7-Series Makeover

Holy Cow.... I think somebody is a little bit sensitive. Corey, are you sleeping with Mr. Bangle? I simply asked when is BMW going to do the next 7 series makeover, and you interpret it as "whining". I think the only "whining" is to be found in your defensive rant. And after your tirade is done, my original question is never even answered!!! When are they doing a makeover?

For the record, and since you brought the subject up, I do think the 7-Series has some issues. I did own a 2003 745i, but I lemon-lawed it after it was in the shop for over 45 days during my first 8 months of ownership. My problems all stemmed from the I-Drive. When one function went out, all the other functions fell like dominoes- just like a computer freezing up. I was unable to use the radio, stereo, i-drive related climate control, phone.... not what you expect from their flagship vehicle. And I was not alone in my grief, I know four other friends who have returned their 7s. I think that BMW made a big mistake in trying to seemlessly integrate so many components. Mechanics are not computer programmers, and I know that the mechanics that worked on my car would have loved to have the option of simply replacing a stereo or phone. Instead, when the i-drive failed, they would try (and fail) to successfully perform the automotive equivalent of a brain transplant.

With regards to the styling of the car, I thought it was interesting, but it did have some obscure lines. I bought it because it was different, but I never thought it was a natural beauty, like say a Meredes CL500 or a Ferrari Dino. I'm sure the 745i will be a classic one day.... age will do that to all vehicles (even a Yugo, Dodge Dart & Ford Pinto are all practically "classics"!!!), but it will never be a classic beauty. To me, being different isn't to be equated with being a great car, being a classic, or even being beautiful. If it was, the Pontiac Aztec would still be in production.

I look forward to the makeover of the 7-Series, when they can refine it, work out the kinks, and smooth out some of it's lines. Which brings me back to my original question: when are they going to do a makeover (however mild that makeover may be) and does anybody have an photos/renditions of what is to be expected?





"Corey Shuman" > wrote in message ups.com...
> Boy another whiner about about the Bangle. Do you realize that you are
> whining about exactly what has made BMW stand apart from other cars for
> upwards of 30 years now? When is the last time you mistook a new 5 or 7
> for a Diamante or an Accord? I remember in the early 80s about the M1,
> was this what to expect in the future? It was ugly, bulky and speed was
> the main concern. Now its a classic. Then there were the 6 series
> whiners. My favorite was I remeber someone calling the 635CSI a "german
> camaro", more people bitching about how BMW was steering away from
> their classic styling, blah, blah, the interior controls were too
> complicated, the rear climate control was completely idiotic.... etc,
> etc, etc..., Now this is also a classic. Last but not least was the
> whining about the e36, how it was a cheap 5 series knock off, it had no
> sportiness, and it was only a way to get a younger crowd into the
> dealership. Well, time will tell on this but people seem to like the
> M3...
> And the I-Drive?? geez... this is technology people, wake up an figure
> out how to use it!!! It is already being copied by Lexus, Infiniti and
> the new Lincoln Nerdigator is slated for a new central control system
> too. Hmm. sounds like BMW has done it again. Let me put it this way, if
> you are too lazy or stupid to learn about the controls in your car then
> you should buy something else, maybe a Civic. Learn how to use it and
> you will be impressed.
> I guess it can be summed up by a quote I once heard. it went something
> like this... The true measure of intelligence is the ability to adapt
> to change... if you cant deal with the new technology and body
> styles... well....
>

Yes, I agree with Meg. Even my BMW service advisor told me not to buy the 7 two years ago. He now says the maintenance issues are pretty much under control. The car is more and more like a computer and it is perhaps wise to stay away from version 1.0. And if they can improve upon it's looks a bit, why not?

"Meg R." > wrote in message news:T81Dd.21971$CH5.4773@fed1read01...
Holy Cow.... I think somebody is a little bit sensitive. Corey, are you sleeping with Mr. Bangle? I simply asked when is BMW going to do the next 7 series makeover, and you interpret it as "whining". I think the only "whining" is to be found in your defensive rant. And after your tirade is done, my original question is never even answered!!! When are they doing a makeover?

For the record, and since you brought the subject up, I do think the 7-Series has some issues. I did own a 2003 745i, but I lemon-lawed it after it was in the shop for over 45 days during my first 8 months of ownership. My problems all stemmed from the I-Drive. When one function went out, all the other functions fell like dominoes- just like a computer freezing up. I was unable to use the radio, stereo, i-drive related climate control, phone.... not what you expect from their flagship vehicle. And I was not alone in my grief, I know four other friends who have returned their 7s. I think that BMW made a big mistake in trying to seemlessly integrate so many components. Mechanics are not computer programmers, and I know that the mechanics that worked on my car would have loved to have the option of simply replacing a stereo or phone. Instead, when the i-drive failed, they would try (and fail) to successfully perform the automotive equivalent of a brain transplant.

