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My GT test drive thoughts



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 9th 04, 10:29 AM
PhilipS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default My GT test drive thoughts

Hi everyone,

Took a GT 2.0 JTS out for a test drive on Saturday, thought I'd share
my opinions with the group (for what they are worth!), I would welcome
other people's opinions, as I am very seriously thinking of buying.
My comparisons are to my current steed - 147 1.6 lusso.

Overall, I was impressed, it looks better in the metal than the
pictures, somehow much meaner (not that it doesn't look good in the
photos!). There is something slightly ‘uncomfortable' about the
rear-on view I think.

From the 3 or 4 they had, I would say light colours suit it better
than dark. The standard 16" wheels look too small, 17"s look good. I
saw one with the gunmetal grey spoked 17" GTA wheels, which I didn't
think looked as good as the silver spoked wheels.

The interior is pretty much regular 147, so I was slightly
disappointed that it didn't feel that different to my current car.
They have changed the lower centre console area, around the gear
stick, it looks a bit plasticy and has lost some of simplicity of the
147 arrangement. Although the dash moulding is the same, it is a
different, softer less grainy material, which I think feels a bit
cheaper quality (although I'm sure the intention was the opposite).
The whole ambience was much better inside another one I sat in with
the momo hide, which looks very good. It was all a bit creaky and
the lid on the gearbox/ashtray thing wouldn't close. Boot was a
useful size, rear headroom is not great (but better than 3 series
coupe).

The door trims are 147, but have frameless windows, so they have used
an ugly black rubber plug to fill the gap where the pillar would be to
save on a new door lining, which is a shame.

Overall I think the interior quality was a bit down on my 147?

The JTS engine still felt very tight (only 1100miles), that will
loosen up. Lifting the bonnet it looked more like a VW TDi than an
alfa! Too much black plastic, and not as good looking as my T.Spark
unit. The handling was much more positive, overall it felt much more
sporty, and the body was more rigid. I wonder whether they have added
more weight to the power steering, or it may just be the wider tyres,
it felt meatier and suited the car. The ride was firmer, but still
very good, even running on the 17" low profiles. The JTS unit didn't
sound quite as sweet as the T Spark, but mine didn't really start to
sing until 10k miles plus! I think the JTS will be a real goer with
some more miles on it. Going from a 147, you can just jump in and
drive it like you've had it for years.

So there you go! I did like the car, it looks very special, but maybe
I was slightly disappointed how similar it is overall to the 147.
Putting aside the exterior it is maybe down a bit on quality (pillar
plugs, dash material) and passion/detailing (engine note, engine
appearance). I think you would see more of the differences (ie
performance, handling) in time, when you use it everyday. I now need
to decide whether it is worth nearly three times my current car's
value?

Thanks for reading my ramblings!

Thoughts? Opinions?

Cheers all, PhilipS
Ads
  #2  
Old August 9th 04, 11:53 AM
Pete
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On 9 Aug 2004 02:29:37 -0700, (PhilipS), wrote:

