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#41
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>GM uses these engines for their toque and good emissions.
The torque output from the Malibu's 3.1 litre and the N/A variant of the 3.8 have never been great. But it's enough to make point to point transporation workable. But their overall power output and fuel consumption are less than ideal. A twin-cam 3.0 litre utilizing a multi-valve head and a basic variable valve timing system could've yielded the same or better power output as the N/A 3.8 and been smoother to boot, not to mention, it probably would've gotten better fuel economy. The Opel/Saab sourced 3.0 litre in the Saturn L300 is actually their best V6, IMO. >The Pilot and MDX have the same engine, >so do the 3.2 Accord and T/CL No, the North American version of the Accord runs a 3.0 litre with 240Hp. The Acura TL gets a 3.2 litre version with 270Hp, both engines have VTEC. The European/Asian Accord, sold as the TSX in North America has a 2.4 litre, i-VTEC equipped I-4 with 200Hp. > the Por. is a H-6 which was explained to me >as being different because of the two extra cylinders Porsche uses a "flat" or "boxer" six, but it has the same number of cyllinders as any other 6-cylinder engine. Wanna guess how many? |
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#42
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>the reason the big 3 try "not" to use OHC is because the like low slung
>hoods and this is hard to achieve with a OHC arrangement Ford has been using an SOHC design on the Mustang version of their 4.6 litre V8 since the mid 1990s, if memory serves me. And they use a 32-valve, DOHC version in the Cobra and the Mercury Marauder. The Navigator also gets a DOHC, 32 valve version of the 5.4 litre Triton V8 found in the Expedition. >the V-60 SHO 2nd >gen Taurus was very fast, it had faster 30 foot times than a Mustang. I assume you mean 60-foot times. And I have a feeling that a 5.0 litre Cobra fro the same era would give the SHO a good run for it's money. I wouldn't call the car "very fast" but with a 0-60 time around 6.9 seconds it was definitely quicker than most other cars of it's size, type and price at new. Keep in mind though that the SHO engine was largely designed by Yamaha, not Ford. And most of their best turbocharged work has been the result of Cosworth's hand. |
#43
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>I think Byron and Toby answered your first question. I would say the vast
>majority of V-12s if they are at a 60 degree Vee. the VR engines are 15 >degrees so how can it be the same. balance shafts are different that >dampeners. look at the NA BMW V-12, and the NA MB. no I wasn't you just >didn't answer the question. > I've ridden in 2 generations of MB S600 and a 760IL. I can honestly say that the W12 powered Pheaton I rode in was just as smooth. But you'd have to have actually been in one to know what you're talking about. |
#44
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>then make the A8 wider
Making the A8 wide enough to accomodate the Lamborghini V12 would've been excessive. Beyond that, I'm not sure what you don't understand about the production limitations of the Lambo V12. It would've required millions of dollars to re-tool for that. Don't forget, Audi had already incurred the cost of adapting manufacturing lines for the W12. They introduced the engine in 2001 in the previous A8. >never said it wasn't a great car, past being a VW but it's not as >smooth as a VS.-12. It's not a VW. The A8 and Pheaton share only minimal suspension components. |
#45
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Steve Grauman wrote:
> The Opel/Saab sourced 3.0 litre in the Saturn L300 is > actually their best V6, IMO. I certainly liked it in my LS2. I'd be curious, though, if the new 3.5L in the Malibu is better or not. -- Mike Smith |
#46
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Tha Ghee wrote:
> "Steve Grauman" > wrote in message > ... > >>>when GM >>>converted it's cars from using V-8 engines (which are best balanced with >>>a 90 degree configuration) >> >>Most V6s are 90 degrees, AFAIK. > > > no there about 60 degrees or something close to this No, they're not. 60 degrees is the optimal angle for balancing, but for packaging reasons (i.e. not as tall) 90 degrees is much more common, at least in American cars. The Audi/VW 2.8 V6 is 90 degrees, as are the newer Audi V6 engines. I believe the Honda 3.0 and 3.5 V6es are also 90 degrees. -- Mike Smith |
