More on Top Tier gasoline

Usually I get 24 miles to the gallon for stop-and-go city
driving with the '06 Camry LE, but this last tankful I got
28 city. I really babied the accelerator pedal this time
and, of course, have plenty of air in the tires. I had
Shell V-Power premium in the tank this time (for its
exceptional detergent levels), but usually I just put in
a regular grade.

I had Hy-Vee Grocery Store premium in there two tankfuls
back, and thought the car was idling kinda rough sometimes
while stopped, so I thought some Shell V-Power was in
order to help clean out any minute amounts of potential
gunk I might have gotten from the Hy-Vee gas.

When I asked him, the Hy-Vee manager said his gas met
the Top Tier standard, but Hy-Vee is not on the list
of Top Tier stations at toptiergas.com, so I doubt
Hy-Vee is Top Tier.

On Hy-Vee, the car once idled at only 600 rpm; I've never
seen it idle so low. Usually 650 to 700 is the lowest it'll
idle at. It could have been a coincidence that the one 600
idle happened under Hy-Vee.

Quoting the Break Time page at the MFA Oil web site:

"TOP TIER Gasoline is a new class of gasoline with enhanced
detergency. It meets new, voluntary deposit control standards
developed by four automotive companies - BMW, General Motors,
Honda and Toyota - that exceed the detergent requirements
imposed by the EPA.

"TOP TIER Gasoline keeps engine parts cleaner by reducing
fuel-related deposits, resulting in better performance.
A lower level of detergent may cause a buildup of deposits on
critical engine parts. These deposits can cause stalling,
rough idling, lowered acceleration and other unnecessary
problems in your vehicle--and your life.

"TOP TIER Gasoline:

* Improves fuel efficiency
* Prevents driving upsets (rough idle, hesitation, stalling
and surge)
* Improves acceleration
* Provides more power
* Reduces emissions
* Cleans dirty engines and keeps new engines clean

MFA Oil Company is proud to join industry leaders by requiring
TOP TIER Gasoline with higher levels of detergent in all grades
and every gallon of gasoline at Break Time Convenience Stores.

Link: http://www.mfaoil.com/index.cfm?show=10&mid=14&pid=4

On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:02:09 -0700, Built_Well wrote:

> I had Hy-Vee Grocery Store premium


Ugh. This is about the same as Getty, Gibbs, Hess, etc regular.
It's usually bottom of the barrel gas.

I like my cars a lot better than that...

Hachiroku wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:02:09 -0700, Built_Well wrote:
>
> > I had Hy-Vee Grocery Store premium
> > ========
>
> Ugh. This is about the same as Getty, Gibbs, Hess, etc regular.
> It's usually bottom of the barrel gas.
>
> I like my cars a lot better than that...
========

That was the first and only time I'll use Hy-Vee gas.

They're regular grade is 89 octane, just like their mid-grade
and priced the same. But my car was using their 91 octane
premium. They lost a customer....good place to buy
groceries, though.

Built_Well wrote:
> Hachiroku wrote:
>> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:02:09 -0700, Built_Well wrote:
>>
>>> I had Hy-Vee Grocery Store premium
>>> ========
>> Ugh. This is about the same as Getty, Gibbs, Hess, etc regular.
>> It's usually bottom of the barrel gas.
>>
>> I like my cars a lot better than that...
> ========
>
> That was the first and only time I'll use Hy-Vee gas.
>
> They're regular grade is 89 octane, just like their mid-grade
> and priced the same. But my car was using their 91 octane
> premium. They lost a customer....good place to buy
> groceries, though.

Do you know what terminal they get their gas from?
Wonder if it is Conoco, Exxon, or Shell?

"Paul" > wrote in message
. ..
> Do you know what terminal they get their gas from?
> Wonder if it is Conoco, Exxon, or Shell?

Do you know additives they put in? They weren't the same ones used by
Conoco, Exxon, or Shell retailers.

"Mark A" > wrote in message
...
> "Paul" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> Do you know what terminal they get their gas from?
>> Wonder if it is Conoco, Exxon, or Shell?
>
> Do you know additives they put in? They weren't the same ones used by
> Conoco, Exxon, or Shell retailers.

How do you know that?

After reviewing the list of TOP TIER Gasoline Retailers at their website,
http://www.toptiergas.com/retailers.html , I couldn't help but notice that
Valero, one of the largest independent refiners in the eastern US, was not
on the list. Here in Delaware, the Valero refinery in Delaware City was
built in the mid 1950's specifically designed to handle sour crude. It is
still in operation, providing numerous retail operations in this region,
including Shell (which IS on the list) with their gasoline.

If suppliers like Turkey Hill Minit Markets and Qwik Trip are identified as
being Top Tier gasolinr retailers, why isn't Valero? Especially if they are
supplying gasoline to companies that ARE on the list?


