Nascar Racing Season 2003 demo and FF

So, I went out and bought a Momo wheel today, and won Nascar in an Ebay
auction. So, while waiting for it to come, i decided to download the demo
and check it out.

However, it doesn't feel like there is much (if any?) FF in the demo. Does
anyone remember if this is the case? The wheel works fine, as i am also
playing the GTR demo and it shakes all over.

Has anyone played Colin Mccrae on the PC too? Is it any better then the Xbox
version????

Aaron Menchions wrote:

> So, I went out and bought a Momo wheel today, and won Nascar in an Ebay
> auction. So, while waiting for it to come, i decided to download the demo
> and check it out.
>
> However, it doesn't feel like there is much (if any?) FF in the demo. Does
> anyone remember if this is the case? The wheel works fine, as i am also
> playing the GTR demo and it shakes all over.
>
> Has anyone played Colin Mccrae on the PC too? Is it any better then the
> Xbox version????

NR2003 has terrible force feedback effects compared to GTR. Nothing will
make it feel the same. When you turn up the forces for NR2003 it becomes
dreadfully notchy. A guy named Sphanky came up with a pretty good Momo
setup but I dont have it handy to post. Do a google groups search and it
shoulod turn up something. Bear in mind the forces are still quite weak
compared to GTR or R-Factor but at least its smooth.

Mitch
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Il Sat, 22 Jan 2005 16:57:29 GMT, Mitch_A ha scritto:


>NR2003 has terrible force feedback effects compared to GTR.

I respectfully disagree. Not that I can compare it to GTR, which I've actually
never played, but FF adds a whole new dimension to NR2003. I think I could never
play it without FF.... ok maybe it's not the most spectacular, it doesn't give
you all the rumbling and vibe of more arcadish games, but all the subtletlies
you'll ever need, the front tyres loosing grip, the mass transfer effects, are
there.



M.

But I don't seem to feel any of that in the demo..... unless i'm just
holding the wheel too tight????

"Marco Pisellonio" > wrote in message
...
> Il Sat, 22 Jan 2005 16:57:29 GMT, Mitch_A ha scritto:
>
>
>>NR2003 has terrible force feedback effects compared to GTR.
>
> I respectfully disagree. Not that I can compare it to GTR, which I've
> actually
> never played, but FF adds a whole new dimension to NR2003. I think I could
> never
> play it without FF.... ok maybe it's not the most spectacular, it doesn't
> give
> you all the rumbling and vibe of more arcadish games, but all the
> subtletlies
> you'll ever need, the front tyres loosing grip, the mass transfer effects,
> are
> there.
>
>
>
> M.

Marco Pisellonio wrote:

> Il Sat, 22 Jan 2005 16:57:29 GMT, Mitch_A ha scritto:
>
>
>>NR2003 has terrible force feedback effects compared to GTR.
>
> I respectfully disagree. Not that I can compare it to GTR, which I've
> actually never played, but FF adds a whole new dimension to NR2003. I
> think I could never play it without FF.... ok maybe it's not the most
> spectacular, it doesn't give you all the rumbling and vibe of more
> arcadish games, but all the subtletlies you'll ever need, the front tyres
> loosing grip, the mass transfer effects, are there.
>
>
>
> M.

And I respectfully agree (somewhat, but the forces are very weak) with what
you say about FF and NR2003 but the OP said he wants the FF to be similar
to GTR which it will NEVER be as Ive tried without success. Calling GTR
some arcade game with rumble effects is plain wrong. Ignorance is bliss in
this case

Mitch
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Il Sat, 22 Jan 2005 17:30:09 GMT, Mitch_A ha scritto:


>And I respectfully agree (somewhat, but the forces are very weak)

If you mean that the FF in NR2003 is more of a great aid for driving and for
getting a feel of your car than a showcase for the technology tactile
experience.... than yes, I think we agree. ^___^

> Calling GTR
>some arcade game with rumble effects is plain wrong. Ignorance is bliss in
>this case

Well I didn't mean that. I've actually played most EA F1 iterations and the
previous GT mod made by simbin, and I agree the FF implementation is good. Not
as good as papy's one, but still one of the best.
When I spoke about arcadish games I was thinking about Colin McRae, which Aaron
also asked about. I didn't say that name because, argh, I've only played one
Colin title and I don't even remember how the FF was.....


M.

Il Sat, 22 Jan 2005 12:23:49 -0500, Aaron Menchions ha scritto:

>But I don't seem to feel any of that in the demo..... unless i'm just
>holding the wheel too tight????

Ok, try crashing with your car against a wall, or maybe just rubbing it. If you
don't feel any effect on your wheel, then you have a problem. If you do feel
something, post again and we'll see.
Can't think of anything right now; I own a Momo myself and I can tell you that,
although the default setting in the game needs to be tweaked a bit for the best
experience, it's allright by itself.