>Hi everyone,
>
>Took a GT 2.0 JTS out for a test drive on Saturday, thought I'd share
>my opinions with the group (for what they are worth!), I would welcome
>other people's opinions, as I am very seriously thinking of buying.
>My comparisons are to my current steed - 147 1.6 lusso.
>
>Overall, I was impressed, it looks better in the metal than the
>pictures, somehow much meaner (not that it doesn't look good in the
>photos!). There is something slightly ‘uncomfortable' about the
>rear-on view I think.
>
>From the 3 or 4 they had, I would say light colours suit it better
>than dark. The standard 16" wheels look too small, 17"s look good. I
>saw one with the gunmetal grey spoked 17" GTA wheels, which I didn't
>think looked as good as the silver spoked wheels.
>
>The interior is pretty much regular 147, so I was slightly
>disappointed that it didn't feel that different to my current car.
>They have changed the lower centre console area, around the gear
>stick, it looks a bit plasticy and has lost some of simplicity of the
>147 arrangement. Although the dash moulding is the same, it is a
>different, softer less grainy material, which I think feels a bit
>cheaper quality (although I'm sure the intention was the opposite).
>The whole ambience was much better inside another one I sat in with
>the momo hide, which looks very good. It was all a bit creaky and
>the lid on the gearbox/ashtray thing wouldn't close. Boot was a
>useful size, rear headroom is not great (but better than 3 series
>coupe).
>
>The door trims are 147, but have frameless windows, so they have used
>an ugly black rubber plug to fill the gap where the pillar would be to
>save on a new door lining, which is a shame.
>
>Overall I think the interior quality was a bit down on my 147?
>
>The JTS engine still felt very tight (only 1100miles), that will
>loosen up. Lifting the bonnet it looked more like a VW TDi than an
>alfa! Too much black plastic, and not as good looking as my T.Spark
>unit. The handling was much more positive, overall it felt much more
>sporty, and the body was more rigid. I wonder whether they have added
>more weight to the power steering, or it may just be the wider tyres,
>it felt meatier and suited the car. The ride was firmer, but still
>very good, even running on the 17" low profiles. The JTS unit didn't
>sound quite as sweet as the T Spark, but mine didn't really start to
>sing until 10k miles plus! I think the JTS will be a real goer with
>some more miles on it. Going from a 147, you can just jump in and
>drive it like you've had it for years.
>
>So there you go! I did like the car, it looks very special, but maybe
>I was slightly disappointed how similar it is overall to the 147.
>Putting aside the exterior it is maybe down a bit on quality (pillar
>plugs, dash material) and passion/detailing (engine note, engine
>appearance). I think you would see more of the differences (ie
>performance, handling) in time, when you use it everyday. I now need
>to decide whether it is worth nearly three times my current car's
>value?
>
>Thanks for reading my ramblings!
>
>Thoughts? Opinions?
>
>Cheers all, PhilipS

An interesting read Philip. It left me wondering if you have ever tested a
156 2 ltr. As the chassis and engine of that car are closer to the GT than
the 147 1.6 and it would be interesting to hear your opinion of that too.
I appreciate that you are not interested in buying a 156, and don't want a
stepping stone to the GT. It would just be interesting to hear your feeling
about the chassis/engine with the different body <G>

Pete
--
>
156 2.0 TS (2001) - Proteo Rosso (his)
147 2.0 TS (2002) - Gem Green (her's)
  #3  
Old August 9th 04, 02:14 PM
Catman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Pete wrote:

