Unwanted Complexity

I was born in 1941.I remember when radios and heaters and some other
things were optional equipment for cars and trucks.
cuhulin

On Jun 1, 2:01*pm, wrote:
> I was born in 1941.I remember when radios and heaters and some other
> things were optional equipment for cars and trucks.
> cuhulin

Recently got 66 Datsun. minimum not even assisted braking.
Before last month, I never had a vehicle with electric windows.
Now I got a loaded Avalanch. I took me over 3 days to figure
everything. Heated washer fluid,
Retractable mirrors, load leveling, front and rear video and
navigation.
Rainn sense wipers, auto lights. It DOES NOT have retractable running
oards. I'm sad.

Greg

I have rode standing up on my Uncle's pickup truck before.That was back
in the early 1950s.Sometimes, some people would be sitting down on
running boards, just talking/shooting the breeze.Of course that was on
vehicles that were sitting still.
cuhulin

On Jun 1, 6:17*pm, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
> AD > wrote:
> >On May 31, 4:17=A0pm, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
> >bmw of the usa does not want to break $30k barrier downward into mini
> >territory I guess.
> >Part of the brand image preservation program (TM).
>
> >Speaking of which: is basic cooper or cooper S bare enough for your
> >tastes
> >or you share my aversion for fwd?
>
> Cooper S is right out. *FWD, no spare tire. *The basic model I might be able
> to live with. *It handles amazingly well for FWD although I don't think I
> would be able to change a clutch. *Changing the clutch on the 2002 is about
> two hour's work in the driveway with some 2X4s to lower the transmission.
> And a spare gaibo since I have wrecked one every time I have dropped the thing.
>
ok, thanks for sparing the world from yet another front wheel driver

> >> See...the current BMW 5-series is just gargantuan. =A0I would call that b=
> >igger
> >> than midsize, personally. =A0Maybe that's part of my issue.
>
> >it's fullsize, had been for a long time I suspect.
> >Any problems with bmw bread and butter 3xx? last time I checked it was
> >not
> >screwed up in a major way with options overload
>
> I think that's probably where I'm going to be going. *Still lots of junk
> on it.

i believe it can be had without idrive

> >Childseats are problematic in compacts: kid legs touch the backs of
> >front seats.
> >Not a problem if you are done reproducing (see cooper above)
>
> I have been avoiding reproduction. *As a child I remember sitting between
> my parents on the parking brake of the MGB on long drives. *So while I think
> child seats are a good idea, I do find the current obsession with safety to
> be a little over the top.
> --scott
> --

for me it's no so much safety as a convenience for carrying an infant
with only one parent present.

during outdoor barbeque it's convient to plop the whole assembly with
the sleeping thing and relocate it wherever you need

cheap child seats I use would hardly protect much in an event of a
crash

wrote:
> I have rode standing up on my Uncle's pickup truck before.That was back
> in the early 1950s.Sometimes, some people would be sitting down on
> running boards, just talking/shooting the breeze.Of course that was on
> vehicles that were sitting still.
> cuhulin
>


Teenagers were smarter back then:
http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/ktl...,7997948.story

http://preview.tinyurl.com/6j7qvg5

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

On Jun 1, 6:17*pm, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
> AD > wrote:
> >On May 31, 4:17=A0pm, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
> >bmw of the usa does not want to break $30k barrier downward into mini
> >territory I guess.
> >Part of the brand image preservation program (TM).
>
> >Speaking of which: is basic cooper or cooper S bare enough for your
> >tastes
> >or you share my aversion for fwd?
>
> Cooper S is right out. *FWD, no spare tire. *The basic model I might be able
> to live with. *It handles amazingly well for FWD although I don't think I
> would be able to change a clutch. *Changing the clutch on the 2002 is about
> two hour's work in the driveway with some 2X4s to lower the transmission.
> And a spare gaibo since I have wrecked one every time I have dropped the thing.
>
> >> See...the current BMW 5-series is just gargantuan. =A0I would call that b=
> >igger
> >> than midsize, personally. =A0Maybe that's part of my issue.
>
> >it's fullsize, had been for a long time I suspect.
> >Any problems with bmw bread and butter 3xx? last time I checked it was
> >not
> >screwed up in a major way with options overload
>
> I think that's probably where I'm going to be going. *Still lots of junk
> on it.
>
I drove 1997 520i stripper last night
you get dual zone climate and as far as junk goes there is sunroof and
that's it.
Still could be handy to vent hot air out when it's hot outside.

I could not feel any engine vibration or heard any unpleasant noises
from that 4 banger :----------O

Not an issue for you since you are in the states.

Good luck finding bare bones bmw there.

