A Fishkeeping forum. FishKeepingBanter.com

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » FishKeepingBanter.com forum » rec.aquaria.freshwater » Cichlids
Site Map Home Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

KH Test Kit - really needed?



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old March 7th 04, 05:10 PM
Rick
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default KH Test Kit - really needed?


"NetMax" wrote in message
. ..

"Richard Phillips" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
Hello,

There is an article on www.oscarfish.com that advises a KH test kit is

one
of the important test kit to own (along with ammonia, nitrite, nitrate,

pH).
I was all set to buy one, but then I spotted some API pH Up (my pH

tends to
be on the lower side) and was thinking about buying this aswell.
Now I don't understand what the point of owning a KH test kit is, since

if
my pH is low then won't I simply use pH Up to bring it back to the

6.5-7
mark regardless of the calcium carbonate levels?
I am guessing that pH Up probably modifies the ammount of calcium

carbonate
in order to adjust the pH, so what is the point of knowing KH aslong as

the
pH is correct?
Or am I missing somthing important about KH?

Regards,
Richard.


Having your pH on the low side, if that is what comes out of your tap is
ok, (if your fish is an Oscar). If the pH is much lower than your tap
pH, then something in your tank is acidifying the water, and it does this
by first bringing your kH to zero. This is why a kH test kit is useful.
If your kH checks out at 4dkH or higher, your pH will be solid (it might
be low, but it's stable). If your kH is much higher, then your pH will
be solid to the point of being difficult to change. If your kH is low,
(2-3 dkH), then it is susceptible to pH crashes, (this is when the pH
drops to very low 4s and 5s). Your strategy depends on the difference
between your source pH and your tank pH. For a more accurate reading,
let your tap sample air-out for a day before checking the pH.

If there is a difference in pH, then you have to determine why. Things
which typically pull your kH and then your pH down acidifying the water
in an Oscar tank is their solid waste. Break out the gravel vacuum. I
have a heavily loaded Oscar tank at work and we gravel vac every 3 days,
otherwise I would have to feed them a lot less food, and you know how
Oscars like their food ;~)

If the cause of your low pH is from detritus rotting in your gravel, then
the pH up or baking soda will only be temporary chemical treatments for
the side effects, and not the root cause. The effect of the chemicals
will vanish with water changes, and their use will be detrimental, as it
will cause a see-saw effect in the pH.

NetMax



in a fully stocked tank with buffered water the Kh in my case of 140 will
remain constant for about 15 days before it starts to crash. Fish waste will
not saturate the buffer unless the tank is overstocked or overfed (and we
all know that no one over feeds!!). Water changes done normally on a
biweekly basis and rebuffering will maintain a healthy environment for the
fish however leaving water changes too long will result in unnecessary
swings in hardness and PH values. So avoid extremes and even though I have
not had the experience of others with large PH swings causing stress and
illness and or death with my fish I certainly advocate trying to maintain a
healthy and consistent environment for our animals.
Rick


  #22  
Old March 7th 04, 05:56 PM
NetMax
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default KH Test Kit - really needed?


"Rick" wrote in message
...

"NetMax" wrote in message
. ..

"Richard Phillips" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
Hello,

There is an article on www.oscarfish.com that advises a KH test kit

is
one
of the important test kit to own (along with ammonia, nitrite,

nitrate,
pH).
I was all set to buy one, but then I spotted some API pH Up (my pH

tends to
be on the lower side) and was thinking about buying this aswell.
Now I don't understand what the point of owning a KH test kit is,

since
if
my pH is low then won't I simply use pH Up to bring it back to the

6.5-7
mark regardless of the calcium carbonate levels?
I am guessing that pH Up probably modifies the ammount of calcium

carbonate
in order to adjust the pH, so what is the point of knowing KH

aslong as
the
pH is correct?
Or am I missing somthing important about KH?

Regards,
Richard.