> On 9 Aug 2004 02:29:37 -0700, (PhilipS), wrote:
>
>>Hi everyone,
>>
>>Took a GT 2.0 JTS out for a test drive on Saturday, thought I'd share
>>my opinions with the group (for what they are worth!), I would welcome
>>other people's opinions, as I am very seriously thinking of buying.
>>My comparisons are to my current steed - 147 1.6 lusso.
>>
>>Overall, I was impressed, it looks better in the metal than the
>>pictures, somehow much meaner (not that it doesn't look good in the
>>photos!). There is something slightly ‘uncomfortable' about the
>>rear-on view I think.
>>
>>From the 3 or 4 they had, I would say light colours suit it better
>>than dark. The standard 16" wheels look too small, 17"s look good. I
>>saw one with the gunmetal grey spoked 17" GTA wheels, which I didn't
>>think looked as good as the silver spoked wheels.
>>
>>The interior is pretty much regular 147, so I was slightly
>>disappointed that it didn't feel that different to my current car.
>>They have changed the lower centre console area, around the gear
>>stick, it looks a bit plasticy and has lost some of simplicity of the
>>147 arrangement. Although the dash moulding is the same, it is a
>>different, softer less grainy material, which I think feels a bit
>>cheaper quality (although I'm sure the intention was the opposite).
>>The whole ambience was much better inside another one I sat in with
>>the momo hide, which looks very good. It was all a bit creaky and
>>the lid on the gearbox/ashtray thing wouldn't close. Boot was a
>>useful size, rear headroom is not great (but better than 3 series
>>coupe).
>>
>>The door trims are 147, but have frameless windows, so they have used
>>an ugly black rubber plug to fill the gap where the pillar would be to
>>save on a new door lining, which is a shame.
>>
>>Overall I think the interior quality was a bit down on my 147?
>>
>>The JTS engine still felt very tight (only 1100miles), that will
>>loosen up. Lifting the bonnet it looked more like a VW TDi than an
>>alfa! Too much black plastic, and not as good looking as my T.Spark
>>unit. The handling was much more positive, overall it felt much more
>>sporty, and the body was more rigid. I wonder whether they have added
>>more weight to the power steering, or it may just be the wider tyres,
>>it felt meatier and suited the car. The ride was firmer, but still
>>very good, even running on the 17" low profiles. The JTS unit didn't
>>sound quite as sweet as the T Spark, but mine didn't really start to
>>sing until 10k miles plus! I think the JTS will be a real goer with
>>some more miles on it. Going from a 147, you can just jump in and
>>drive it like you've had it for years.
>>
>>So there you go! I did like the car, it looks very special, but maybe
>>I was slightly disappointed how similar it is overall to the 147.
>>Putting aside the exterior it is maybe down a bit on quality (pillar
>>plugs, dash material) and passion/detailing (engine note, engine
>>appearance). I think you would see more of the differences (ie
>>performance, handling) in time, when you use it everyday. I now need
>>to decide whether it is worth nearly three times my current car's
>>value?
>>
>>Thanks for reading my ramblings!
>>
>>Thoughts? Opinions?
>>
>>Cheers all, PhilipS

> An interesting read Philip.


Indeed. I wonder if it would be useful to start compiling people's reports
in the website.
--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk
  #4  
Old August 9th 04, 03:48 PM
Pete
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Mon, 09 Aug 2004 13:14:19 GMT, Catman >,
wrote:

>> An interesting read Philip.

>
>Indeed. I wonder if it would be useful to start compiling people's reports
>in the website.

A sort of "Readers Drives" <G>
I would have thought that it would be a handy feature.
A would a frequent problems archive.
Whether anyone would bother to read them, or just try and top
post all over them is another matter :-)

Pete
--
>
156 2.0 TS (2001) - Proteo Rosso (his)
147 2.0 TS (2002) - Gem Green (her's)
  #5  
Old August 9th 04, 07:34 PM
Alfistagj
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"PhilipS" > schreef in bericht
m...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Took a GT 2.0 JTS out for a test drive on Saturday, thought I'd share
> my opinions with the group (for what they are worth!), I would welcome
> other people's opinions, as I am very seriously thinking of buying.
> My comparisons are to my current steed - 147 1.6 lusso.
>


I seriously thought about a 147GTA, a 156 2.5V6, a GT 2.0JTS and a GT 1.9JTD
as successor of my tuned 156SW1.8
Drove all of them as well as a GT 3.2V6 (just for the kick)
I found the interior nice, specifically with the black new cloth, yet very
147.
But I prefer the 147 interior over the 156
Interior wise, I fell for the "normal" natural leather (option); the fine
leather (another option) is too smooth for me.
The Bose sound system is perfect; matches the engine sound!!

Although all my Alfa's have been Alfa red until now, the Alfa red isn't my
colour for the GT; makes it look "cheap".
My preference is the darker colours; I hate silver!!
Ordered mine in Rosso Siena (new colour for the GT for delivery after this
summer; a kind of dark red metallic.

