2002 L-200 Transmission Woes

Well, here we go again...

About 18 months ago, the vehicle started to exhibit signs of some type of
transmission problem (automatic). Engine RPM would jump and fall about
400RPM while driving down the road (level road) at five second intervals.
No codes set in the computer and no warning lights showing. Mileage was
42,000 and we had purchased the extended vehicle warranty package.

Brought to our Saturn dealer who told us that the tires were out of balance.
Paid for a tire rotation and rebalance of all tires and went on our way --
didn't fix the problem. Returned to dealership who kept the vehicle a day,
and returned it with no work done; telling us the streets we drove on were
causing it.

Finally contacted Saturn Customer Service who directed us to go to
dealership again. The mechanic put some test equipment on the car and we
went for a ride. Found the torque converter was not locking up properly.
Three days in the shop for repairs, but seemed to be OK. Work performed
under the warranty package.

Fast forward to current times - the vehicle is now at 59,750 and starting to
exhibit the same symptoms as before. Returned to dealership and rode with
mechanic WHO VERIFIED problem. Left vehicle for three days and returned to
find that Service Manager felt the problem was with the tires. Disagreed
with him, but at his insistance brought new set of tires ($375.00).

Told him that if problem wasn't fixed, then I'd be back, that he would
reimburse me for the tires, and they would then fix it properly. Vehicle
continues to act up, the transmission now hangs in second range until engine
speed reaches nearly warning mark before shifting into fourth. My
appointment is on the 29th.

Mileage is now at 61,000+ and I will probably have to get Saturn Customer
Service involved again. Fortunately, I contacted them and opened a
complaint file before vehicle exceeded the 60,000 mile warranty limit - a
fact that I have not divulged to the dealership. Will keep everyone
informed

Definately sounds like one of the electronic modules related to the Tranny
(ex: torque converter, or?) acting up again. Tires will never cause RPMs to
fluctuate, that is just plain bulls*it they are feeding you. However, the
L-series was a known tire-eater due to a known Recall Issue which can be
fixed by having the front end shimmed and any faulty front end parts
replaced. Ask if the recall has been done and if not demand that it get done
at no cost to you, else call Saturn CS and they will resolve it.

marx404

In article >,
says...
> Definately sounds like one of the electronic modules related to the Tranny
> (ex: torque converter, or?) acting up again. Tires will never cause RPMs to
> fluctuate, that is just plain bulls*it they are feeding you. However, the
> L-series was a known tire-eater due to a known Recall Issue which can be
> fixed by having the front end shimmed and any faulty front end parts
> replaced. Ask if the recall has been done and if not demand that it get done
> at no cost to you, else call Saturn CS and they will resolve it.
>
> marx404

60k miles was probably close to the tires end but yeah there is no way
this would cause his problems. The issue is likely sensor/computer
related. Contacting CS prior to 60k was a smart move.

(sorry to hear about your job marx)

> Vehicle
> continues to act up, the transmission now hangs in second range until engine
> speed reaches nearly warning mark before shifting into fourth.

Its skipping 3rd? My bonneville will run up to 90mph before it needs
shifted into 3rd. If this is the case it may be possible that your 2-3
shift solenoid is faulty. I wonder if they have any actual transmission
savy techs at this place... Look on the wall and see if you see any ASE
A2 - Automatic Transmission/Transaxle techs.

Well, the score is Lions 2, Christians 0 --- Upon arrival at the dealership
I got with the Service Technician. Yes, he is certified through the ASE
program (certificate on the wall, updated just last year). WE took a ride
to get a baseline feel of the vehicle, and then switched to another vehicle
(an L-300 of the same year) to compare. Unfortunately, the dammed problem
failed to exhibit its presence, so he was forced to marked the paperwork
"unable to duplicate reported problem" and I'm marked as an hysterical old
man who's a pain in the a**.

Through discussion, I did find out that there is a Service Bulletin (not a
recall notice) out there that is applicable to my vehicle, and it addresses
rear end caster/camber alignment and adjustment modifications to prevent the
"cupping" of the tires the Service Manager originally addressed as the
possible source of the problem. Since it is not a recall, they would be
totally willing to perform this modification for approximately $650 (which
is not a warranty covered item). By the way, I agree totally that a
defective tire (or tires) will not cause the engine RPM to jump and drop at
four second intervals.

I do plan on contacting Springhill today, to check further about the Service
Bulletin (which was issued back in late 2003 -- why wasn't I notified back
then of the issue?), and see if Springhill wants to cover a portion of the
cost; I'll buy the parts, and they can eat the install costs. Probably
won't go for it, but if I don't ask I won't know. Irritating side issue -
my dealership is about 65 miles away, so I end up killing a couple of hours
and a third of a tank of gas everytime I go to them for service (got enough
problems without letting some untrained fool under the hood).

This issue has not been resolved in my mind, so I will be posting updates
here on the board ...

