Off Road vehicle decisions, help!

Roughly 12/19/03 10:53, Exit's monkeys randomly typed:

>> But, I've heard that Land Rovers are expensive vehicles to repair
>> since it's a foreign car and that one should NOT even consider buying
>> a used Land Rover since you don't know whether it leaks oil, etc.
>>
> Discoverys aren't foreign - they're English! They are very cheap to repair
> here in England but I expect your local Chevy and Ford pickups are cheaper
> over there. As for buying one secondhand - you *will* know whether it leaks
> oil or not, just look underneath. My 1997 V8 has no leaks. Contrary to what
> other people who don't know what they are talking about will tell you, there
> are no BMW bits in Discoverys - the engine is a Rover V8 that was originally
> a Buick unit and the autoboxes are ZF units.

Discoverys are now Fords, but with their own engineering etc.

A similar vehicle is the Nissan Xterra, but I dunno if it still
has solid axles or not all around. Note that you really only need
solid axles if you plan on rock crawling.

The Toyota RAV4 is another vehicle in the class, but tends to
be rather pricey as a used vehicle. Also the Ford Escape and
the Jeep Liberty as new.
>
>> What other 4x4 vehicles do you guys recommend for the CASUAL
>> offroader? In South Texas, where I live, the land is relatively flat.
>> We have sand dunes on the coastline, but the majority is brush land.
>>
> Ask yourself the following question - what other vehicle can I get that has
> solid axles front and rear (v. good off-road) coil springs and disc brakes
> all round and permanent 4WD for a low budget? If any other vehicles appeal,
> try them in the conditions the Discovery impressed you and see if they are
> as good.

The Jeep Cherokee and Grand Cherokee both have the solid axles, the
Grand Cherokee has coil springs and disk brakes and permanent 4wd
all around.

Both fairly lightweight compared to other SUV's.


--
Fan of the dumbest team in America.

Lon Stowell wrote:
> Roughly 12/19/03 10:53, Exit's monkeys randomly typed:
>
>>> But, I've heard that Land Rovers are expensive vehicles to repair
>>> since it's a foreign car and that one should NOT even consider
>>> buying a used Land Rover since you don't know whether it leaks oil,
>>> etc.
>>>
>> Discoverys aren't foreign - they're English! They are very cheap to
>> repair here in England but I expect your local Chevy and Ford
>> pickups are cheaper over there. As for buying one secondhand - you
>> *will* know whether it leaks oil or not, just look underneath. My
>> 1997 V8 has no leaks. Contrary to what other people who don't know
>> what they are talking about will tell you, there are no BMW bits in
>> Discoverys - the engine is a Rover V8 that was originally a Buick
>> unit and the autoboxes are ZF units.
>
> Discoverys are now Fords, but with their own engineering etc.
>
No they are still Land Rovers, just like jeeps are still jeeps even though
they are Mercs. There are no Ford bits in them yet, but they are due to get
Jaguar V8's soon and a joint Ford-Peugeot V6 diesel of 2.7 litres and
200bhp.

> A similar vehicle is the Nissan Xterra, but I dunno if it still
> has solid axles or not all around. Note that you really only need
> solid axles if you plan on rock crawling.
>
Solid axles aren't only for rock-crawling, they do however give better axle
articulation than IFS which is important in any challenging off-roading
situation. If you don't need axle artic you can do it in a Subaru.

> The Toyota RAV4 is another vehicle in the class, but tends to
> be rather pricey as a used vehicle. Also the Ford Escape and
> the Jeep Liberty as new.
>>
>>> What other 4x4 vehicles do you guys recommend for the CASUAL
>>> offroader? In South Texas, where I live, the land is relatively
>>> flat. We have sand dunes on the coastline, but the majority is
>>> brush land.
>>>
>> Ask yourself the following question - what other vehicle can I get
>> that has solid axles front and rear (v. good off-road) coil springs
>> and disc brakes all round and permanent 4WD for a low budget? If any
>> other vehicles appeal, try them in the conditions the Discovery
>> impressed you and see if they are as good.
>
> The Jeep Cherokee and Grand Cherokee both have the solid axles, the
> Grand Cherokee has coil springs and disk brakes and permanent 4wd
> all around.
>
Quite, and if the OP wants it to perform comparably with the Discovery he
has experienced, that is the sort of vehicle he will need.

