Need some Turbo Direct Injection(TDI) site!!

There are some very good quality frames made of high tech (carbon,
aluminum, TI) materials and there is a lot of run-of-the-mill steel
stuff. Just like the frames U.S. makers once constructed. In it's
heyday Schwinn made a wide range of frames too.

I agree, Taiwan like most countries went through a cycle of development
and growth. And the products they were once known for may not have
been of the highest quality. But like Korea and so many other
countries Taiwan has moved beyond those early stages. It is a
significant economic force that delivers quality goods and services at
a level that it is not given credit for. It is unfortunate that old
stereotypes just get carried on and on. Japan continued for a long
time to be associated with it's immediate post-war reputation for
sometimes shoddy goods.

Dan Stern said: "Thank you, John, for reminding me that I need to
killfile you for
rec.autos.driving, and not just rec.autos.tech. "


Thank goodness for small favors. Please also consider killfiling your
own sometimes off-topic (to say the least) messages....

It's unfortunate you choose to go on a rampage with people from other
countries because of their limited english language skills. Did you
ever stop for once and consider how such tirades come across to others?
Clearly you have something to offer this and other auto forums but
that message gets lost.

John S. wrote:
> There are some very good quality frames made of high tech (carbon,
> aluminum, TI) materials and there is a lot of run-of-the-mill steel
> stuff. Just like the frames U.S. makers once constructed. In it's
> heyday Schwinn made a wide range of frames too.
>
> I agree, Taiwan like most countries went through a cycle of development
> and growth. And the products they were once known for may not have
> been of the highest quality. But like Korea and so many other
> countries Taiwan has moved beyond those early stages. It is a
> significant economic force that delivers quality goods and services at
> a level that it is not given credit for. It is unfortunate that old
> stereotypes just get carried on and on. Japan continued for a long
> time to be associated with it's immediate post-war reputation for
> sometimes shoddy goods.

And it was a well-earned reputation, just as Taiwan's is today. I am
skeptical of your claim that Taiwan has "moved beyond those early
stages."

nate

On Fri, 27 May 2005, N8N wrote:

> John S. wrote:

> > I agree, Taiwan like most countries went through a cycle of
> > development and growth. And the products they were once known for may
> > not have been of the highest quality. But like Korea and so many
> > other countries Taiwan has moved beyond those early stages. It is a
> > significant economic force that delivers quality goods Japan continued
> > for a long time to be associated with it's immediate post-war
> > reputation for sometimes shoddy goods.

> And it was a well-earned reputation, just as Taiwan's is today. I am
> skeptical of your claim that Taiwan has "moved beyond those early
> stages."

John S. is either an MBA or "thinks" like one.

Good question. From everything I read they have a long established
reputation as a quality producer of a wide range of high tech
electronic components. Mainland china is certainly galloping along in
that market too, but Taiwan has long been recognized as a source of
everything from memory chips to flat screen monitors to full pc's.
They are not as big a player in the textiles market as they once were,
but they are still a presence. Heck, I just laundered five new shirts
that were made in Taiwan of material from either Italy, Austria or
Germany. They seem to be doing quite well as a trader....

Taiwan is also a big player in international finance, particularly in
in funding asian development and aid projects. They were once "on the
dole" with the U.S. in the early cold war years, but have advanced
beyond that role.

It's clear to me that Taiwan is a big asian presence and that is one of
the reasons for China's continuing interest in having a direct voice in
their future. Like India, Taiwan is not very high on the horizon of
most americans, but it is a big presence in asia.

John S. wrote:

> It's unfortunate you choose to go on a rampage with people from other
> countries because of their limited english language skills.

Perhaps one should only try to communicate in a language they have a
reasonable degree of fluency in. That's why I type in English. If I
were to try to communicate in another language I'm not well versed in, I
would be largely be perceived as an idiot by native speakers of that
language.

John S. wrote:
> Good question. From everything I read they have a long established
> reputation as a quality producer of a wide range of high tech
> electronic components. Mainland china is certainly galloping along in
> that market too, but Taiwan has long been recognized as a source of
> everything from memory chips to flat screen monitors to full pc's.
> They are not as big a player in the textiles market as they once were,
> but they are still a presence. Heck, I just laundered five new shirts
> that were made in Taiwan of material from either Italy, Austria or
> Germany. They seem to be doing quite well as a trader....
>

I'm not impressed with the quality of *any* "high tech electronic
components" on the market today. Computer parts in particular seem to
be engineered to be as cheap as possible, and therefore often fail even
before they're obsolete, which is saying a lot.

> Taiwan is also a big player in international finance, particularly in
> in funding asian development and aid projects. They were once "on the
> dole" with the U.S. in the early cold war years, but have advanced
> beyond that role.
>
> It's clear to me that Taiwan is a big asian presence and that is one of
> the reasons for China's continuing interest in having a direct voice in
> their future. Like India, Taiwan is not very high on the horizon of
> most americans, but it is a big presence in asia.

But finance isn't the same as actually producing goods...

nate

John S. wrote:

> Good question. From everything I read they have a long established
> reputation as a quality producer

Ah, so you're basing your high-handed, strident comments on stuff you've
*read*. How quaint. I've worked in Product Development long enough, and
for enough companies, to have a _much_ more accurate picture of Taiwan
than you've gotten from reading newspapers and magazines (and perhaps the
occasional interweb article).

"Perhaps one should only try to communicate in a language they have a
reasonable degree of fluency in. That's why I type in English."

To a point I agree. That works reasonably well if you are a speaker of
the majority language (english) on this forum. It works decidedly less
well for speakers of chinese dialects who are not fluent in english.

This would not be an issue if Resident Experts would simply answer the
question or just say nothing. Too many RE's feel it necessary to
deride less-than-perfect english and make pointedly racist comments.
His request was pretty straightforward I thought. Instead of showing a
bit of compassion and exhibiting their knowlege some of our RE's take
upon themselves to send such a hostile answer that they drive people
away.

Same thing happened on another thread the same day!

Instead of contributing to the solution they contribute to the problem.

"I'm not impressed with the quality of *any* "high tech electronic
components" on the market today. Computer parts in particular seem to
be engineered to be as cheap as possible, and therefore often fail even

before they're obsolete, which is saying a lot.

JS> Well they (the Taiwan mnufacturers) seem to be attracting a lot of
repeat business. Consumers would not sit still for a high return rate.
Computers are quite cheap (or inexpensive). They have evolved into
disposable consumer products that can be upgraded but are rarely
repaired because the technology has moved far by the time they wear
out. Televisions are an example of a good that has become highly
reliable and quite cheap. So cheap that there is no demand for
repairmen any more.

> Taiwan is also a big player in international finance, particularly in
> in funding asian development and aid projects. They were once "on the
> dole" with the U.S. in the early cold war years, but have advanced
> beyond that role.

> It's clear to me that Taiwan is a big asian presence and that is one of
> the reasons for China's continuing interest in having a direct voice in
> their future. Like India, Taiwan is not very high on the horizon of
> most americans, but it is a big presence in asia.

"But finance isn't the same as actually producing goods... "

JS> True, but it is very necessary for any country including Taiwan.
And the money facilitates manufacturing. And it is also indicative of
the size of their business and reputation they have established that
they can broker funds and transactions from around the globe. They can
use their strength in finance to allow them to participate in
development and aid projects in less well off asian areas.

I think their record is pretty impressive. I believe they have some
sort of provisional status with the WTO that is limited because of
local politics.