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More proof that incresed speed does not equal incresed death



 
 
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  #31  
Old July 2nd 05, 02:52 AM
Garth Almgren
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Around 7/1/2005 6:44 PM, Arif Khokar wrote:

> C. E. White wrote:
>
>> > wrote:

>
>>> http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/doi...8.2005.00152.x

>
>> Thanks, that provided a little more information, but I am not prepared to
>> purchase the full study.

>
> If you live near a university, why not go to their library and try to
> access the same page from there. I was able to access the full study
> without having to purchase it.



Wonderful idea. In fact, I just downloaded a PDF of the full text
through the U of W's library.

And no, I'm not sharing.


--
~/Garth |"I believe that it is better to tell the truth than a lie.
Almgren | I believe it is better to be free than to be a slave.
******* | And I believe it is better to know than to be ignorant."
for secure mail info) --H.L. Mencken (1880-1956)
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  #32  
Old July 2nd 05, 06:41 AM
Laura Bush murdered her boy friend
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Garth Almgren wrote:
>
> Wonderful idea. In fact, I just downloaded a PDF of the full text
> through the U of W's library.
>
> And no, I'm not sharing.


Because it supports what i've been saying. High speeds = more vehicular
murders.

  #33  
Old July 2nd 05, 09:50 AM
Garth Almgren
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Around 7/1/2005 10:41 PM, Aunt Judy (Pride of Diarrhea)
<http://tinyurl.com/65nqz> wrote:

> Garth Almgren wrote:
>
>>Wonderful idea. In fact, I just downloaded a PDF of the full text
>>through the U of W's library.
>>
>>And no, I'm not sharing.

>
>
> Because it supports what i've been saying.


Nope, because, unlike you, I'm not one to redistribute clearly
copyrighted and restricted material online.






And FYI, no, it doesn't even come close to supporting what you've been
saying. Either read the report for yourself or just take my word for it
(the latter costs you quite a bit less).


A juicy quote from the last paragraph:
"The estimated effects reveal that the assertion that speed kills, and
more speed kills more is mostly unfounded."


--
~/Garth
"I am patient with stupidity
but not with those who are proud of it." - Edith Sitwell
(Mail for secure contact information)
  #34  
Old July 2nd 05, 06:28 PM
Ed White
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I did read the MUTCD and even quoted part of it in another post. It
answered none of these questions. If you want to show me where these
questions are answered in the MUTCD, please do so.

I believe I do understand the 85th percentile rule, which is why I feel
it is so silly.

Here is what I believe

- The 85th percentile rule is arbitrary (why the 85th percentile and
not the 90th percentile, or the 75th percentile)
- There are no studies that I can find that "prove" that setting a
speed limts at the 85th percentile speed results in the lowest accident
and/or fatality rate (I am sure you have one that is not easily
accessed)
- The cheif rationale for using the 85th percentile rule to set speed
limits seems to be - "People ignore speed limtis, so we might as well
set them high enough so that only 15% of the people are vioating the
law."
- The 85th percentile speed is based solely on people's opinions of
their capabilities. I know many people who have an unjustifiably high
opinion of their driving ability. I know others who are competent to
drive at well over the average speed of traffic. Why should they be
limited to the speed that 85% of the people are comfortable with. Why
should others be encouraged to drive faster (or be harassed for driving
at less than the speed limt) becasue the speed limit is set to high?
- The 85th percentile speed is not the normal speed of traffic or the
average speed of traffic. It is just the speed that 85 percent of the
drvier are not exceeding. The average speed of traffic might be much
lower. So setting the speed limit at the 85th percentile may not have
any effect as far as evening out the traffic flow and preventing clumps
of car where faster cars are trapped behind slower cars.
- It appears to me that the 85th percentile rule is just a politically
correct way to set speed limits so that you can identify an easy to
persecute minority.

Ed

  #35  
Old July 2nd 05, 06:37 PM
Arif Khokar
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Ed White wrote:

> - The 85th percentile speed is not the normal speed of traffic or the
> average speed of traffic. It is just the speed that 85 percent of the
> drvier are not exceeding. The average speed of traffic might be much
> lower.


The difference between the 50th and 85th percentile speeds is usually
around 5 to 7 mph. The 10 mph pace speed consists of 70 to 90 percent
of traffic.

As others have noticed, you have the bad habit of posting ridiculous
assumptions about a topic that you claim to have researched. You claim
that you've "read" the MUTCD, but I seriously doubt you've read Ch.1.
  #36  
Old July 2nd 05, 07:37 PM
Ed White
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Sigh, I don't think my assumptions are ridiculous at all. You are free
to feel otherwise. Instead of claiming I did not read the MUTCD, why
not qoutre the portion of it that answers my questions and/or refute my
assumptions. It is freely available on line, so you can't claim you are
violating any principals if you quoote parts of it (of course quoting
portions of copywrited material is completely legal as long as you
attribute it to the orignal source - but you pprobably know that).

Regards,

Ed White

  #39  
Old July 2nd 05, 08:53 PM
Ivan
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In article >,
william lynch > wrote:

>
> The rates aren't dropping, but have flatlined, which means the
> amount of deaths are rising. Check your facts before spouting
> off next time.
>
> http://www.nhtsa.com/people/Crash/crashstatistics/




Agency: Highway death rate hits new low
By Ken Thomas, Associated Press Writer | April 21, 2005

WASHINGTON --The highway fatality rate sank to a record low last year,
the government estimated Thursday, but the administration and auto
safety advocates bemoaned an increase in the total number of traffic
deaths and urged a national focus on seat belt use.

The fatality rate dropped even as the total number of traffic deaths
crept up because more drivers were on the road.

The fatality rate slid from 1.48 deaths per 100 million vehicle miles
traveled in 2003 to 1.46 deaths in 2004. It was the lowest since records
were first kept in 1966, when the rate was 5.50 deaths.

The data released Thursday are considered projections. NHTSA plans to
release final 2004 fatality figures in August. NHTSA collects crash
statistics from all 50 states.

------

On the Net:

National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov
  #40  
Old July 3rd 05, 01:37 AM
Arif Khokar
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Ed White wrote:

> Sigh, I don't think my assumptions are ridiculous at all. You are free
> to feel otherwise. Instead of claiming I did not read the MUTCD, why
> not qoutre the portion of it that answers my questions and/or refute my
> assumptions.


Because you're supposed to do your own homework. In any case, none of
the dns servers I use are unable to resolve http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov
 




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