M.

Marco Pisellonio wrote:

> Il Sat, 22 Jan 2005 17:30:09 GMT, Mitch_A ha scritto:
>
>
>>And I respectfully agree (somewhat, but the forces are very weak)
>
> If you mean that the FF in NR2003 is more of a great aid for driving and
> for getting a feel of your car than a showcase for the technology tactile
> experience.... than yes, I think we agree. ^___^
>
>> Calling GTR
>>some arcade game with rumble effects is plain wrong. Ignorance is bliss
>>in this case
>
> Well I didn't mean that. I've actually played most EA F1 iterations and
> the previous GT mod made by simbin, and I agree the FF implementation is
> good. Not as good as papy's one, but still one of the best.
> When I spoke about arcadish games I was thinking about Colin McRae, which
> Aaron also asked about. I didn't say that name because, argh, I've only
> played one Colin title and I don't even remember how the FF was.....
>
>
> M.

GTR is a step beyond F1C and its mods and it really shows. Give it a spin,
seriously, then report back Even the Semi-Pro mode that the demo came
with is a far superior driving experience thsn NR2003 and F1C and the
respective mods.


IMO Simbin really had an opportunity to become the next GPL except its only
available in Germany and many of us are becoming very annoyed having to
wait so long

GTR was developed using Momo's and the consensus seems to be the non momo
guys arent very impressed while the momo gang is blown away.

Mitch
--
Remove "nospam." to reply.
SuSE 9.2 Pro.

Ok, i wasn't looking for GTR like FF in Nascar, firstly...

Secondly, I took the advice of one of the replies and found the settings
done by Sphinx or whatever his name was, and now i feel it a lot better. I
think Turning off the centering of the wheel helped, as the motor trying to
centre the wheel probably was dulling out the other effects.

Thanks!
"Mitch_A" > wrote in message
m...
> Marco Pisellonio wrote:
>
>> Il Sat, 22 Jan 2005 17:30:09 GMT, Mitch_A ha scritto:
>>
>>
>>>And I respectfully agree (somewhat, but the forces are very weak)
>>
>> If you mean that the FF in NR2003 is more of a great aid for driving and
>> for getting a feel of your car than a showcase for the technology tactile
>> experience.... than yes, I think we agree. ^___^
>>
>>> Calling GTR
>>>some arcade game with rumble effects is plain wrong. Ignorance is bliss
>>>in this case
>>
>> Well I didn't mean that. I've actually played most EA F1 iterations and
>> the previous GT mod made by simbin, and I agree the FF implementation is
>> good. Not as good as papy's one, but still one of the best.
>> When I spoke about arcadish games I was thinking about Colin McRae, which
>> Aaron also asked about. I didn't say that name because, argh, I've only
>> played one Colin title and I don't even remember how the FF was.....
>>
>>
>> M.
>
> GTR is a step beyond F1C and its mods and it really shows. Give it a
> spin,
> seriously, then report back Even the Semi-Pro mode that the demo came
> with is a far superior driving experience thsn NR2003 and F1C and the
> respective mods.
>
>
> IMO Simbin really had an opportunity to become the next GPL except its
> only
> available in Germany and many of us are becoming very annoyed having to
> wait so long
>
> GTR was developed using Momo's and the consensus seems to be the non momo
> guys arent very impressed while the momo gang is blown away.
>
> Mitch
> --
> Remove "nospam." to reply.
> SuSE 9.2 Pro.

"Mitch_A" > wrote in message
m...
> Aaron Menchions wrote:
>
>> So, I went out and bought a Momo wheel today, and won Nascar in an Ebay
>> auction. So, while waiting for it to come, i decided to download the demo
>> and check it out.
>>
>> However, it doesn't feel like there is much (if any?) FF in the demo.
>> Does
>> anyone remember if this is the case? The wheel works fine, as i am also
>> playing the GTR demo and it shakes all over.
>>
>> Has anyone played Colin Mccrae on the PC too? Is it any better then the
>> Xbox version????
>
> NR2003 has terrible force feedback effects compared to GTR. Nothing will
> make it feel the same. When you turn up the forces for NR2003 it becomes
> dreadfully notchy. A guy named Sphanky came up with a pretty good Momo
> setup but I dont have it handy to post. Do a google groups search and it
> shoulod turn up something. Bear in mind the forces are still quite weak
> compared to GTR or R-Factor but at least its smooth.
>
> Mitch
> --
> Remove "nospam." to reply.
> SuSE 9.2 Pro.

Here ya go:

---------------------------------------For the MOMO people, do this.


Start/Settings/Control Panel/Game Controllers.


Then..