#47
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>I certainly liked it in my LS2. I'd be curious, though, if the new 3.5L
>in the Malibu is better or not. I couldn't say, but I can tell you that the 3.1 was crap. The L300's 3.0 litre motor was/is a good one, albeit, a little more power would be nice. I always thought the Catera had a pretty good engine too (another Opel design), but apparently it suffered electrical problems. |
#48
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"Steve Grauman" > wrote in message
... > >GM uses these engines for their toque and good emissions. > > The torque output from the Malibu's 3.1 litre and the N/A variant of the 3.8 > have never been great. But it's enough to make point to point transporation > workable. But their overall power output and fuel consumption are less than > ideal. A twin-cam 3.0 litre utilizing a multi-valve head and a basic variable > valve timing system could've yielded the same or better power output as the N/A 3.8 and been smoother to boot, not to mention, it probably would've gotten > better fuel economy. The Opel/Saab sourced 3.0 litre in the Saturn L300 is > actually their best V6, IMO. > > >The Pilot and MDX have the same engine, > >so do the 3.2 Accord and T/CL > > No, the North American version of the Accord runs a 3.0 litre with 240Hp. The Acura TL gets a 3.2 litre version with 270Hp, both engines have VTEC. The > European/Asian Accord, sold as the TSX in North America has a 2.4 litre, i-VTEC equipped I-4 with 200Hp. > > > the Por. is a H-6 which was explained to me > >as being different because of the two extra cylinders > > Porsche uses a "flat" or "boxer" six, but it has the same number of cyllinders > as any other 6-cylinder engine. Wanna guess how many? the coupe Accord has the 3.2. I know that, but Subie uses a H-4. they just now got H-6, and aren't using it as much as they can. |
#49
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"Steve Grauman" > wrote in message
... > >then make the A8 wider > > Making the A8 wide enough to accomodate the Lamborghini V12 would've been excessive. Beyond that, I'm not sure what you don't understand about the > production limitations of the Lambo V12. It would've required millions of > dollars to re-tool for that. Don't forget, Audi had already incurred the cost > of adapting manufacturing lines for the W12. They introduced the engine in 2001 in the previous A8. > > >never said it wasn't a great car, past being a VW but it's not as > >smooth as a VS.-12. > > It's not a VW. The A8 and Pheaton share only minimal suspension components. how hard can it be to produce more engines?? why not just turbo charge the W-8 and get similar horse power to a V-12. the A-8 share engines drive train layout, and interior setup |
#50
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"Steve Grauman" > wrote in message ... > >the reason the big 3 try "not" to use OHC is because the like low slung > >hoods and this is hard to achieve with a OHC arrangement > > Ford has been using an SOHC design on the Mustang version of their 4.6 litre V8 since the mid 1990s, if memory serves me. And they use a 32-valve, DOHC version in the Cobra and the Mercury Marauder. The Navigator also gets a DOHC, 32 valve version of the 5.4 litre Triton V8 found in the Expedition. > > >the V-60 SHO 2nd gen Taurus was very fast, it had faster 30 foot times than a Mustang. > > I assume you mean 60-foot times. And I have a feeling that a 5.0 litre Cobra > fro the same era would give the SHO a good run for it's money. I wouldn't call > the car "very fast" but with a 0-60 time around 6.9 seconds it was definitely > quicker than most other cars of it's size, type and price at new. Keep in mind > though that the SHO engine was largely designed by Yamaha, not Ford. And most of their best turbocharged work has been the result of Cosworth's hand. but look at the hood design of all the cars you mentioned, they have high hoods compared to other cars like the Camaro/Firebird. the 1st gen, second series had better 60 ft time, that's pretty good for a 3500 sedan with only less than 300 HP. |
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