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#11
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"Dori A Schmetterling" > wrote in message ... >A bold assertion. Purely a matter of opinion, don't you think? > > DAS I don't disagree that's it opinion. But, I don't know many people that disagree with me on it. |
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#12
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Must be something in American genes...
;-) DAS -- For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- "James C. Reeves" > wrote in message ... > [...] > > But, I don't know many people that disagree with me on it. > |
#13
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James C. Reeves wrote:
> > > Chrysler/Dodge had (past tense) the best looking cars on the > road...bar-none! True at several points in history: In the 30s with the Imperial, in the 40s with the original Town&Country, in 1955 with the first 300, in 1957-58 with the 300C and 300D. In 1966-1970 with the Charger and GTX. In the mid-70s with the last full-size Newport and New Yorker. In 1993 with the first Intrepid/Concorde/Vision models. >Most apparently gone now! I disagree. The "in" styling trend is simply one that is not as appealing to me overall as the styling trends of years ago. But within that trend, I'll pick the Magnum and 300c over *ANYTHING* else out there. And in fact, I like it much better than most of the second-generation LH cars, especially the sawed-off stub-tailed square-trunked pinched-nosed 300M which was never attractive to me at all. IMO, the best looking Chrysler products since the mid 70s were the first-gen LH cars. I think that you have to judge the styling of the CURRENT Mopars against other current designs. That means the Magnum competes with this thing, which looks like an ill-tempered set of venitian blinds on wheels: http://www.cadillac.com/cadillacjsp/...model=srx&df=y and the 300c competes with stuff like this: http://www.cadillac.com/cadillacjsp/...model=sts&df=y Can you seriously tell me that the 300c and Magnum don't win? > The Benz's have always been > ugly. Yep. From the 60s through the 90s they looked like less-interesting versions of a Checker Marathon. Now they all look just like your average Nisshondoyota. |
#14
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> Toyota didn't build market share by comressing it's offerings. Look at how > many very different models of vehicles they sell! By my count, its been Corolla, Celica, Camry, and Avalon for like 20 years (if you count the Cressida before the Avalon). And the Avalon is a market disaster. Now if you count Lexus and Scion, I guess you're right. I will also give them credit for bringing out a 2-door Camry (Solara) even if they did make it so butt-fugly about 2 years ago that no one in their right mind would be seen driving it. Same for the Celica. |
#15
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Dori A Schmetterling wrote:
> How about the other way round? > > DAS I don't think so. In particular, MB rear taillamp treatments on the market this year look VERY much like Hondas and Camrys from 3-5 years ago. Ah, found some supporting photos. 2003 Honduhh Accord coupe: http://www.mbusa.com/media/images/ma...L500C_main.jpg 2005 Benz CL: http://www.mbusa.com/media/images/ma...L500C_main.jpg If those aren't clones, I don't know what qualifies. Yes, I'd rather have the Benz (as a former frequent-poster once told me, I have a "feral hatred" of Asian cars). But I'd rather have a '71 GTX than either of them :-) http://www.moparmuscleclub-sa.org/im...2/P9281823.jpg Its all part of the homogenization of automotive styling. Very few designs truly stand out anymore, and the Magnum/300C definitely do. So do the Cadillacs and the Pontiac Aztek, but to my eye they stand out in a BAD way. Kinda like the way a skunk stands out in a flower garden. |
#16
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Steve wrote:
> Dori A Schmetterling wrote: > >> How about the other way round? >> >> DAS > > > I don't think so. In particular, MB rear taillamp treatments on the > market this year look VERY much like Hondas and Camrys from 3-5 years ago. > > Ah, found some supporting photos. > 2003 Honduhh Accord coupe: > http://www.mbusa.com/media/images/ma...L500C_main.jpg Obviously that's NOT the link I intended to put there. This is: http://www.familycar.com/RoadTests/H...s/LeftRear.jpg > > 2005 Benz CL: > http://www.mbusa.com/media/images/ma...L500C_main.jpg > > If those aren't clones, I don't know what qualifies. Yes, I'd rather > have the Benz (as a former frequent-poster once told me, I have a "feral > hatred" of Asian cars). But I'd rather have a '71 GTX than either of > them :-) > http://www.moparmuscleclub-sa.org/im...2/P9281823.jpg > > > Its all part of the homogenization of automotive styling. Very few > designs truly stand out anymore, and the Magnum/300C definitely do. So > do the Cadillacs and the Pontiac Aztek, but to my eye they stand out in > a BAD way. Kinda like the way a skunk stands out in a flower garden. |
#17
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Dori A Schmetterling wrote:
> > Both GM and Ford have, as you know, vast operations outside the US, but you > don't see a lot of Cadillacs here. Nope. You get Opels, Australia gets Holdens, and we occasionally get an Opel hauled over here, face-lifted and marketed unsuccessfully as a Cadillac (ie, the Catera). Our current Pontiac GTO is a re-worked Holden- wonderful mechanically but given such nondescript styling that its going to be doomed to about the same fate as the Catera :-( > > In this sense DC now is little different from GM or Ford, having separate > operations in US and Europe, with only some interchange between them. Same as it was 30 years ago before Chrysler scaled back its own European (and Austrialian, and South African) manufacturing and marketing divisons. That's part of what Chrysler was going to "get back" with the "merger" with Mercedes.... of course things turned out a bit differently. |
#18
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See below.
