03 Passat battery question - and ranting

Hi Everyone,

What does the car, an 03 Passat, V6 engine, 5spm, forget if you take out
the battery?

I usually do not drive the car during the winter, and would like to take
out the battery next year. I understand that the following need to be
reprogrammed:
- the radio, I understand it picks up the code from the cluster computer
a short period after reconnecting the battery, but I also have the code
- power window express up/down features, but the manual does say how to
reprogram that
- I have no sunroof
- I have no automatic transmission
- what about theft protection features, will the car forget any of those
settings?
- what about the engine control, specifically the throttle pedal
adaptation, will the car forget that?
- any other thing?

When I asked the service manager about this when I picked up the car
(new), he mentioned that all sort of things need to be reprogrammed by
them in case I do that. I think that service manager is less than
capable and/or honest.
I am looking into getting the VAG-COM.



Now the ranting!

The electronic throttle control is horrible! The throttle sensitivity
keeps changing, it is really hard to drive the car smoothly. Sometimes
the car just does not respond to throttle input, when you are caught in
the wrong gear.
I read an SAE paper from Bosch, late '90s, on electronic throttle
control algorithms, my guess is that is in the Motronic 7.1 that we have
on the car. In summary, the algorithm is optimized for minimizing
emission and for smooth automatic gearbox shifting. In a sense they
consider the input from the driver as disturbance, and they try to
minimize its effect on the system ;-)
I certainly think they did not adequately test it for the manual
transmission version. They managed to engineer out the fun from driving!

Thanks for listening, Peter

Don't take the battery out, and purchase a battery maintainer charger.



"Peter Orban" > wrote in message
...
> Hi Everyone,
>
> What does the car, an 03 Passat, V6 engine, 5spm, forget if you take out
> the battery?
>
> I usually do not drive the car during the winter, and would like to take
> out the battery next year. I understand that the following need to be
> reprogrammed:
> - the radio, I understand it picks up the code from the cluster computer a
> short period after reconnecting the battery, but I also have the code
> - power window express up/down features, but the manual does say how to
> reprogram that
> - I have no sunroof
> - I have no automatic transmission
> - what about theft protection features, will the car forget any of those
> settings?
> - what about the engine control, specifically the throttle pedal
> adaptation, will the car forget that?
> - any other thing?
>
> When I asked the service manager about this when I picked up the car
> (new), he mentioned that all sort of things need to be reprogrammed by
> them in case I do that. I think that service manager is less than capable
> and/or honest.
> I am looking into getting the VAG-COM.
>
>
>
> Now the ranting!
>
> The electronic throttle control is horrible! The throttle sensitivity
> keeps changing, it is really hard to drive the car smoothly. Sometimes the
> car just does not respond to throttle input, when you are caught in the
> wrong gear.
> I read an SAE paper from Bosch, late '90s, on electronic throttle control
> algorithms, my guess is that is in the Motronic 7.1 that we have on the
> car. In summary, the algorithm is optimized for minimizing emission and
> for smooth automatic gearbox shifting. In a sense they consider the input
> from the driver as disturbance, and they try to minimize its effect on the
> system ;-)
> I certainly think they did not adequately test it for the manual
> transmission version. They managed to engineer out the fun from driving!
>
> Thanks for listening, Peter
>

"Woodchuck" > wrote in
:

> Don't take the battery out, and purchase a battery maintainer charger.
>

Not to avoid answering the question (since I don't know the answer), but
isn't it better just to start the car once every couple of weeks, than to
let the car sit through the winter?

You could do that, but consider this. A typical starter draws about 150amps
while cranking the engine over so them electrons must be replaced(charging).
Also my guess you would need to let the engine run for almost 45 minutes to
an hour to warm the engine oil enough to "burn" the moisture out. Beside,
the battery maintainer save gas.

"MikeK" > wrote in message news:ych%d.9621$b_6.3296@trnddc01...
> "Woodchuck" > wrote in
> :
>
>> Don't take the battery out, and purchase a battery maintainer charger.
>>
>
> Not to avoid answering the question (since I don't know the answer), but
> isn't it better just to start the car once every couple of weeks, than to
> let the car sit through the winter?

Hi Woodchuck,

Thanks for the note, that is what I have been doing so far.
Is there a technical explanation why is this necessary?