With regards to the styling of the car, I thought it was interesting, but it did have some obscure lines. I bought it because it was different, but I never thought it was a natural beauty, like say a Meredes CL500 or a Ferrari Dino. I'm sure the 745i will be a classic one day.... age will do that to all vehicles (even a Yugo, Dodge Dart & Ford Pinto are all practically "classics"!!!), but it will never be a classic beauty. To me, being different isn't to be equated with being a great car, being a classic, or even being beautiful. If it was, the Pontiac Aztec would still be in production.

I look forward to the makeover of the 7-Series, when they can refine it, work out the kinks, and smooth out some of it's lines. Which brings me back to my original question: when are they going to do a makeover (however mild that makeover may be) and does anybody have an photos/renditions of what is to be expected?





"Corey Shuman" > wrote in message ups.com...
> Boy another whiner about about the Bangle. Do you realize that you are
> whining about exactly what has made BMW stand apart from other cars for
> upwards of 30 years now? When is the last time you mistook a new 5 or 7
> for a Diamante or an Accord? I remember in the early 80s about the M1,
> was this what to expect in the future? It was ugly, bulky and speed was
> the main concern. Now its a classic. Then there were the 6 series
> whiners. My favorite was I remeber someone calling the 635CSI a "german
> camaro", more people bitching about how BMW was steering away from
> their classic styling, blah, blah, the interior controls were too
> complicated, the rear climate control was completely idiotic.... etc,
> etc, etc..., Now this is also a classic. Last but not least was the
> whining about the e36, how it was a cheap 5 series knock off, it had no
> sportiness, and it was only a way to get a younger crowd into the
> dealership. Well, time will tell on this but people seem to like the
> M3...
> And the I-Drive?? geez... this is technology people, wake up an figure
> out how to use it!!! It is already being copied by Lexus, Infiniti and
> the new Lincoln Nerdigator is slated for a new central control system
> too. Hmm. sounds like BMW has done it again. Let me put it this way, if
> you are too lazy or stupid to learn about the controls in your car then
> you should buy something else, maybe a Civic. Learn how to use it and
> you will be impressed.
> I guess it can be summed up by a quote I once heard. it went something
> like this... The true measure of intelligence is the ability to adapt
> to change... if you cant deal with the new technology and body
> styles... well....
>

Apparently some sources a week ago had said no later than end of Jan
2005. Engines will be upgraded along with changes to the front and
rear exterior as well as interior changes / i-Drive. Given the silent
treatment from Munich you have to wonder just willing and able BMW is
at fixing the design mistakes.

On the one hand I really admire the BMW design team for being brave.
But bravery isn't enough in the car business, especially at the top end
of the luxury sedan class. I think there were some good ideas but they
were very poorly implemented - I actually like a clean look to
interiors but BMW went way too cheap on the details and way off course
on the ergonomics. The results were pretty meaningless aesthetics that
looked brave but do nothing for the driving or ownership experiences.
Was it van Hooydonk's mistake or did the beancounters get in the way?

Anyway, that stupid TV hump thing on the dashboard is in dire need of
some sort of medical attention - of the surgical kind. OK, back to
shoveling snow.

In ,
Don > decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant
as follows

> but as to styling..Wow, you must be getting better e39s where
>> ever you are at, take a look at the diamante of the same years..
>> similar grill and near identical light and fog placement. Anyway that
>> could be left to personal preference. Accords and maximas have the
>> exact same placement of rear lights etc...

Yeah, because the best places to put lights are at the corners. Kinda stops
crashes.

<snip>
> WHY should driving a car need to be "a bit to get used to"? You don't
> see something wrong with that statement?
>
> once mastered its as simple as other basic controls. I
>> can drive and use the I-Drive as easily as I could drive and change
>> the radio station or adjust the temperature in a regular vehicle.
>> Its not rocket science, if you have a computer running windows you
>> already know the basic structure.

So, to adjust the temperature in a "regular" vehicle you have to; click
mouse, find menu, find part of menu you want, select setting you want,
adjust setting, press back, look at screen again to make sure you've got it
right?

No. That'll be how to do it in the 7 series.

Hmm, in my Merc I do the following; move hand to temp dial, move dial, move
hand away from dial. Enjoy temperature. Exactly the same way I do in the 730
(E32), or the 530d (E60 - this only counts for main temp, for the centre
vents I have to go through all the stupidity involved in the new 7)

>>> Question for you - since you seem to love "new" technology... What is
>>> the actual advantage of the new 5 series (and I'd assume 6
>>> series) turn-signal activation/cancel control? To me - once again,
>>> it seems like an answer to an unasked question. The original design
>>> that has been around since the late 40's seems to work for everyone
>>> else

Works well on the motorway. "light click" gives three flashes, "heavy click"
is as normal. Most new European cars seem to be getting this "feature"


--
Pete M

Mercedes 260E
Ford Capri (ressurection started)
"Never moon a werewolf"

COSOC #5
Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain

Pete M wrote:

> In ,
> Don > decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant
> as follows

I think you're confused.. you're replying not to the points I made, but
to the rant of the original poster.

>> but as to styling..Wow, you must be getting better e39s where
>>
>>>ever you are at, take a look at the diamante of the same years..
>>>similar grill and near identical light and fog placement. Anyway that
>>>could be left to personal preference. Accords and maximas have the
>>>exact same placement of rear lights etc...
>
>
> Yeah, because the best places to put lights are at the corners. Kinda stops
> crashes.