Double Left Click on the MOMO, then click the Settings button (bottom
right).


Then set these options...


Combined - unticked (ie: no checkmark) [this allows your brake and gas
pedals to be on a separate axis, which is important to have]


Enable Force Feedback - ticked (ie: checkmark it) [this allows force
feedback in games duh]



Overall Effects Strength - 97% [the reason for 97% and NOT 100% is a longand
complicated explanation, but in short it helps oscillations from
happening]

Spring Effects Strength - 0% [no Papyrus sims use this setting and oddly
enough, if you set it to anything other than 0% you will get undesirable
effects]



Damper Effects Strength - 0% [very VERY important to set this to 0%, this
isprobably THE most important setting, as it will greatly increase
notchiness
and wheel twitches, even though the Papyrus sims do not exactly enable it]

Enable Centering Spring - ticked [you are going to find this strange,
because in the next setting I tell you to set it to 0%, which is odd because
why not just untick it? well, there's a reason and here it is... if you
don't tick this option and also don't have Damping set -which if your going
with these settings you won't- then a strange phenomenon happens, you will
find that if you turn your wheel rather sharply, the resistance of the wheel
just "gives out" which is not something you want to happen. I will also
admit that having this unchecked does appear to give slightly better
forces -SLIGHTLY- but the repercussions just aren't worth it for the payoff.
so in the end check this option]



Centering Spring Strength - 0% [this is IMPORTANT! i know it's weird, butyou
must set it to 0% - read above option for better explanation]

Then in your Logitech Wingman Profiler, create a Nascar 2003 profile and
then set these settings as follows...


Steering Wheel Sensitivity to 33% [the reason you want to go down from the
default 50% to 33% is because at 50% the wheel is too sensitive to tiny
wheel adjustments... which is not realistic. drive your car and notice how
far you have to turn your wheel... the MOMO have a large radius to turn,
it's a shame most people only move it 5 degrees to either side. this setting
should allow more precise driving and overall smoothness as well - and you
can go down even lower if you wish, to say, 25% if you want to have even
more movement, but i suggest 33% for starters at least, get used to that and
go more later if you like the effect]


Steering Wheel Dead Zone - 2% [another long explanation would be needed and
I don't feel like telling, but in short this also helps oscillations and
twitchiness]


Accelerator Sensitivity - 55% [strangely, this option is the exact opposite
of the Steering, INCREASING this option from the default 50% to 55% makes
the gas less sensitive to the immediate input, in other words, you have to
push down farther before the car gets more power. the default 50% is a
little touchy - when you barely touch the pedal the car can spin out. 55%
helps this from happening and overall gives a more natural and fine tune
approach]


Accelerator Dead Zone - 2% [much the same reasoning as above, this helps
from keeping your car getting to much gas too fast]


Brake Sensitivity - 55% [exact same reasons as accelerator, increasing this
to 55% helps your brakes from locking up to fast. one word of note though is
that I have modified my brake pedal to include the squash ball instead of
the spring, so that may make a difference in your setup. just note that
increasing this gives less immediate braking and can help if your tires are
locking up too easily under braking]



Brake Dead Zone - 2% [same reasons as all the others dead zones]Now, in
Nascar 2003, enable the Force Feedback option under the Controls tab
and you should run this setting in between 35-65 (50 being most common
setting) depending on the track and more importantly, on your setup for that
track. I know this is a pain to have to do at each individual track, but
depending on your setup you will need to adjust the strength of the forces
in game between each track change.


Just start out from 50 and work from there. the key to adjusting strength is
this... if the wheel has a "notchy" feel, lower the setting till it JUST
goes away, if it doesn't have a notchy feel, then raise it till you feel the
notchyness and then lower it till it just goes away again. In essence giving
you the most forces while remaining smooth.


Leave Damping completely off in game... but *IF* and only if you are
oscillating exiting a corner on the straight, then you can slightly and
slowly increase it in game till you stop oscillating, but I doubt many of
you will have oscillation problems because the settings we set up earlier
should rid you of any. This is the only good thing Damping is good for, so
try not to use it unless you have to because it hurts your performance
elsewhere. and again, NEVER EVER EVER use the Damping setting in windows,
the one found in the control panel... and only use the in-game damping if
you absolutely must (as this can mask the real forces and it also increases
notchiness by a factor of 3 fold).


Leave latency off in game (0%). It only provides fake and incorrect forces
at usually the wrong time anyways and can definitely get in the way of
things and effect the overall impressions of the wheel with the rest of
these settings described here. if you honestly feel like forces are
literally coming too late (which I find very hard to believe) and you feel
like you absolutely have to add to this setting, go ahead and increase it...
with 25 being your absolute max (15 the preferred max) and 0% being the
optimal.


Tim