DAS -- For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- "Steve" > wrote in message ... > Dori A Schmetterling wrote: > >> >> Both GM and Ford have, as you know, vast operations outside the US, but >> you don't see a lot of Cadillacs here. > > Nope. You get Opels, Australia gets Holdens, and we occasionally get an > Opel hauled over here, face-lifted and marketed unsuccessfully as a > Cadillac (ie, the Catera). Our current Pontiac GTO is a re-worked Holden- > wonderful mechanically but given such nondescript styling that its going > to be doomed to about the same fate as the Catera :-( DAS: What do you mean "nope"? As you said, you only "ocasionally" get Opels made in Germany (or Vauxhalls made in England for that matter) in the US. I did not say there is NO interchange. The Holden/Monaro/Pontiac is an exception, and not many of those will be sold in the US or anywhere, since it is a specialist car. Relatively cheap bang for the buck, but that's just about all We do not see many Cadillacs in Europe. There are a fair a number of stretch limos in London -- an incongrous sight -- but, again, these are not mass-market vehicles. In the UK Chrysler has officially been selling Neons, Jeeps & Grand Voyagers for mayn years and the available range should expand now that MB is behind it. On the Continent (e.g. Germany and The Netherlands) a bigger range is already available. We do not see, as a rule, any of Ford's US products, such a Lincoln. http://www.ford.co.uk/ie/current_pro...rid=textsearch >> >> In this sense DC now is little different from GM or Ford, having separate >> operations in US and Europe, with only some interchange between them. > > Same as it was 30 years ago before Chrysler scaled back its own European > (and Austrialian, and South African) manufacturing and marketing divisons. > That's part of what Chrysler was going to "get back" with the "merger" > with Mercedes.... of course things turned out a bit differently. DAS: Yes, Chrysler manufacturing as stopped (not very good cars anyway), but even here they were 'European', not American. Maybe that is why Chrysler has been selling a comparatively lot of 'US' vehicles in Europe because of lack of manufacture here. Come to think of it, DC is maybe ahead of GM and Ford in internationalising its sales across all brands and manufaturing locations... |
#19
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Dori A Schmetterling wrote:
>>Both GM and Ford have, as you know, vast operations outside the US, but >>>> you don't see a lot of Cadillacs here. > >> >> Nope. You get Opels, Australia gets Holdens, and we occasionally get an >> Opel hauled over here, face-lifted and marketed unsuccessfully as a >> Cadillac (ie, the Catera). Our current Pontiac GTO is a re-worked Holden- >> wonderful mechanically but given such nondescript styling that its going >> to be doomed to about the same fate as the Catera :-( DAS: What do you mean "nope"? As you said, you only "ocasionally" get Opels made in Germany (or Vauxhalls made in England for that matter) in the US. Sorry- it was a poorly worded agreement with you, as in "Nope, you sure don't see many Cadillacs over there, you get Opels (or Vauxhalls) instead." My bad. By the way, whatever you do with your newsreader makes it really difficult to keep a thread coherent. When I just hit "reply," the only thing that copies in is "your "see below" and then there's nothing below. I had to go back and cut/paste the dialogue above, and the attribution is one level off now. Just a comment. |
#20
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Geoff wrote:
> > Dori A Schmetterling wrote: > > >>Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2005 16:28:51 -0000 >>From: Dori A Schmetterling > >>Newsgroups: rec.autos.makers.chrysler >>Subject: Chrysler 300 vs. Dodge Magnum? >> >>See below. >> >>DAS >>-- >>For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling >>--- >> >>"Steve" > wrote in message ... >> >>>Dori A Schmetterling wrote: >>> >>> >>>>Both GM and Ford have, as you know, vast operations outside the US, but >>>>you don't see a lot of Cadillacs here. >>> >>>Nope. You get Opels, Australia gets Holdens, and we occasionally get an >>>Opel hauled over here, face-lifted and marketed unsuccessfully as a >>>Cadillac (ie, the Catera). Our current Pontiac GTO is a re-worked Holden- >>>wonderful mechanically but given such nondescript styling that its going >>>to be doomed to about the same fate as the Catera :-( >> >>DAS: What do you mean "nope"? > > > That's Texan for "I agree with your previous statement, which implied > the negative." You should feel honored. Steve wrote to you as he would > have any of his friends or relatives in Texas, which makes you an > honorary Texan, at least for the duration of this thread. Don't fight > it, Dori my dear, it's rather invigorating. > > :-P > > --Geoff > (watching for inbound starters) > I'm really getting the feeling I've been hanging around here WAY too long and a few people know me WAY too well. Good translation of the Texanese, by the way. :-p |
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