Performance wise, the GT 2.0JTS was similar to the 156 2.5V6; the 2.0 was a
very nice surprise.
The JT had a lot of torque at avery rpm, but I missed the quick rev'ing; the
speed was o.k. though.
The 147GTA was a kick, more a go kart than a luxury GT
The GT 3.2V6 was a ball, but out of my league financially.
In general I found the drive in the GT's much better (firm, yet comfortable
and sharply steering) than the 156 2.5V6 (and my 156SW)

I did notice quite a difference which I suppose was caused by tyre brand and
size.
The JTD was on standard 16" Firestones, the JTS on 18" Michelin Pilot Sport
and the others on 17" Pirelli
Off all, the 18" Michelin were silent, more comfortable than the 17"
Pirelli''s. The 16" Firestone's? Brrrr
I eventually went for the 18" and hope the Michelin's will be on their as
well (bargained Michelins at a very small extra when Alfa doesn't supply
them standard.
I did notice quite a difference in quality; the JTS was a recenter built car
(May, 3500km on the clock) that looked much better than the February built
JTD/3.2V6 (both approx 15.000km on the clock)

Problem:
Have to wait until Christmas!!
--
Ciao from Holland
AlfistaGJ (Gert-Jan)
Alfa red 156 SW 1.8 Madeno tuned (2000)
Golden Montreal 1428700 (1973/4)




  #6  
Old August 9th 04, 08:09 PM
Catman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Pete wrote:

> On Mon, 09 Aug 2004 13:14:19 GMT, Catman
> >, wrote:
>
>>> An interesting read Philip.

>>
>>Indeed. I wonder if it would be useful to start compiling people's
>>reports in the website.

> A sort of "Readers Drives" <G>

lol

> I would have thought that it would be a handy feature.
> A would a frequent problems archive.
> Whether anyone would bother to read them, or just try and top
> post all over them is another matter :-)
>

Well, there is that

--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk
  #7  
Old August 10th 04, 10:51 PM
Grahame
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Phil,



Intersting to hear your thoughts on the GT. I too test drove the GT
recently - in fact I test drove both the 2.0 JTS and the 1.9 JTD.



Like you I thought the 2.0 JTS was kinda tight and didn't really feel like
much of a performance upgrade from my 156 1.8TS Lusso.



I think the outside looks fantastic (definitely much better in the metal
than in pictures) and was also impressed with the fit and finish of the
interior (although you must remember I'm comparing it to a 4 year old 156
here!)



The biggest surprise I got was when I test drove the 1.9 JTD. The
performance was staggering! Loads of grunt, fantastic mid range
acceleration, nice relaxed 6th gear motorway cruising - I was hooked and
have ordered one as a result!



Only problem now is the protracted delivery times due to the Italian
holidays - ah well good things come to those who wait and all that...



Grahame.



"PhilipS" > wrote in message
m...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Took a GT 2.0 JTS out for a test drive on Saturday, thought I'd share
> my opinions with the group (for what they are worth!), I would welcome
> other people's opinions, as I am very seriously thinking of buying.
> My comparisons are to my current steed - 147 1.6 lusso.
>
> Overall, I was impressed, it looks better in the metal than the
> pictures, somehow much meaner (not that it doesn't look good in the
> photos!). There is something slightly 'uncomfortable' about the
> rear-on view I think.
>
> From the 3 or 4 they had, I would say light colours suit it better
> than dark. The standard 16" wheels look too small, 17"s look good. I
> saw one with the gunmetal grey spoked 17" GTA wheels, which I didn't
> think looked as good as the silver spoked wheels.
>
> The interior is pretty much regular 147, so I was slightly
> disappointed that it didn't feel that different to my current car.
> They have changed the lower centre console area, around the gear
> stick, it looks a bit plasticy and has lost some of simplicity of the
> 147 arrangement. Although the dash moulding is the same, it is a
> different, softer less grainy material, which I think feels a bit
> cheaper quality (although I'm sure the intention was the opposite).
> The whole ambience was much better inside another one I sat in with
> the momo hide, which looks very good. It was all a bit creaky and
> the lid on the gearbox/ashtray thing wouldn't close. Boot was a
> useful size, rear headroom is not great (but better than 3 series
> coupe).
>
> The door trims are 147, but have frameless windows, so they have used
> an ugly black rubber plug to fill the gap where the pillar would be to
> save on a new door lining, which is a shame.
>
> Overall I think the interior quality was a bit down on my 147?
>
> The JTS engine still felt very tight (only 1100miles), that will
> loosen up. Lifting the bonnet it looked more like a VW TDi than an
> alfa! Too much black plastic, and not as good looking as my T.Spark
> unit. The handling was much more positive, overall it felt much more
> sporty, and the body was more rigid. I wonder whether they have added
> more weight to the power steering, or it may just be the wider tyres,
> it felt meatier and suited the car. The ride was firmer, but still
> very good, even running on the 17" low profiles. The JTS unit didn't
> sound quite as sweet as the T Spark, but mine didn't really start to
> sing until 10k miles plus! I think the JTS will be a real goer with
> some more miles on it. Going from a 147, you can just jump in and
> drive it like you've had it for years.
>
> So there you go! I did like the car, it looks very special, but maybe
> I was slightly disappointed how similar it is overall to the 147.
> Putting aside the exterior it is maybe down a bit on quality (pillar
> plugs, dash material) and passion/detailing (engine note, engine
> appearance). I think you would see more of the differences (ie
> performance, handling) in time, when you use it everyday. I now need
> to decide whether it is worth nearly three times my current car's
> value?
>
> Thanks for reading my ramblings!
>
> Thoughts? Opinions?
>
> Cheers all, PhilipS