--
Julian
---------
= Pretentious Sig required =

Lon Stowell wrote:
> Roughly 12/19/03 10:53, Exit's monkeys randomly typed:
>
>>> But, I've heard that Land Rovers are expensive vehicles to repair
>>> since it's a foreign car and that one should NOT even consider
>>> buying a used Land Rover since you don't know whether it leaks oil,
>>> etc.
>>>
>> Discoverys aren't foreign - they're English! They are very cheap to
>> repair here in England but I expect your local Chevy and Ford
>> pickups are cheaper over there. As for buying one secondhand - you
>> *will* know whether it leaks oil or not, just look underneath. My
>> 1997 V8 has no leaks. Contrary to what other people who don't know
>> what they are talking about will tell you, there are no BMW bits in
>> Discoverys - the engine is a Rover V8 that was originally a Buick
>> unit and the autoboxes are ZF units.
>
> Discoverys are now Fords, but with their own engineering etc.
>
No they are still Land Rovers, just like jeeps are still jeeps even though
they are Mercs. There are no Ford bits in them yet, but they are due to get
Jaguar V8's soon and a joint Ford-Peugeot V6 diesel of 2.7 litres and
200bhp.

> A similar vehicle is the Nissan Xterra, but I dunno if it still
> has solid axles or not all around. Note that you really only need
> solid axles if you plan on rock crawling.
>
Solid axles aren't only for rock-crawling, they do however give better axle
articulation than IFS which is important in any challenging off-roading
situation. If you don't need axle artic you can do it in a Subaru.

> The Toyota RAV4 is another vehicle in the class, but tends to
> be rather pricey as a used vehicle. Also the Ford Escape and
> the Jeep Liberty as new.
>>
>>> What other 4x4 vehicles do you guys recommend for the CASUAL
>>> offroader? In South Texas, where I live, the land is relatively
>>> flat. We have sand dunes on the coastline, but the majority is
>>> brush land.
>>>
>> Ask yourself the following question - what other vehicle can I get
>> that has solid axles front and rear (v. good off-road) coil springs
>> and disc brakes all round and permanent 4WD for a low budget? If any
>> other vehicles appeal, try them in the conditions the Discovery
>> impressed you and see if they are as good.
>
> The Jeep Cherokee and Grand Cherokee both have the solid axles, the
> Grand Cherokee has coil springs and disk brakes and permanent 4wd
> all around.
>
Quite, and if the OP wants it to perform comparably with the Discovery he
has experienced, that is the sort of vehicle he will need.

--
Julian
---------
= Pretentious Sig required =

Thanks all. I've been lurking in the JEEP newsgroup and see that the Jeep
Liberty is a heavily unfavored vehicle for off-roading.

I like the Grand Cherokee, but it just looks too big and too much like a
"family car".

Shall I look into an older Cherokee?

Thanks all. I've been lurking in the JEEP newsgroup and see that the Jeep
Liberty is a heavily unfavored vehicle for off-roading.

I like the Grand Cherokee, but it just looks too big and too much like a
"family car".

Shall I look into an older Cherokee?

"TooPlaneCrazy7" > wrote

> What other 4x4 vehicles do you guys recommend for the CASUAL offroader? In
> South Texas, where I live, the land is relatively flat. We have sand dunes
on
> the coastline, but the majority is brush land.
>
> Give me a reason why not to go with the Land Rover (other than price). My
main
> priorities in an offroad vehicle is the following: 1.) 4x4 2.) cab space
(4
> doors, but 2 is fine) 3.) bed space
>
> I am leaning towards a pickup. Toyota vs. Ford.
>
> Also, the lighter the vehicle, the better offroader, right?

I'd go for an Isuzu Trooper. if you want one new, since they are
discontinuing the Japanese made version and replacing t with a newer style
USA made one there are great deals on the 2003s if you hang on to it and
don't intend to tradein in a few years..

It's great onroad, good power and manages highway speeds with no trouble.
and is good offroad as well, despite having IFS, 4X4 performace is good.

the trooper is a medium SUV class vehicle, but has plenty of cab space and
footroom. Bed space is generous for the class.

try asking about them in alt.autos.isuzu

rhys

"TooPlaneCrazy7" > wrote

> What other 4x4 vehicles do you guys recommend for the CASUAL offroader? In
> South Texas, where I live, the land is relatively flat. We have sand dunes
on
> the coastline, but the majority is brush land.
>
> Give me a reason why not to go with the Land Rover (other than price). My
main
> priorities in an offroad vehicle is the following: 1.) 4x4 2.) cab space
(4
> doors, but 2 is fine) 3.) bed space
>
> I am leaning towards a pickup. Toyota vs. Ford.
>
> Also, the lighter the vehicle, the better offroader, right?

I'd go for an Isuzu Trooper. if you want one new, since they are
discontinuing the Japanese made version and replacing t with a newer style
USA made one there are great deals on the 2003s if you hang on to it and
don't intend to tradein in a few years..

It's great onroad, good power and manages highway speeds with no trouble.
and is good offroad as well, despite having IFS, 4X4 performace is good.

the trooper is a medium SUV class vehicle, but has plenty of cab space and
footroom. Bed space is generous for the class.

try asking about them in alt.autos.isuzu

rhys

Roughly 12/19/03 15:18, TooPlaneCrazy7's monkeys randomly typed:

> Thanks all. I've been lurking in the JEEP newsgroup and see that the Jeep
> Liberty is a heavily unfavored vehicle for off-roading.
>
> I like the Grand Cherokee, but it just looks too big and too much like a
> "family car".
>
> Shall I look into an older Cherokee?

