Selespeed - a Good Thing? Opinions Please

I've finally decided it's time to own an Italian car, and the 156 seems to
fit the bill, in either 2 or 2.5 litre form. I've got about 6-7 grand to
spend, so I guess '99 - 2000 models are the ones on the agenda.

However, for various reasons a clutch pedal is not desirable ... I
understand the 156 is available with Selespeed, but can anyone tell me how
much of a performance hit I'm going to see over a manual? It's an Italian
car after all, so I want it to be quick! I seem to vaguely remember Top
Gear moaning about the Selespeed's performance ...

While I'm here, anyone have any opinions on 2.0 v. 2.5?

Many thanks!

- Jake

"Jake" > wrote in message
...
> I've finally decided it's time to own an Italian car, and the 156 seems to
> fit the bill, in either 2 or 2.5 litre form. I've got about 6-7 grand to
> spend, so I guess '99 - 2000 models are the ones on the agenda.

You should get something decent for that at that age.

> However, for various reasons a clutch pedal is not desirable ... I
> understand the 156 is available with Selespeed, but can anyone tell me how
> much of a performance hit I'm going to see over a manual? It's an Italian
> car after all, so I want it to be quick! I seem to vaguely remember Top
> Gear moaning about the Selespeed's performance ...

In terms of absolute performance there is probably very little in it. It
feels slower initally, but if you get in a drag race situation there's
nothing in it. It takes some getting used to though. It aint like a slush
box!
I drove the JTS manual for a test drive and didn't think JTS was faster than
my Selespeed at the time. The JTS is just a bit more driverble lower down
the rev range.
Where you will lose out on performance is the time in the garage. My
Selespeed was pretty unreliable, and I think most are, especially if the car
you buy has one of the original Selespeed units which are prone to failing
castings/seals. The later ones are better I believe... around the time of
the introduction of the 147 Selespeed.

> While I'm here, anyone have any opinions on 2.0 v. 2.5?

V6 is a different beast. Again in an absolute drag race there is little in
it to 60mph. The V6 is faster but consumes considerably more fuel than the
TS. The upside on this is the V6 sounds a hell of a lot better, pulls from
lower revs than the TS and is quite happy doing 25mph in 5th gear.
The V6 is said to handle worse than the TS because of the extra weight at
the front, but I find the straight line traction to be better than the TS,
probably for the same reason!

To sum up: Forget about the Selespeed and test drive both the TS and V6, but
remember around town you will be getting 20mpg or there abouts in the V6
maybe less if you are a traffic light drag racer!

I loved the Selespeed, but unreliability stopped me from getting another.
When I crashed it there was only one choice for me, the V6 ;-)


>
> Many thanks!
>

Anytime!

--
Ivan.

156 2.5 V6 Veloce
Ex 156 Selespeed (RIP 22 May 03)
Ex 145 QV
Ex 33 16v QV
Ex 33 QV series 1

"Jake" > wrote in message
...
> I've finally decided it's time to own an Italian car, and the 156 seems to
> fit the bill, in either 2 or 2.5 litre form. I've got about 6-7 grand to
> spend, so I guess '99 - 2000 models are the ones on the agenda.
>
> However, for various reasons a clutch pedal is not desirable ... I
> understand the 156 is available with Selespeed, but can anyone tell me how
> much of a performance hit I'm going to see over a manual? It's an Italian
> car after all, so I want it to be quick! I seem to vaguely remember Top
> Gear moaning about the Selespeed's performance ...
>
> While I'm here, anyone have any opinions on 2.0 v. 2.5?
>
> Many thanks!
>
> - Jake
>
>
Hi Jake,
The Selespeed has no performance loss to the manual gearbox 2.0TS.

The V6 Q-System auto-box has a MASSIVE performance hit over the manual
gearbox V6.

The Q-system is only a 4-speed box, the manual V6 is 6-speed.



The 2.0 Selespeed has an identical gearbox to the manual 2.0, with the
exception that is has a lower 1st gear to reduce clutch-slip.




The Selespeed is a great system (providing you get a car that has not been
treated badly) but it can take some people a little while to get used to it.
Most magazine/TV reviews spend very little time actually driving the car, so
they never get the time to gel with it.
--
David C
156 Selespeed sp3 + Brembo conversion

In article >,
"Jake" > wrote:

> I've finally decided it's time to own an Italian car, and the 156 seems to
> fit the bill, in either 2 or 2.5 litre form. I've got about 6-7 grand to
> spend, so I guess '99 - 2000 models are the ones on the agenda.
>
> However, for various reasons a clutch pedal is not desirable ... I
> understand the 156 is available with Selespeed, but can anyone tell me how
> much of a performance hit I'm going to see over a manual? It's an Italian
> car after all, so I want it to be quick! I seem to vaguely remember Top
> Gear moaning about the Selespeed's performance ...
>
> While I'm here, anyone have any opinions on 2.0 v. 2.5?
>
> Many thanks!
>
> - Jake

Back in 2001, during my annual Italian trip, I was loaned a 147 2.0 with
Selespeed by Fiat/Alfa Romeo's PR department. I put about 3000 miles on
it two weeks. Drove all over Italy, went to Provance in France, The
Tirol, nipped into Austria, etc.