  #8  
Old August 11th 04, 02:53 PM
Gareth Tuckwell
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

The engine was probably extremely tight at 1100 miles - I was encouraged to
keep it under 3000 revs until to run it in until about 1200 miles!

I have a the 2.0 JTS (in my 156) with 19,000 miles on the clock and the
engine is still loosening up now. I have really started to feel a difference
in the last few weeks, following a 1500 mile trip through the UK and France.


"PhilipS" > wrote in message
m...
> Hi everyone,
>
> Took a GT 2.0 JTS out for a test drive on Saturday, thought I'd share
> my opinions with the group (for what they are worth!), I would welcome
> other people's opinions, as I am very seriously thinking of buying.
> My comparisons are to my current steed - 147 1.6 lusso.
>
> Overall, I was impressed, it looks better in the metal than the
> pictures, somehow much meaner (not that it doesn't look good in the
> photos!). There is something slightly 'uncomfortable' about the
> rear-on view I think.
>
> From the 3 or 4 they had, I would say light colours suit it better
> than dark. The standard 16" wheels look too small, 17"s look good. I
> saw one with the gunmetal grey spoked 17" GTA wheels, which I didn't
> think looked as good as the silver spoked wheels.
>
> The interior is pretty much regular 147, so I was slightly
> disappointed that it didn't feel that different to my current car.
> They have changed the lower centre console area, around the gear
> stick, it looks a bit plasticy and has lost some of simplicity of the
> 147 arrangement. Although the dash moulding is the same, it is a
> different, softer less grainy material, which I think feels a bit
> cheaper quality (although I'm sure the intention was the opposite).
> The whole ambience was much better inside another one I sat in with
> the momo hide, which looks very good. It was all a bit creaky and
> the lid on the gearbox/ashtray thing wouldn't close. Boot was a
> useful size, rear headroom is not great (but better than 3 series
> coupe).
>
> The door trims are 147, but have frameless windows, so they have used
> an ugly black rubber plug to fill the gap where the pillar would be to
> save on a new door lining, which is a shame.
>
> Overall I think the interior quality was a bit down on my 147?
>
> The JTS engine still felt very tight (only 1100miles), that will
> loosen up. Lifting the bonnet it looked more like a VW TDi than an
> alfa! Too much black plastic, and not as good looking as my T.Spark
> unit. The handling was much more positive, overall it felt much more
> sporty, and the body was more rigid. I wonder whether they have added
> more weight to the power steering, or it may just be the wider tyres,
> it felt meatier and suited the car. The ride was firmer, but still
> very good, even running on the 17" low profiles. The JTS unit didn't
> sound quite as sweet as the T Spark, but mine didn't really start to
> sing until 10k miles plus! I think the JTS will be a real goer with
> some more miles on it. Going from a 147, you can just jump in and
> drive it like you've had it for years.
>
> So there you go! I did like the car, it looks very special, but maybe
> I was slightly disappointed how similar it is overall to the 147.
> Putting aside the exterior it is maybe down a bit on quality (pillar
> plugs, dash material) and passion/detailing (engine note, engine
> appearance). I think you would see more of the differences (ie
> performance, handling) in time, when you use it everyday. I now need
> to decide whether it is worth nearly three times my current car's
> value?
>
> Thanks for reading my ramblings!
>
> Thoughts? Opinions?
>
> Cheers all, PhilipS