Having your pH on the low side, if that is what comes out of your tap

is
ok, (if your fish is an Oscar). If the pH is much lower than your

tap
pH, then something in your tank is acidifying the water, and it does

this
by first bringing your kH to zero. This is why a kH test kit is

useful.
If your kH checks out at 4dkH or higher, your pH will be solid (it

might
be low, but it's stable). If your kH is much higher, then your pH

will
be solid to the point of being difficult to change. If your kH is

low,
(2-3 dkH), then it is susceptible to pH crashes, (this is when the pH
drops to very low 4s and 5s). Your strategy depends on the

difference
between your source pH and your tank pH. For a more accurate

reading,
let your tap sample air-out for a day before checking the pH.

If there is a difference in pH, then you have to determine why.

Things
which typically pull your kH and then your pH down acidifying the

water
in an Oscar tank is their solid waste. Break out the gravel vacuum.

I
have a heavily loaded Oscar tank at work and we gravel vac every 3

days,
otherwise I would have to feed them a lot less food, and you know how
Oscars like their food ;~)

If the cause of your low pH is from detritus rotting in your gravel,

then
the pH up or baking soda will only be temporary chemical treatments

for
the side effects, and not the root cause. The effect of the

chemicals
will vanish with water changes, and their use will be detrimental, as

it
will cause a see-saw effect in the pH.

NetMax



in a fully stocked tank with buffered water the Kh in my case of 140

will
remain constant for about 15 days before it starts to crash. Fish waste

will
not saturate the buffer unless the tank is overstocked or overfed (and

we
all know that no one over feeds!!). Water changes done normally on a
biweekly basis and rebuffering will maintain a healthy environment for

the
fish however leaving water changes too long will result in unnecessary
swings in hardness and PH values. So avoid extremes and even though I

have
not had the experience of others with large PH swings causing stress

and
illness and or death with my fish I certainly advocate trying to

maintain a
healthy and consistent environment for our animals.
Rick


Rick, you obviously have a handle on what you are doing (and different
recipes can & will achieve the same results), but I'm at a loss as to why
your kH seems to drop so quickly. Wouldn't that be indicative of a
significant amount of detritus rotting somewhere in the system? What
consumes your almost 8dkH in only 2 weeks? Is your source water so kH
poor that your baking soda is going out with the water changes?

NetMax


  #23  
Old March 7th 04, 11:09 PM
Rick
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default KH Test Kit - really needed?


"NetMax" wrote in message
...



in a fully stocked tank with buffered water the Kh in my case of 140

will
remain constant for about 15 days before it starts to crash. Fish waste

will
not saturate the buffer unless the tank is overstocked or overfed (and

we
all know that no one over feeds!!). Water changes done normally on a
biweekly basis and rebuffering will maintain a healthy environment for

the
fish however leaving water changes too long will result in unnecessary
swings in hardness and PH values. So avoid extremes and even though I

have
not had the experience of others with large PH swings causing stress

and
illness and or death with my fish I certainly advocate trying to

maintain a
healthy and consistent environment for our animals.
Rick


Rick, you obviously have a handle on what you are doing (and different
recipes can & will achieve the same results), but I'm at a loss as to why
your kH seems to drop so quickly. Wouldn't that be indicative of a
significant amount of detritus rotting somewhere in the system? What
consumes your almost 8dkH in only 2 weeks? Is your source water so kH
poor that your baking soda is going out with the water changes?

NetMax



it doesn't, I'm trying to read back to where or if I said my Kh drops
quickly. You're right on the nose where you say that the rotting detritus
will eventually cause the buffering capacity of the tank water to crash.
After about 2 weeks without doing a water change or gravel vac, especially
in cichlid tanks it starts to build up and without removing it you are going
to loose that buffering. No different from those who experience very low ph
values and can't understand why until you find out that they only vacuum the
gravel and do water changes about once every 6 weeks!!. For me I do weekly
water changes and by weekly gravel vac and filter cleaning so things stay
pretty stable. I recently have been allowing my Ph to drop back to the
normal tap water range which has also reduced my KH values however I can
tell you that it has had no negative impact on my Malawi fishes. In fact I
have 3 holding L caeruleus and a holding S fryeri. Sometimes I think we make
this hobby too difficult and fool around with the water too much. In your
store do you provide buffers for your Cichlids or just go with the tap
water?. I know in Winnipeg the LFS simply use the tap water.