On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 06:33:23 -0500, "Ocean Archer"
> wrote:

>Well, the score is Lions 2, Christians 0 --- Upon arrival at the dealership
>I got with the Service Technician. Yes, he is certified through the ASE
>program (certificate on the wall, updated just last year). WE took a ride
>to get a baseline feel of the vehicle, and then switched to another vehicle
>(an L-300 of the same year) to compare. Unfortunately, the dammed problem
>failed to exhibit its presence, so he was forced to marked the paperwork
>"unable to duplicate reported problem" and I'm marked as an hysterical old
>man who's a pain in the a**.
>
>Through discussion, I did find out that there is a Service Bulletin (not a
>recall notice) out there that is applicable to my vehicle, and it addresses
>rear end caster/camber alignment and adjustment modifications to prevent the
>"cupping" of the tires the Service Manager originally addressed as the
>possible source of the problem. Since it is not a recall, they would be
>totally willing to perform this modification for approximately $650 (which
>is not a warranty covered item). By the way, I agree totally that a
>defective tire (or tires) will not cause the engine RPM to jump and drop at
>four second intervals.
>
>I do plan on contacting Springhill today, to check further about the Service
>Bulletin (which was issued back in late 2003 -- why wasn't I notified back
>then of the issue?), and see if Springhill wants to cover a portion of the
>cost; I'll buy the parts, and they can eat the install costs. Probably
>won't go for it, but if I don't ask I won't know. Irritating side issue -
>my dealership is about 65 miles away, so I end up killing a couple of hours
>and a third of a tank of gas everytime I go to them for service (got enough
>problems without letting some untrained fool under the hood).
>
>This issue has not been resolved in my mind, so I will be posting updates
>here on the board ...
>


When Saturn first came out, they took a lot better care of customers,
now they are more just plain GM BS than Saturn anymore as though it is
supposed to be its own division, GM has tightened the leash on it a
lot in resent years.
-----------------
The SnoMan
www.thesnoman.com

I'm at 98,000 (ish) and I bought the L200 used at about 80,000 miles
almost a year ago. I've driven the absolute hell out of my little
EcoTech and I've been utterly satisfied with its 'get-up-and-go'.
Granted its no Saab 93t but it gets me where I want(ed) to go. The
past tense addition on the last sentence is due to an unfortunate
incident :

I "accidentally" went off roading - or RAN off the road a few weeks
ago. I snapped the back right tire off and shattered the (what I guess
is) the A-frame and rear strut. I also have done some kind of damage
to the passenger-front tire and drive-assembly (strut, I'd venture to
guess). I also put a hole in the tranny pan (already replaced).

The car (after a $200 tow) starts and runs fine. I've taken my 2.2
sweety up to 90 MPH and gunned the transmission like some street punk
in The Fast and the Furious. A few hours after taking her out, now on
a near empty tank - I start to get a few noticable tranny issues :

1) From a 4- or 500 RPM idle, if I go full throttle I get a HIGH rev
and some pretty sweety (but worrying) tire squeal. Yes, I'm on brand
new Pirellis. And yes, the squeal is coming from the damaged right
side of the car. Stop driving? Nah, I think I'll go a little farther.


2) Now, from a dead stop or very low RPMs, regardless of how fast I
accelerate, I get a light but definite grinding noise at about 2,600
RPMs. It's right after I press the pedal in 1st and a few moments
before the 1-2 shift.

Other than those two (what should be scary) issues, I'm shifting VERY
well, but maybe getting a little too high at the 2-3 shift at full
throttle (seems like about 6,100 RPMs). My problem isn't too bad just
yet, but I'm 'fiddin' to take her out again and see what happens.

If I'd guess, I might tend to agree with previous posters - a control
module or 'misc' tranny ECU could be to blame. But I'd bet its a
hardware issue. For my issue, I was thinking a worn set of gears...
But I'm not smart enough to really know. My father-in-law and I are
going to drag the 2.2 out and stick in a crate 2.2 with the manual
trans (I hope).

As for you, insist that your problem is more than tires or a simple
adjustment, because I've been under the hood and in the driveline of my
L200 and my issue (similar or not) is NOT a simple fix. So get your
baby fixed, the L200 is NOT that bad of a vehicle.

I had that Service Bulletin work done for free on my 2001 L300 and they also
reimbursed me for the ruined tires (had to provide receipt). I was told it
was a "Secret Warranty", that is "only the squeaky wheels got the grease!"

> Through discussion, I did find out that there is a Service Bulletin (not a
> recall notice) out there that is applicable to my vehicle, and it
> addresses rear end caster/camber alignment and adjustment modifications to
> prevent the "cupping" of the tires the Service Manager originally
> addressed as the possible source of the problem. Since it is not a
> recall, they would be totally willing to perform this modification for
> approximately $650 (which is not a warranty covered item). By the way, I
> agree totally that a defective tire (or tires) will not cause the engine
> RPM to jump and drop at four second intervals.