  #9  
Old August 11th 04, 03:27 PM
Alfistagj
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Gareth Tuckwell" > schreef in bericht
...
> The engine was probably extremely tight at 1100 miles - I was encouraged

to
> keep it under 3000 revs until to run it in until about 1200 miles!


When an incidental problem is in the car from new, it will occur within
those first miles indepent of the way you drive it..
Engine and gearboxes are built so precisely nowadays (perfect tolerances
etc), that driving in isn't needed any more from a technical point of view.
Being careful the first 1200miles/2500km is advisable.
Best reason: You have to get to know the car!!

>
> I have a the 2.0 JTS (in my 156) with 19,000 miles on the clock and the
> engine is still loosening up now. I have really started to feel a

difference
> in the last few weeks, following a 1500 mile trip through the UK and

France.
>


Driving in in the past was nothing else than letting all the engine gearbox
parts get a nice fit. In fact a kind of "wear".
As the old way of machining all parts weren't as smooth and precise as now,
so the running in more or less was a in situ polishing of all engine/gear
box components. For this reason the engines used to have special "running in
oil" as well as a "running in oil filter" that needed to be exchanged for
normal oil & filter already at approx. 5000km's (3000miles)
In those old filters you could have found a hughe amount of polish debree as
well i.e. casting sand that was not properly removed from the oil canal in
the block after casting.

What you will now notice is that the modern engines are 1) made to very
tight tolerances and 2) machined very smootly and 3) made from superior
material.
Wear is very low, so "running in" will occur, but very very slowly.
Where you would definately feel the engine getting "stronger" in the past
quite quickly from new (in fact, in percentage of the total engine power it
could be as much as 15%!!), it will no be over a much longer period and much
less in %

So, when you have a nice long and firm drive and after that you drive your
normal route, it is quite reasonable that you =can feel (little) more power.

Nevertheless, I guess what you have felt is the influence of the weather
which is immediate.
Ambient temperature, air pressure and humidity are of great influence of the
power output.
Taking into account that the average air pressure is 1013mb a normal high
pressure zone will reach 1040mb (+2.7%) and a normal low pressure zone 980mb
(-3.2%)
Looking at it this way, a high pressure zone is something like a natural
turbo!!
So, only based on "normal" weather variations approx 6% power difference can
occur.
And the higher the temperature, the lower the amount of oxygen in the air;
oxygen eq power!!
Humidity is also a factor as humidity can to a certain amount bind oxygen.
--
Ciao from Holland
AlfistaGJ (Gert-Jan)
Alfa red 156 SW 1.8 Madeno tuned (2000)
Golden Montreal 1428700 (1973/4)


  #10  
Old August 11th 04, 04:16 PM
Pete
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Mon, 09 Aug 2004 13:14:19 GMT, Catman >,
wrote:

>Indeed. I wonder if it would be useful to start compiling people's reports
>in the website.


Only those people who don't Top Post <LOL>

Pete
--
>
156 2.0 TS (2001) - Proteo Rosso (his)
147 2.0 TS (2002) - Gem Green (her's)
 




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