"Built_Well" > wrote in message
...
>
> Usually I get 24 miles to the gallon for stop-and-go city
> driving with the '06 Camry LE, but this last tankful I got
> 28 city. I really babied the accelerator pedal this time
> and, of course, have plenty of air in the tires. I had
> Shell V-Power premium in the tank this time (for its
> exceptional detergent levels), but usually I just put in
> a regular grade.
>
> I had Hy-Vee Grocery Store premium in there two tankfuls
> back, and thought the car was idling kinda rough sometimes
> while stopped, so I thought some Shell V-Power was in
> order to help clean out any minute amounts of potential
> gunk I might have gotten from the Hy-Vee gas.
>
> When I asked him, the Hy-Vee manager said his gas met
> the Top Tier standard, but Hy-Vee is not on the list
> of Top Tier stations at toptiergas.com, so I doubt
> Hy-Vee is Top Tier.
>
> On Hy-Vee, the car once idled at only 600 rpm; I've never
> seen it idle so low. Usually 650 to 700 is the lowest it'll
> idle at. It could have been a coincidence that the one 600
> idle happened under Hy-Vee.
>
> Quoting the Break Time page at the MFA Oil web site:
>
> "TOP TIER Gasoline is a new class of gasoline with enhanced
> detergency. It meets new, voluntary deposit control standards
> developed by four automotive companies - BMW, General Motors,
> Honda and Toyota - that exceed the detergent requirements
> imposed by the EPA.
>
> "TOP TIER Gasoline keeps engine parts cleaner by reducing
> fuel-related deposits, resulting in better performance.
> A lower level of detergent may cause a buildup of deposits on
> critical engine parts. These deposits can cause stalling,
> rough idling, lowered acceleration and other unnecessary
> problems in your vehicle--and your life.
>
> "TOP TIER Gasoline:
>
> * Improves fuel efficiency
> * Prevents driving upsets (rough idle, hesitation, stalling
> and surge)
> * Improves acceleration
> * Provides more power
> * Reduces emissions
> * Cleans dirty engines and keeps new engines clean
>
> MFA Oil Company is proud to join industry leaders by requiring
> TOP TIER Gasoline with higher levels of detergent in all grades
> and every gallon of gasoline at Break Time Convenience Stores.
>
> Link: http://www.mfaoil.com/index.cfm?show=10&mid=14&pid=4

"doug" > wrote
> If suppliers like Turkey Hill Minit Markets and Qwik Trip are
> identified as being Top Tier gasolinr retailers, why isn't Valero?
> Especially if they are supplying gasoline to companies that ARE on the
> list?

It's a matter of additives which are mixed with the gasoline at a later
stage (at the distribution center). So, by adding specific
additives/detergents, a company that receives plain gasoline from Valero
can claim that their gas is "top tier". Valero choses not to include
those detergents in sufficient quantities at their retail locations,
hence they didn't make the list.

Pete

On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:02:09 -0700 (PDT), Built_Well
> wrote:

Actually one of our car mags here in the UK have just run an article on BP
hi-grade gas & Diesel.

They state that the claims for extra mileage is true but the most convincing for
me at least is the test using an Audi V8 adapted to run one bank on regular
gas/petrol and the other bank on BP Ultimate.

They fitted cameras to the inside of the combustion chambers and the regular
fuel side is a ****ty as hell and the BP Ultimate side is like a new stainless
steel sink with no deposits and sparkling clean.

You might see pics on the web "Car Mechanics" or "Kelsey Publishing"

try - http://www.kelsey.co.uk

Hugh
>
>Usually I get 24 miles to the gallon for stop-and-go city
>driving with the '06 Camry LE, but this last tankful I got
>28 city. I really babied the accelerator pedal this time
>and, of course, have plenty of air in the tires. I had
>Shell V-Power premium in the tank this time (for its
>exceptional detergent levels), but usually I just put in
>a regular grade.
>
>I had Hy-Vee Grocery Store premium in there two tankfuls
>back, and thought the car was idling kinda rough sometimes
>while stopped, so I thought some Shell V-Power was in
>order to help clean out any minute amounts of potential
>gunk I might have gotten from the Hy-Vee gas.
>
>When I asked him, the Hy-Vee manager said his gas met
>the Top Tier standard, but Hy-Vee is not on the list
>of Top Tier stations at toptiergas.com, so I doubt
>Hy-Vee is Top Tier.
>
>On Hy-Vee, the car once idled at only 600 rpm; I've never
>seen it idle so low. Usually 650 to 700 is the lowest it'll
>idle at. It could have been a coincidence that the one 600
>idle happened under Hy-Vee.
>
>Quoting the Break Time page at the MFA Oil web site:
>
>"TOP TIER Gasoline is a new class of gasoline with enhanced
>detergency. It meets new, voluntary deposit control standards
>developed by four automotive companies - BMW, General Motors,
>Honda and Toyota - that exceed the detergent requirements
>imposed by the EPA.
>
>"TOP TIER Gasoline keeps engine parts cleaner by reducing
>fuel-related deposits, resulting in better performance.
>A lower level of detergent may cause a buildup of deposits on
>critical engine parts. These deposits can cause stalling,
>rough idling, lowered acceleration and other unnecessary
>problems in your vehicle--and your life.
>
>"TOP TIER Gasoline:
>
>* Improves fuel efficiency
>* Prevents driving upsets (rough idle, hesitation, stalling
> and surge)
>* Improves acceleration
>* Provides more power
>* Reduces emissions
>* Cleans dirty engines and keeps new engines clean
>
>MFA Oil Company is proud to join industry leaders by requiring
>TOP TIER Gasoline with higher levels of detergent in all grades
>and every gallon of gasoline at Break Time Convenience Stores.
>
>Link: http://www.mfaoil.com/index.cfm?show=10&mid=14&pid=4
--

Sir Hugh of Bognor

The difference between men and boys is the price of their toys.