On 6/1/2011 3:15 AM, AD wrote:
> On May 31, 2:26 pm, > wrote:
>> On 5/28/2011 12:38 PM, Vic Smith wrote:
>>
>>> I'm doing the lower intake gasket on my '97 Lumina.
>>> 160k miles, and hasn't failed, but since they are known to fail, I'm
>>> not taking any chances since I decided to keep it a couple more years,
>>> and do the annual Florida trip again. That's about 3K miles total..
>>
>> You're in luck. When the electric car takes over, complexity will drop
>> way down. No need to replace the intake gasket cause there won't be any
>> intake. Unfortunately, there will still probably be a lot of air-bags
>> and my guess is that we won't be using keys to start cars anymore.
>>
> I knew a guy who parked his 600 V12 series near a TV station and did
> not bother to
> bring the physical key. Well, TV overpowered his remote entry fob.
>
> I vote for simpler low tech solutions any day.

I agree with this. My point was that a car with 2 electric motors,
controller, and batteries would be dead simple compared to a car with a
conventional internal combustion drivetrain and all those things needed
to keep the piston engine happy. Dead simple is always good. OTOH, a
dead simple car security system might be taking things too far. :-)

On Jun 3, 1:20*pm, dsi1 > wrote:
> On 6/1/2011 3:15 AM, AD wrote:
>
>
>
> > On May 31, 2:26 pm, > *wrote:
> >> On 5/28/2011 12:38 PM, Vic Smith wrote:
>
> >>> I'm doing the lower intake gasket on my '97 Lumina.
> >>> 160k miles, and hasn't failed, but since they are known to fail, I'm
> >>> not taking any chances since I decided to keep it a couple more years,
> >>> and do the annual Florida trip again. *That's about 3K miles total...
>
> >> You're in luck. When the electric car takes over, complexity will drop
> >> way down. No need to replace the intake gasket cause there won't be any
> >> intake. Unfortunately, there will still probably be a lot of air-bags
> >> and my guess is that we won't be using keys to start cars anymore.
>
> > I knew a guy who parked his 600 V12 series near a TV station and did
> > not bother to
> > bring the physical key. Well, TV overpowered his remote entry fob.
>
> > I vote for simpler low tech solutions any day.
>
> I agree with this. My point was that a car with 2 electric motors,
> controller, and batteries would be dead simple compared to a car with a
> conventional internal combustion drivetrain and all those things needed
> to keep the piston engine happy. Dead simple is always good. OTOH, a
> dead simple car security system might be taking things too far. :-)

Electric car would not be effective at freeway speeds.
Hence you do need conventional transmission, though 2 or 3 speeds
might
be sufficient. That and electic motor to feed the rear wheels.

And then you need two electric motors in front wheels
to have a 3 wheel drive setup in snowbelt.

Then you could step further to do active vectoring on the rear axle
the way acura (and now nissan juke) does it.

all of a sudden a lot of the complexity of the piston engine is back
in.

My preference is for a conventional classic (rwd) setup
with the two electrical motors for the front wheels for low speed
unstuck assist.

Street Legal electric Golf Carts,,, Yeah, that's the Ticket.(not really
though)

A couple of years ago I saw somewhere on the web about a company
building street legal Golf Carts.
cuhulin

On Jun 5, 9:50*pm, AD > wrote:
> On Jun 3, 1:20*pm, dsi1 > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 6/1/2011 3:15 AM, AD wrote:
>
> > > On May 31, 2:26 pm, > *wrote:
> > >> On 5/28/2011 12:38 PM, Vic Smith wrote:
>
> > >>> I'm doing the lower intake gasket on my '97 Lumina.
> > >>> 160k miles, and hasn't failed, but since they are known to fail, I'm
> > >>> not taking any chances since I decided to keep it a couple more years,
> > >>> and do the annual Florida trip again. *That's about 3K miles total..
>
> > >> You're in luck. When the electric car takes over, complexity will drop
> > >> way down. No need to replace the intake gasket cause there won't be any
> > >> intake. Unfortunately, there will still probably be a lot of air-bags
> > >> and my guess is that we won't be using keys to start cars anymore.
>
> > > I knew a guy who parked his 600 V12 series near a TV station and did
> > > not bother to
> > > bring the physical key. Well, TV overpowered his remote entry fob.
>
> > > I vote for simpler low tech solutions any day.
>
> > I agree with this. My point was that a car with 2 electric motors,
> > controller, and batteries would be dead simple compared to a car with a
> > conventional internal combustion drivetrain and all those things needed
> > to keep the piston engine happy. Dead simple is always good. OTOH, a
> > dead simple car security system might be taking things too far. :-)
>
> Electric car would not be effective at freeway speeds.
> Hence you do need conventional transmission, though 2 or 3 speeds
> might
> be sufficient. That and electic motor to feed the rear wheels.
>
> And then you need two electric motors in front wheels
> to have a 3 wheel drive setup in snowbelt.
>
> Then you could step further to do active vectoring on the rear axle
> the way acura (and now nissan juke) does it.
>
> all of a sudden a lot of the complexity of the piston engine is back
> in.
>
> My preference is for a conventional classic (rwd) setup
> with the two electrical motors for the front wheels for low speed
> unstuck assist.

Hybrids seem to be the worst option of all if you value simplicity.
Maybe you could have an steam powered heater installed too. :-)