Rick


  #24  
Old March 8th 04, 01:33 AM
NetMax
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default KH Test Kit - really needed?


"Rick" wrote in message
...

"NetMax" wrote in message
...

snip
Sometimes I think we make
this hobby too difficult and fool around with the water too much. In

your
store do you provide buffers for your Cichlids or just go with the tap
water?. I know in Winnipeg the LFS simply use the tap water.

Rick


LOL, probably right. I just use tap water. We are on very soft 7.7pH.
I keep my Africans on coral substrate with tufa stones, driftwood, Java
ferns and Hornwort for company. The coral/tufa brings my dkH/dgH up a
couple of degrees, but nothing too significant (my rate of water changes
tends to dilute everything pretty quickly). Using the coral and tufa
triggers people to ask why, so in case anyone forgets, we can explain
that they prefer harder water. I've got Alies, Nyerei, Labs, Rustys and
some Peacocks packing (Red Shoulder I think). However, when I bring any
Africans home to my hard 8.4pH, their colors look much nicer.

NetMax


  #25  
Old March 8th 04, 11:41 PM
Richard Phillips
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default KH Test Kit - really needed?

Thanks,
After reading this, I will get a KH test kit!
Regards,
R.

"NetMax" wrote in message
. ..

"Richard Phillips" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
Hello,

There is an article on www.oscarfish.com that advises a KH test kit is

one
of the important test kit to own (along with ammonia, nitrite, nitrate,

pH).
I was all set to buy one, but then I spotted some API pH Up (my pH

tends to
be on the lower side) and was thinking about buying this aswell.
Now I don't understand what the point of owning a KH test kit is, since

if
my pH is low then won't I simply use pH Up to bring it back to the

6.5-7
mark regardless of the calcium carbonate levels?
I am guessing that pH Up probably modifies the ammount of calcium

carbonate
in order to adjust the pH, so what is the point of knowing KH aslong as

the
pH is correct?
Or am I missing somthing important about KH?

Regards,
Richard.


Having your pH on the low side, if that is what comes out of your tap is
ok, (if your fish is an Oscar). If the pH is much lower than your tap
pH, then something in your tank is acidifying the water, and it does this
by first bringing your kH to zero. This is why a kH test kit is useful.
If your kH checks out at 4dkH or higher, your pH will be solid (it might
be low, but it's stable). If your kH is much higher, then your pH will
be solid to the point of being difficult to change. If your kH is low,
(2-3 dkH), then it is susceptible to pH crashes, (this is when the pH
drops to very low 4s and 5s). Your strategy depends on the difference
between your source pH and your tank pH. For a more accurate reading,
let your tap sample air-out for a day before checking the pH.

If there is a difference in pH, then you have to determine why. Things
which typically pull your kH and then your pH down acidifying the water
in an Oscar tank is their solid waste. Break out the gravel vacuum. I
have a heavily loaded Oscar tank at work and we gravel vac every 3 days,
otherwise I would have to feed them a lot less food, and you know how
Oscars like their food ;~)

If the cause of your low pH is from detritus rotting in your gravel, then
the pH up or baking soda will only be temporary chemical treatments for
the side effects, and not the root cause. The effect of the chemicals
will vanish with water changes, and their use will be detrimental, as it
will cause a see-saw effect in the pH.

NetMax




 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ammonia Level Test Results Rick General 0 February 3rd 04 02:39 PM
High Ammonia Readings -test kits/ammonia removers Spark_001 General 0 September 27th 03 05:46 PM
Test Kit Suggestions Needed Mort Reefs 29 September 17th 03 08:25 PM
Hard Water Tetras? rapdor General 7 September 14th 03 12:35 PM
color deficiancy and test kits. PaulB Reefs 6 August 17th 03 12:12 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:36 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2018 FishKeepingBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.