If you park a Grand next to a typical midsize car, it is actually
shorter, much shorter than it appears to be. The Cherokee is bit
more hardcore in the interior, the downside is the aerodynamics
which make a brick look sleek. The ride in the Grand is much better,
with interiors on the Limited models that are in the semi luxo
range, those in the Laredo are a bit less so. The Grand will
get better gas mileage than the Cherokee on the open road
simply due to the slightly more aero body, ratios being equal.
With the tow package on the Grand you get 3.73 axles plus
transmission cooler which is nice. If it is a bit too jiggly
on the road, drop in inertia shocks [Edelbrock IAS] or driver
area adjustables [e.g. Rancho RS9000X] so you still get that
nice ride offroad that helps with kidney issues.

Both the Grand and the Cherokee can be made into hardcore trail
machines...not in the same class as the short wheel base jeeps
but definitely not poseur machines.

Probably the biggest advantage of the Cherokee series over the
Rover is the far larger availability of aftermarket parts in
the USofA compared to those for the LR.

--
Fan of the dumbest team in America.

Roughly 12/19/03 15:18, TooPlaneCrazy7's monkeys randomly typed:

> Thanks all. I've been lurking in the JEEP newsgroup and see that the Jeep
> Liberty is a heavily unfavored vehicle for off-roading.
>
> I like the Grand Cherokee, but it just looks too big and too much like a
> "family car".
>
> Shall I look into an older Cherokee?

If you park a Grand next to a typical midsize car, it is actually
shorter, much shorter than it appears to be. The Cherokee is bit
more hardcore in the interior, the downside is the aerodynamics
which make a brick look sleek. The ride in the Grand is much better,
with interiors on the Limited models that are in the semi luxo
range, those in the Laredo are a bit less so. The Grand will
get better gas mileage than the Cherokee on the open road
simply due to the slightly more aero body, ratios being equal.
With the tow package on the Grand you get 3.73 axles plus
transmission cooler which is nice. If it is a bit too jiggly
on the road, drop in inertia shocks [Edelbrock IAS] or driver
area adjustables [e.g. Rancho RS9000X] so you still get that
nice ride offroad that helps with kidney issues.

Both the Grand and the Cherokee can be made into hardcore trail
machines...not in the same class as the short wheel base jeeps
but definitely not poseur machines.

Probably the biggest advantage of the Cherokee series over the
Rover is the far larger availability of aftermarket parts in
the USofA compared to those for the LR.

--
Fan of the dumbest team in America.

Look at a new Mitsubishi Montero Limited. They have all of the comfort and
luxury of a Land Rover for 80% of the price and are as equally agile and
tough off road. Split fold up rear seats and removable third row seats give
lots of useable cargo room. The sun roof is huge and a person in the back
seat can stand up through it. I never understood the Discovery rear sun
roof. I use my rear roof for cargo and my roof rack ends where the sun roof
starts. The spare tire is mounted on the rear door and with the rocker
panels removed clearance is as much as I need. This is my second one and the
first new one. I've taken it over everything short of extreme rock crawling
in the southwest desert with nothing more than upgraded tires. It's traveled
well over 2,000 miles of desert off road and because of the unibody
construction there are absolutely no squeaks or rattles. Mine is a mountain
goat and gets me in and out of some tight places. It's small enough to get
into spaces where a Hummer or even a full size pick up would have trouble
and still large enough to hold a complete camp with supplies for a week. I
can mount an extra tire, gas cans and tools on the roof. Back in town and
cleaned up it's almost a luxury car.

My second choice would be a Chevy Tahoe Z71 5.3L

Bob Walker

"TooPlaneCrazy7" > wrote in message
...
> Hello everyone,
> This is my first post to this newsgroup.
>
> Last week I had the fantastic opportunity to go offroading in a Land Rover
> Discovery on the beaches of Padre Island...a 30 mile stretch of nothing
but
> sand dunes, mud, and tall grass. We packed 7 people (including the driver)
into
> the vehicle and went through all kinds of difficult terrain with no
problems. I
> was sold on the vehicle!
>
> But, I've heard that Land Rovers are expensive vehicles to repair since
it's a
> foreign car and that one should NOT even consider buying a used Land Rover
> since you don't know whether it leaks oil, etc.
>
> What other 4x4 vehicles do you guys recommend for the CASUAL offroader? In
> South Texas, where I live, the land is relatively flat. We have sand dunes
on
> the coastline, but the majority is brush land.
>
> Give me a reason why not to go with the Land Rover (other than price). My
main
> priorities in an offroad vehicle is the following: 1.) 4x4 2.) cab space
(4
> doors, but 2 is fine) 3.) bed space
>
> I am leaning towards a pickup. Toyota vs. Ford.
>
> Also, the lighter the vehicle, the better offroader, right?