Thanks, Peter

Woodchuck wrote:
> Don't take the battery out, and purchase a battery maintainer charger.
>
>
>
> "Peter Orban" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Hi Everyone,
>>
>>What does the car, an 03 Passat, V6 engine, 5spm, forget if you take out
>>the battery?
>>
>>I usually do not drive the car during the winter, and would like to take
>>out the battery next year. I understand that the following need to be
>>reprogrammed:
>>- the radio, I understand it picks up the code from the cluster computer a
>>short period after reconnecting the battery, but I also have the code
>>- power window express up/down features, but the manual does say how to
>>reprogram that
>>- I have no sunroof
>>- I have no automatic transmission
>>- what about theft protection features, will the car forget any of those
>>settings?
>>- what about the engine control, specifically the throttle pedal
>>adaptation, will the car forget that?
>>- any other thing?
>>
>>When I asked the service manager about this when I picked up the car
>>(new), he mentioned that all sort of things need to be reprogrammed by
>>them in case I do that. I think that service manager is less than capable
>>and/or honest.
>>I am looking into getting the VAG-COM.
>>
>>
>>
>>Now the ranting!
>>
>>The electronic throttle control is horrible! The throttle sensitivity
>>keeps changing, it is really hard to drive the car smoothly. Sometimes the
>>car just does not respond to throttle input, when you are caught in the
>>wrong gear.
>>I read an SAE paper from Bosch, late '90s, on electronic throttle control
>>algorithms, my guess is that is in the Motronic 7.1 that we have on the
>>car. In summary, the algorithm is optimized for minimizing emission and
>>for smooth automatic gearbox shifting. In a sense they consider the input
>>from the driver as disturbance, and they try to minimize its effect on the
>>system ;-)
>>I certainly think they did not adequately test it for the manual
>>transmission version. They managed to engineer out the fun from driving!
>>
>>Thanks for listening, Peter
>>
>
>
>

Even if you have the car shuct off there is about a 20ma draw on the battery
from the various ECU's and if you don't lock the car the draw is about 50ma.
So it's best to lock the car even if it's your garage. Did that answer your
question?

"Peter Orban" > wrote in message
...
> Hi Woodchuck,
>
> Thanks for the note, that is what I have been doing so far.
> Is there a technical explanation why is this necessary?
>
> Thanks, Peter
>
> Woodchuck wrote:
>> Don't take the battery out, and purchase a battery maintainer charger.
>>
>>
>>
>> "Peter Orban" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>Hi Everyone,
>>>
>>>What does the car, an 03 Passat, V6 engine, 5spm, forget if you take out
>>>the battery?
>>>
>>>I usually do not drive the car during the winter, and would like to take
>>>out the battery next year. I understand that the following need to be
>>>reprogrammed:
>>>- the radio, I understand it picks up the code from the cluster computer
>>>a short period after reconnecting the battery, but I also have the code
>>>- power window express up/down features, but the manual does say how to
>>>reprogram that
>>>- I have no sunroof
>>>- I have no automatic transmission
>>>- what about theft protection features, will the car forget any of those
>>>settings?
>>>- what about the engine control, specifically the throttle pedal
>>>adaptation, will the car forget that?
>>>- any other thing?
>>>
>>>When I asked the service manager about this when I picked up the car
>>>(new), he mentioned that all sort of things need to be reprogrammed by
>>>them in case I do that. I think that service manager is less than capable
>>>and/or honest.
>>>I am looking into getting the VAG-COM.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Now the ranting!
>>>
>>>The electronic throttle control is horrible! The throttle sensitivity
>>>keeps changing, it is really hard to drive the car smoothly. Sometimes
>>>the car just does not respond to throttle input, when you are caught in
>>>the wrong gear.
>>>I read an SAE paper from Bosch, late '90s, on electronic throttle control
>>>algorithms, my guess is that is in the Motronic 7.1 that we have on the
>>>car. In summary, the algorithm is optimized for minimizing emission and
>>>for smooth automatic gearbox shifting. In a sense they consider the input
>>>from the driver as disturbance, and they try to minimize its effect on
>>>the system ;-)
>>>I certainly think they did not adequately test it for the manual
>>>transmission version. They managed to engineer out the fun from driving!
>>>
>>>Thanks for listening, Peter
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>

Hi Woodchuck,

Thanks for that other interesting tidbit on the difference in current draw!

I guess I was not clear enough what question I was looking for an answer.
What I would like to know is what happens when reconnecting a battery to
the car that was taken out of the car for the winter. What information
needs to be reprogrammed/restored?

BTW, there is a bug in the convenience module: the flashing security
light in the door is on continuously after 28 days of inactivity, as
opposed to be turned off.

Thanks, Peter

Woodchuck wrote:
> Even if you have the car shuct off there is about a 20ma draw on the battery
> from the various ECU's and if you don't lock the car the draw is about 50ma.
> So it's best to lock the car even if it's your garage. Did that answer your
> question?
>

Is it true that an engine that is left without running for an extended
period of time loses its oil coating?

Certainly if you leave an engine for a very long time, there will be
rust that starts. Water enhances oxidation but it is not needed. Oxygen is.

Perhaps you could store the car in a Nitrogen environment.

Rob

Woodchuck wrote:
> You could do that, but consider this. A typical starter draws about 150amps
> while cranking the engine over so them electrons must be replaced(charging).
> Also my guess you would need to let the engine run for almost 45 minutes to
> an hour to warm the engine oil enough to "burn" the moisture out. Beside,
> the battery maintainer save gas.
>
> "MikeK" > wrote in message news:ych%d.9621$b_6.3296@trnddc01...
>
>>"Woodchuck" > wrote in
:
>>
>>
>>>Don't take the battery out, and purchase a battery maintainer charger.
>>>
>>
>>Not to avoid answering the question (since I don't know the answer), but
>>isn't it better just to start the car once every couple of weeks, than to
>>let the car sit through the winter?
>
>
>