Intelligence is not knowing the answer but knowing where and how to find it!

Hugh Gundersen

Bognor Regis, W.Sussex, England, UK

wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 13:02:09 -0700 (PDT), Built_Well
> > wrote:
>
> Actually one of our car mags here in the UK have just run an article on BP
> hi-grade gas & Diesel.
>
> They state that the claims for extra mileage is true but the most convincing for
> me at least is the test using an Audi V8 adapted to run one bank on regular
> gas/petrol and the other bank on BP Ultimate.
>
> They fitted cameras to the inside of the combustion chambers and the regular
> fuel side is a ****ty as hell and the BP Ultimate side is like a new stainless
> steel sink with no deposits and sparkling clean.
>
> You might see pics on the web "Car Mechanics" or "Kelsey Publishing"
>
> try - http://www.kelsey.co.uk
>
> Hugh
>> Usually I get 24 miles to the gallon for stop-and-go city
>> driving with the '06 Camry LE, but this last tankful I got
>> 28 city. I really babied the accelerator pedal this time
>> and, of course, have plenty of air in the tires. I had
>> Shell V-Power premium in the tank this time (for its
>> exceptional detergent levels), but usually I just put in
>> a regular grade.
>>
>> I had Hy-Vee Grocery Store premium in there two tankfuls
>> back, and thought the car was idling kinda rough sometimes
>> while stopped, so I thought some Shell V-Power was in
>> order to help clean out any minute amounts of potential
>> gunk I might have gotten from the Hy-Vee gas.
>>
>> When I asked him, the Hy-Vee manager said his gas met
>> the Top Tier standard, but Hy-Vee is not on the list
>> of Top Tier stations at toptiergas.com, so I doubt
>> Hy-Vee is Top Tier.
>>
>> On Hy-Vee, the car once idled at only 600 rpm; I've never
>> seen it idle so low. Usually 650 to 700 is the lowest it'll
>> idle at. It could have been a coincidence that the one 600
>> idle happened under Hy-Vee.
>>
>> Quoting the Break Time page at the MFA Oil web site:
>>
>> "TOP TIER Gasoline is a new class of gasoline with enhanced
>> detergency. It meets new, voluntary deposit control standards
>> developed by four automotive companies - BMW, General Motors,
>> Honda and Toyota - that exceed the detergent requirements
>> imposed by the EPA.
>>
>> "TOP TIER Gasoline keeps engine parts cleaner by reducing
>> fuel-related deposits, resulting in better performance.
>> A lower level of detergent may cause a buildup of deposits on
>> critical engine parts. These deposits can cause stalling,
>> rough idling, lowered acceleration and other unnecessary
>> problems in your vehicle--and your life.
>>
>> "TOP TIER Gasoline:
>>
>> * Improves fuel efficiency
>> * Prevents driving upsets (rough idle, hesitation, stalling
>> and surge)
>> * Improves acceleration
>> * Provides more power
>> * Reduces emissions
>> * Cleans dirty engines and keeps new engines clean
>>
>> MFA Oil Company is proud to join industry leaders by requiring
>> TOP TIER Gasoline with higher levels of detergent in all grades
>> and every gallon of gasoline at Break Time Convenience Stores.
>>
>> Link: http://www.mfaoil.com/index.cfm?show=10&mid=14&pid=4

It all depends on how you look at it. Unless you are racing or
pulling a heavy load up a hill it won't matter what the octane rating
is. Top tier refers to the additives that prevent build up of deposits,
especially on the intake valves. As far as getting extra mileage with
higher octane? I don't buy it, either the argument or the product. A
friend of mine would always by premium fuel, it ranged from 15 to 20
cents more per gallon. I suggested he try regular instead, but it
wasn't until we did the math that he tried it.
It went something like 300K miles divided by 25 miles/gal = 12K gal
times 18 cents = 2160 dollars. To me it's all about what it costs to
get a mile down the road, total expenses. Fuel, tires,insurance
repairs, maintenance. You can drive a Caddie or Lexus and it's going
to cost you more per mile, you can go to the other extreme and drive a
used tin can and get down the road pretty cheap. I've found Honda
Accords and Toyota Camerys to be a pretty good all around cars,
comfortable enough, right size enough, economical enough to get me that
mile down the road without breaking the bank. I use regular in them,
top tier regular if it's there but I don't worry all that much about
it. The EPA has standards for fuel which must be met and deposit
problems are addressed by them. I stay away from ethanol. The only
preignition or knocking I've encountered in a long time are with a
couple of lawnmowers and a motorcycle.
Quit kidding yourself, Do the math and get yourself some free money.