I enjoyed the Selespeed immensely and I came to the conclusion that what
the critics were calling slow was simply the result of suddenly having
no involvement in the process of shifting. Thus, waiting during the
Selespeed shift interval - an interval that would normally have one
disengaging the clutch, coming off the accelerator, moving the gearshift
lever from one gear to the next, re-engaging the clutch and getting back
on the accelerator- made it seem interminable. Once I realized that it
probably was faster than I could do it manually, I just sat back and
enjoyed it. I found I could dive deeper into corners, drop down 2 gears
and accelerate out without worrying about shifting. It made me a faster
driver, or at least it seemed like it.

--
George Graves
------------------

Bush is a poor leader because he isn't very smart.
What's Kerry's excuse gonna be?

George said:
> I enjoyed the Selespeed immensely and I came to the conclusion that what
> the critics were calling slow was simply the result of suddenly having
> no involvement in the process of shifting. Thus, waiting during the
> Selespeed shift interval - an interval that would normally have one
> disengaging the clutch, coming off the accelerator, moving the gearshift
> lever from one gear to the next, re-engaging the clutch and getting back
> on the accelerator- made it seem interminable. Once I realized that it
> probably was faster than I could do it manually, I just sat back and
> enjoyed it. I found I could dive deeper into corners, drop down 2 gears
> and accelerate out without worrying about shifting. It made me a faster
> driver, or at least it seemed like it.

I agree completely. A friend of mine who drives a manual BMW kept telling me
it was slow, so I got into his passenger seat and got him to change from 2nd
to 3rd to 4th to 2nd to 3rd to 5th on demand (you get the idea), then he did
the same to me while I was driving the Selespeed. He hasn't called it slow
ever since

As George says, the _initial_ perception is of a slow change, but once you
get used to it you realise that it isn't, especially once you take note of
what your friends are doing while changing gear with a manual box. The
ability to drop a couple of gears quickly just before a corner under heavy
braking without taking your hands off the wheel is so useful, and you get
that fantastic throttle blip as well to match the revs up smoothly.

By all means go for a test-drive, but my opinion is that you'll need several
hours to really appreciate what you're getting.

Note that if you do get a '99 or '00 model you'll probably get buttons on
the wheel (which personally I prefer), not paddles behind it..

I've had my 156 Selespeed Veloce since March 2000 and had no problems so
far.

Cheers,
Dave.

"Dave Sparrow" > wrote in message news:> As George says, the _initial_ perception is of a slow change, but once you
> get used to it you realise that it isn't, especially once you take note of
> what your friends are doing while changing gear with a manual box. The
> ability to drop a couple of gears quickly just before a corner under heavy
> braking without taking your hands off the wheel is so useful, and you get
> that fantastic throttle blip as well to match the revs up smoothly.
>
> By all means go for a test-drive, but my opinion is that you'll need several
> hours to really appreciate what you're getting.
>
> Note that if you do get a '99 or '00 model you'll probably get buttons on
> the wheel (which personally I prefer), not paddles behind it..

Have to agree with all of this. I'm not sure I'd swap for a manual
now, the ability to quickly blip down a gear by pressing the button on
the steering wheel is so much fun.

Mick

Lots of info in lots of replies - many thanks gents, this is why I love the
newsgroups so much! Anyway, I think I need to take a test drive now.

Only issue is that of reliability ... a few people have had moans, which is
a concern on a car outside of Alfa warranty. Any more opinions?!

Cheers
Jake


"Mick Sheppard" > wrote in message
om...
> "Dave Sparrow" > wrote in message news:> As
George says, the _initial_ perception is of a slow change, but once you
> > get used to it you realise that it isn't, especially once you take note
of
> > what your friends are doing while changing gear with a manual box. The
> > ability to drop a couple of gears quickly just before a corner under
heavy
> > braking without taking your hands off the wheel is so useful, and you
get
> > that fantastic throttle blip as well to match the revs up smoothly.
> >
> > By all means go for a test-drive, but my opinion is that you'll need
several
> > hours to really appreciate what you're getting.
> >
> > Note that if you do get a '99 or '00 model you'll probably get buttons
on
> > the wheel (which personally I prefer), not paddles behind it..
>
> Have to agree with all of this. I'm not sure I'd swap for a manual
> now, the ability to quickly blip down a gear by pressing the button on
> the steering wheel is so much fun.
>
> Mick