77 Bus - problem starting after engine warmed up

I am having trouble starting the engine on my 77 Bus after the engine
is warmed up. It fires right up on the first turn when the engine is
cold, but struggles to start when the engine gets hot.

I have a weak battery which I will be replacing very shortly and I am
thinking it may just be with the engine hot the compression increases
making it more difficult for that battery to turn the engine over as
quickly. Although during the first cranking it seems to spin as fast
as the first start.

But I am guessing it is probably more related to the carb and choking
mechanism. Or maybe even the points, do points loose some continuity
when they become hot?

In any case, it is on my list of things to look at. But before I
started jumping in thought I would ask if anyone has any ideas. After
all these VWs seem to have some common experiences or causes and if
that is the case, to take advantage of past experience now.
Thanks
Chuck

wrote:

> I am having trouble starting the engine on my 77 Bus after the engine
> is warmed up. It fires right up on the first turn when the engine is
> cold, but struggles to start when the engine gets hot.
>
> I have a weak battery which I will be replacing very shortly and I am
> thinking it may just be with the engine hot the compression increases
> making it more difficult for that battery to turn the engine over as
> quickly. Although during the first cranking it seems to spin as fast
> as the first start.
>
> But I am guessing it is probably more related to the carb and choking
> mechanism. Or maybe even the points, do points loose some continuity
> when they become hot?
>
> In any case, it is on my list of things to look at. But before I
> started jumping in thought I would ask if anyone has any ideas. After
> all these VWs seem to have some common experiences or causes and if
> that is the case, to take advantage of past experience now.
> Thanks
> Chuck
>

It may be a carb flooding issue. What engine do you have and what
carb?

You might try turning the engine by hand both when cold and when hot
to see if there is any difference in effort required.

Speedy Jim
http://www.nls.net/mp/volks/

Jim,
I have a 1600CC single carburator engine.

Identification of the carb:

This is the information found on the side of the carb.
Solex
H30/31PICT
Ind. Bars

So from that I looked on line and found Solex 31-PICT and Solex 30-PICT
but I am not sure which one of the two it would be since the
nomanclature is different on the carb vs what I am finding on line.
Chuck

wrote:

> Jim,
> I have a 1600CC single carburator engine.
>
> Identification of the carb:
>
> This is the information found on the side of the carb.
> Solex
> H30/31PICT
> Ind. Bars
>
> So from that I looked on line and found Solex 31-PICT and Solex 30-PICT
> but I am not sure which one of the two it would be since the
> nomanclature is different on the carb vs what I am finding on line.
> Chuck
>

Flooding *can* be a problem. Most common in summer temps. After the
engine bay heats up, fuel may boil in the carb bowl and dribble down the
manifold after the engine shuts off.

Also, a float needle valve which doesn't shut tightly can allow excess
fuel to overfill the bowl. Some fuel pumps build up pressure in the
outlet as the ambient temp goes up, with the engine not running.
That can force open the float needle.

One thing you can do: Immediately after shutting down a hot engine,
remove the engine hatch lid and take the air cleaner off so you can
look down the carb throat. Use a flashlight (torch). If you see
clouds of white smoke (vapors) or even dribbling fuel, flooding is
the likely result.

I don't want to lead you astray with a red herring, but the above is
common and should at least be considered as a possibility.

Speedy Jim
http://www.nls.net/mp/volks/

I live in a warm weather climate, 78 degrees fh today. So it is a
direct possiblity. I will check as you suggested.

What can I do about it if it is the case, besides moving to Michigan
:-) ?

Thanks
Chuck

wrote:
> I live in a warm weather climate, 78 degrees fh today. So it is a
> direct possiblity. I will check as you suggested.
>
> What can I do about it if it is the case, besides moving to Michigan
> :-) ?
>
> Thanks
> Chuck

Hi,

I had a similar problem and it was my electric fuel pump pumping 6
psi, when 3 was fine. So I used a regulator and all is fine. But I
hate to say it, once I had the same problem and it was my valves and
heads. Once hot a valve or a head would warp or leak and I lost
compression. IN a rush I would hose down the engine and it would
start right up. I hate to say the words -- COMPRESSION TEST if it is
not flooding.
Joe

Before you get too deep into this and that, do a compression check. At the
very least, pull the plugs out and see if one of them is significantly
different in coloration from the others (#3) If they are all perfect
looking, maybe skip the compression check, but if it was me, I would check
that 1st if nothing else, to put my mind at ease. It is a typical symptom of
a number of things, one very common one is cracked head or valve trouble. If
it starts right up when you compression start it at a higher spinning speed
than the starter, perhaps this is a factor. If so it should also have
trouble idling smoothly when hot. Hope it's not your problem, but good
chance it is. - Bah

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> I am having trouble starting the engine on my 77 Bus after the engine
> is warmed up. It fires right up on the first turn when the engine is
> cold, but struggles to start when the engine gets hot.
>
> I have a weak battery which I will be replacing very shortly and I am
> thinking it may just be with the engine hot the compression increases
> making it more difficult for that battery to turn the engine over as
> quickly. Although during the first cranking it seems to spin as fast
> as the first start.
>
> But I am guessing it is probably more related to the carb and choking
> mechanism. Or maybe even the points, do points loose some continuity
> when they become hot?
>
> In any case, it is on my list of things to look at. But before I
> started jumping in thought I would ask if anyone has any ideas. After
> all these VWs seem to have some common experiences or causes and if
> that is the case, to take advantage of past experience now.
> Thanks
> Chuck
>

In article . com>,
> wrote:
>I live in a warm weather climate, 78 degrees fh today. So it is a
>direct possiblity. I will check as you suggested.
>
>What can I do about it if it is the case, besides moving to Michigan
>:-) ?

easiest way to cope with it is crank with the gas
pedal to the floor. it should start much easier if
its flodding.


--
Eduardo K. |
| "World domination, now"
http://e.nn.cl | Linus Torvalds

I have a similar problem with one of mine - If its hot but the choke has
cooled (ie back ON ) then I find it helps if I have the ignition switch
on for 30 secs to a min for the choke element to warm up before trying
to start.

Rich

Eduardo K. wrote:
> In article . com>,
> > wrote:
>
>>I live in a warm weather climate, 78 degrees fh today. So it is a
>>direct possiblity. I will check as you suggested.
>>
>>What can I do about it if it is the case, besides moving to Michigan
>>:-) ?
>
>
> easiest way to cope with it is crank with the gas
> pedal to the floor. it should start much easier if
> its flodding.
>
>

I checkedthe plugs and compression and other then number 3 being a
little lower then the others everything looks fine.

I took an evening a rebuilt the carborator, and that seems to have done
the trick. I suspect the needle valve was leaking slightly.

One other thing that I did that may have helped. I put a relay back on
the fuel pump so that the pump will not run unless the engine is
spinning. The pump used to run with the ingition key on even if the
engine was not running. I don't think this was a major hit, for this
issue, but it sure seems to be safer.
Chuck