me like it might be a pinched brake line...
:
:When you apply the brake it works but doesn't allow the pressure to release

Thanks. I think I have it narrowed down to the e-brake because if I
gently apply the e-brake while hearing the dragging noise, the same
sort of dragging noise gets louder (as you would certainly expect) but
from both rear wheels instead of just the right rear. Then when I
release the e-brake, the noise goes away.

I'm still finding it odd that the noise only seems to occur after the
car has sat for a while, such as overnight, and not in the middle of
the day.

:
:"Mikepier" > wrote in message
ups.com...
:>
:>> That's interesting- drum brakes do work better in the forward direction
:>> than in reverse. I think your mechanic really needs to rotate that
:>> wheel by hand to figure this out.
:>> -Paul
:>
:> Try going in reverse and hitting the parking brake a few times. Thats
:> how the drum brakes self adjust themsleves.
:> Another thought, could it be the ABS module? Maybe it is pressurizing
:> that wheel's line just enough to drag. Try disconnecting the fuse for
:> the ABS and see if it still drags.
:>
:
:

Bob wrote:
> In article <gEH7h.330568$1T2.124151@pd7urf2no>,
> brad > wrote:
> :Sounds to me like it might be a pinched brake line...
> :
> :When you apply the brake it works but doesn't allow the pressure to release
>
> Thanks. I think I have it narrowed down to the e-brake because if I
> gently apply the e-brake while hearing the dragging noise, the same
> sort of dragging noise gets louder (as you would certainly expect) but
> from both rear wheels instead of just the right rear. Then when I
> release the e-brake, the noise goes away.
>
> I'm still finding it odd that the noise only seems to occur after the
> car has sat for a while, such as overnight, and not in the middle of
> the day.
>

One possibility is that a little rust forms overnight, which is
polished off after you drive a short distance. I was noticing visible
rust on the discs of my Explorer lately. It's been raining a lot, and I
park it outside. Parking brakes have even been known to stick to the
drum if left set overnight in wet conditions. Driving away pops 'em
loose.

So what you need is to have the star wheel adjustment for that wheel
loosened a bit. See if that makes a difference.
-Paul