Sebring---- SUDDEN ACCELERATION

We talked about this in a class one time where the cruise control servo
soloniods could short out or malfunction and cause this. It was awhile ago
and cant remember the details. It was not a particular model or make vehicle
either. I believe it had something to do with the vent valve on the servo.
Research it on the net.
"jonz6" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Servo? Yes it has cruise
>

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005, jonz6 wrote:

> Nope i didn't happen that way. My wife was backing up with her foot on
> the brake. She must not have been braking that hard.. but she says she
> had her foot on the brake pedal and when shifting forward on the shift
> lever into drive & past neutral is when it SUDDENLY jumped backward and
> fast.

Nope, it didn't happen that way. Your wife hit the gas without knowing it,
period. I know it's less embarrassing and less expensive for her to blame
it on the car, but cars do not behave so much as they are behaved upon.

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005, Alex Rodriguez wrote:

> Yes. This happened to Audi's a while back. The government did a lot of
> reasearch. In all instances the brake system was still functioning
> properly. In all instances the drivers states they were stepping on the
> brakes as hard as they could and the car kept going. The government came
> to the conclusion that this was a case of pedal mis-application. That
> means that driver was stepping on the wrong pedal.

Yup. The hysterical media reports nearly ruined Audi, though.

On Sat, 22 Jan 2005, jonz6 wrote:

> Servo? Yes it has cruise

Ah, right, here we go with the "sudden, full, completely unintended
activation of the cruise control despite the car being in reverse, below
the threshhold speed AND the brakes allegedly applied" theory.

Have you ever heard of Occam's Razor? It's a scientific principle that
says the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. Now, which is
simpler? A or B?

A: Your wife stepped on the wrong pedal.

B: The cruise control on/off switch, the cruise control "set" switch, the
brake light and cruise-kill switch, and the SBEC "no cruise control under
30MPH, and only in the Forward direction" programming all failed at the
same time, the cruise control engaged and pulled the throttle wide open.

"jonz6" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Nope i didn't happen that way. My wife was backing up with her foot on
> the brake. She must not have been braking that hard.. but she says she
> had her foot on the brake pedal and when shifting forward on the shift
> lever into drive & past neutral is when it SUDDENLY jumped backward and
> fast. She then smashed on the brake pedal at the same time she crunched
> into another car.

If you want to make any kind of a legal case, you will have a major uphill
battle. As others have stated, the AVN ("Audi Victims Network") legal
campaign went down in flames when multiple and overwhelming sources of
evidence showed to everyone (including consumer organizations) that driver
error was at fault. Drivers inevitably swore they did not commit pedal
error, even when it was conclusively demonstrated they had. Additionally, a
high proportion of the drivers involved were either menopause-age women or
seniors of both sexes.

Please don't take this as a challenge to your (or your wife's) honesty,
merely a "heads-up" about the historical background.

"Daniel J. Stern" > writes:

> On Fri, 21 Jan 2005, Alex Rodriguez wrote:
>
> > Yes. This happened to Audi's a while back. The government did a lot of
> > reasearch. In all instances the brake system was still functioning
> > properly. In all instances the drivers states they were stepping on the
> > brakes as hard as they could and the car kept going. The government came
> > to the conclusion that this was a case of pedal mis-application. That
> > means that driver was stepping on the wrong pedal.
>
> Yup. The hysterical media reports nearly ruined Audi, though.

To Road&Track's credit, they took an Audi and tried it. The result
was a driver that was convinced he'd experienced it (and was positive
his foot was on the brake), and an observer that said, "no, it was on
the gas...."
--
Joseph J. Pfeiffer, Jr., Ph.D. Phone -- (505) 646-1605
Department of Computer Science FAX -- (505) 646-1002
New Mexico State University http://www.cs.nmsu.edu/~pfeiffer

My 1991 Dodge Monaco used to do that. The cruise control would just all of a
sudden make the car accelerate. I don't touch the cruise buttons anymore.
However, I don't drive it much anymore either.

Larry
Behold Beware Believe

"Daniel J. Stern" > wrote in message
.umich.edu...
| On Sat, 22 Jan 2005, jonz6 wrote:
|
| > Servo? Yes it has cruise
|
| Ah, right, here we go with the "sudden, full, completely unintended
| activation of the cruise control despite the car being in reverse, below
| the threshhold speed AND the brakes allegedly applied" theory.
|
| Have you ever heard of Occam's Razor? It's a scientific principle that
| says the simplest explanation is usually the correct one. Now, which is
| simpler? A or B?
|
| A: Your wife stepped on the wrong pedal.
|
| B: The cruise control on/off switch, the cruise control "set" switch, the
| brake light and cruise-kill switch, and the SBEC "no cruise control under
| 30MPH, and only in the Forward direction" programming all failed at the
| same time, the cruise control engaged and pulled the throttle wide open.
|
|
|

On Sat, 22 Jan 2005, Larry Crites wrote:

> My 1991 Dodge Monaco used to do that. The cruise control would just all of a
> sudden make the car accelerate.

Not below 30 mph with your foot on the brake and the trans in "Reverse",
it wouldn't.

Dave Gower wrote:

> "jonz6" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>
>>Nope i didn't happen that way. My wife was backing up with her foot on
>>the brake. She must not have been braking that hard.. but she says she
>>had her foot on the brake pedal and when shifting forward on the shift
>>lever into drive & past neutral is when it SUDDENLY jumped backward and
>>fast. She then smashed on the brake pedal at the same time she crunched
>>into another car.
>
>
> If you want to make any kind of a legal case, you will have a major uphill
> battle. As others have stated, the AVN ("Audi Victims Network") legal
> campaign went down in flames when multiple and overwhelming sources of
> evidence showed to everyone (including consumer organizations) that driver
> error was at fault. Drivers inevitably swore they did not commit pedal
> error, even when it was conclusively demonstrated they had. Additionally, a
> high proportion of the drivers involved were either menopause-age women or
> seniors of both sexes.
>
> Please don't take this as a challenge to your (or your wife's) honesty,
> merely a "heads-up" about the historical background.

Yes, I don't think it is an honesty issue. I believe that many, if not
all, of the Audi drivers really believed that they were mashing the
brake, when they were, unfortunately, mashing the throttle. And this
gentleman's wife very likely also believed that as well. However, that
still doesn't change the fact that it is about 99.44% certain that she
hit the throttle by mistake, especially if she was twisted around
looking backwards when backing up.


Matt

Not an engineer, But if the vent solonoid does not vent the vacuum when the
PCM commands it to I would think there is a possiblity of cruise control
under the desired limit
"Daniel J. Stern" > wrote in message
.umich.edu...
> On Sat, 22 Jan 2005, Larry Crites wrote:
>
> > My 1991 Dodge Monaco used to do that. The cruise control would just all
of a
> > sudden make the car accelerate.
>
> Not below 30 mph with your foot on the brake and the trans in "Reverse",
> it wouldn't.