The point being? I believe I pointed out that the Japanese cars have
COPIED the styling of the E39, including light placement.

Someone else posted:


>>>can drive and use the I-Drive as easily as I could drive and change
>>>the radio station or adjust the temperature in a regular vehicle.
>>>Its not rocket science, if you have a computer running windows you
>>>already know the basic structure.

I believe you replied:

> So, to adjust the temperature in a "regular" vehicle you have to; click
> mouse, find menu, find part of menu you want, select setting you want,
> adjust setting, press back, look at screen again to make sure you've got it
> right?
>
> No. That'll be how to do it in the 7 series.

Once again - I was objecting to the use of I-drive, as it sounds like
you are also, unless I'm confused in what your reply is referring to,
which is entirely possible since it is a confusing reply.

> Hmm, in my Merc I do the following; move hand to temp dial, move dial, move
> hand away from dial. Enjoy temperature. Exactly the same way I do in the 730
> (E32), or the 530d (E60 - this only counts for main temp, for the centre
> vents I have to go through all the stupidity involved in the new 7)

It sounds like you're not too happy with the E60 design, or did I miss
something here?

I had asked:

>>>>Question for you - since you seem to love "new" technology... What is
>>>>the actual advantage of the new 5 series (and I'd assume 6
>>>>series) turn-signal activation/cancel control?

> Works well on the motorway. "light click" gives three flashes, "heavy click"
> is as normal. Most new European cars seem to be getting this "feature"

But - it is something you can do now without any change on almost every
car made today. You can partly depress the turn-signal and it will flash
until released, or click it over to have it hold until the wheel is turned.

The worst part of the "new" scenario will be Mr. Oldster, driving down
the road completely oblivious to his left turn signal telling us he's
going to turn into the divider. It's bad enough now - they will be
completely clueless with the new design.

And - I believe you must not drive in NJ - use of turnsignals to
indicate a lane change is strictly verboten. :-)

Don

Michael,

Thanks for the info... You are the only one who actually addressed my
original post!


"Michael Low" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Apparently some sources a week ago had said no later than end of Jan
> 2005. Engines will be upgraded along with changes to the front and
> rear exterior as well as interior changes / i-Drive. Given the silent
> treatment from Munich you have to wonder just willing and able BMW is
> at fixing the design mistakes.
>
> On the one hand I really admire the BMW design team for being brave.
> But bravery isn't enough in the car business, especially at the top end
> of the luxury sedan class. I think there were some good ideas but they
> were very poorly implemented - I actually like a clean look to
> interiors but BMW went way too cheap on the details and way off course
> on the ergonomics. The results were pretty meaningless aesthetics that
> looked brave but do nothing for the driving or ownership experiences.
> Was it van Hooydonk's mistake or did the beancounters get in the way?
>
> Anyway, that stupid TV hump thing on the dashboard is in dire need of
> some sort of medical attention - of the surgical kind. OK, back to
> shoveling snow.
>

There is no law that says we have to address any particular questions when
we answer a post... :-)

Nice, mild weather in London this week, so far. My wife thought she heard
it is turning significantly colder again, but there is little evidence for
that on weather.co.uk... Perhaps she meant that it will get wet again....

DAS
--
For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
---

"Meg R." > wrote in message
news:88lDd.22070$CH5.6999@fed1read01...
> Michael,
>
> Thanks for the info... You are the only one who actually addressed my
> original post!
[...]

Well, I enjoy shoveling snow. Today's snow was even more welcomed
because my @#$%^& fridge developed a self-defrost problem some time ago
and I had to defrost and repair it today. Luckily the squirrels
weren't interested in frozen pizzas and veggie burgers.

We got plastered with snow over Christmas and it was nice. Good excuse
not to go anywhere ;#)

As I tirelessly tell my Toronto-based colleagues, you live in a freezer...

Also said I never want to have to go there mid-Dec to Mar...

Anyone who bets it snows in southern England on Christmas Day has the same
chance of winning the lottery...

DAS
--
For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
---

"Michael Low" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Well, I enjoy shoveling snow. Today's snow was even more welcomed
> because my @#$%^& fridge developed a self-defrost problem some time ago
> and I had to defrost and repair it today. Luckily the squirrels
> weren't interested in frozen pizzas and veggie burgers.
>
> We got plastered with snow over Christmas and it was nice. Good excuse
> not to go anywhere ;#)
>

(Randy S) haute in die Tasten:

> Opinions, opinions. I love BMWs, but if I was GIVEN a new 7-series,
> I'd sell it and buy something else.
>

ACK, but given the fact that the most expensive car I ever bought cost me
some 13.000 USD, this statement is true for about any car which would bring
some 70.000 USD when I sell it;-)

If the BMW CEO would appear and offered me exactly one car out of the BMW
range which I would be given for free, including all running cost and
maintenance, but I'd have to keep it, I'd probably chose either a 330Ci
convertible or a 535d touring. A BMW 760i with all options would probably
be my 3rd choice.

Frank



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