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#21
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new Honda CR-V break in
On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 19:44:34 -0500, "Elmo P. Shagnasty"
> wrote: >In article >, > Larry in AZ > wrote: > >> Waiving the right to remain silent, "Guy" > said: >> >> > I got a new 2010 CR-V and wife asked me how to break it in properly. >> > What is the proper way? >> >> RTFM. > >And a fine manual it is. A thick one too. |
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#22
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new Honda CR-V break in
On 01/01/2010 06:23 PM, Guy wrote:
> On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 17:14:37 -0800, jim > wrote: > >> On 01/01/2010 04:54 PM, JRE wrote: >>> Tegger wrote: >>>> jim > wrote in >>>> t: >>>>> On 01/01/2010 12:38 PM, Joe wrote: >>>> >>>>>> It makes sense to be informed. Talk to the technician doing the work >>>>>> before and after. Make sure they're not cutting corners... >>>>>> >>>>> while the dealer is the safest long term bet, i have to say, they're >>>>> not infallible. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Ain't that the truth. >>>> >>>> My own dealer got three years out of the original oil pan. Then they >>>> managed to strip the plug. The monkeys were severely overtightening >>>> the plug, probably by using a combo wrench and tightening it by >>>> hanging from it, as monkeys do. >>>> >>>> I'm still running with the replacement pan, sixteen years later. The >>>> plug is not stripped. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> The faithfully torqued (with a torque wrench, to spec, every time, >>> without exception, since the car was new) drain plug in my '91 Accord >>> stripped about a year and a half ago. Pretty annoying...and very >>> unusual. But that's why they make self-tapping replacements, I suppose. >>> >>> (Note: I recently got a new torque wrench and checked it against the old >>> one. They're within a foot-pound of each other.) >>> >> >> [much to the delight of "crv guy" no doubt] i actually disregard factory >> oil pan plug torque. 45N.m is very high for something with a soft >> aluminum crush washer under it. i use ~30N.m and have never had a >> thread strip, nor a plug loosen or leak. replicate at your own risk. > > > Thanks Jim for your honesty<smile>. At least we can agree here. so /you/ did the math too??? somehow, i find that hard to believe. |
#23
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new Honda CR-V break in
On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 18:36:52 -0800, jim beam > wrote:
>On 01/01/2010 06:23 PM, Guy wrote: >> On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 17:14:37 -0800, jim > wrote: >> >>> On 01/01/2010 04:54 PM, JRE wrote: >>>> Tegger wrote: >>>>> jim > wrote in >>>>> t: >>>>>> On 01/01/2010 12:38 PM, Joe wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>> It makes sense to be informed. Talk to the technician doing the work >>>>>>> before and after. Make sure they're not cutting corners... >>>>>>> >>>>>> while the dealer is the safest long term bet, i have to say, they're >>>>>> not infallible. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Ain't that the truth. >>>>> >>>>> My own dealer got three years out of the original oil pan. Then they >>>>> managed to strip the plug. The monkeys were severely overtightening >>>>> the plug, probably by using a combo wrench and tightening it by >>>>> hanging from it, as monkeys do. >>>>> >>>>> I'm still running with the replacement pan, sixteen years later. The >>>>> plug is not stripped. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> The faithfully torqued (with a torque wrench, to spec, every time, >>>> without exception, since the car was new) drain plug in my '91 Accord >>>> stripped about a year and a half ago. Pretty annoying...and very >>>> unusual. But that's why they make self-tapping replacements, I suppose. >>>> >>>> (Note: I recently got a new torque wrench and checked it against the old >>>> one. They're within a foot-pound of each other.) >>>> >>> >>> [much to the delight of "crv guy" no doubt] i actually disregard factory >>> oil pan plug torque. 45N.m is very high for something with a soft >>> aluminum crush washer under it. i use ~30N.m and have never had a >>> thread strip, nor a plug loosen or leak. replicate at your own risk. >> >> >> Thanks Jim for your honesty<smile>. At least we can agree here. > >so /you/ did the math too??? somehow, i find that hard to believe. Wow, you admit the factory might be wrong but you can't. I find that NOT hard to believe. |
#25
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new Honda CR-V break in
On 01/01/2010 09:35 PM, Guy wrote:
> On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 18:36:52 -0800, jim > wrote: > >> On 01/01/2010 06:23 PM, Guy wrote: >>> On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 17:14:37 -0800, jim > wrote: >>> >>>> On 01/01/2010 04:54 PM, JRE wrote: >>>>> Tegger wrote: >>>>>> jim > wrote in >>>>>> t: >>>>>>> On 01/01/2010 12:38 PM, Joe wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>> It makes sense to be informed. Talk to the technician doing the work >>>>>>>> before and after. Make sure they're not cutting corners... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> while the dealer is the safest long term bet, i have to say, they're >>>>>>> not infallible. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Ain't that the truth. >>>>>> >>>>>> My own dealer got three years out of the original oil pan. Then they >>>>>> managed to strip the plug. The monkeys were severely overtightening >>>>>> the plug, probably by using a combo wrench and tightening it by >>>>>> hanging from it, as monkeys do. >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm still running with the replacement pan, sixteen years later. The >>>>>> plug is not stripped. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The faithfully torqued (with a torque wrench, to spec, every time, >>>>> without exception, since the car was new) drain plug in my '91 Accord >>>>> stripped about a year and a half ago. Pretty annoying...and very >>>>> unusual. But that's why they make self-tapping replacements, I suppose. >>>>> >>>>> (Note: I recently got a new torque wrench and checked it against the old >>>>> one. They're within a foot-pound of each other.) >>>>> >>>> >>>> [much to the delight of "crv guy" no doubt] i actually disregard factory >>>> oil pan plug torque. 45N.m is very high for something with a soft >>>> aluminum crush washer under it. i use ~30N.m and have never had a >>>> thread strip, nor a plug loosen or leak. replicate at your own risk. >>> >>> >>> Thanks Jim for your honesty<smile>. At least we can agree here. >> >> so /you/ did the math too??? somehow, i find that hard to believe. > > Wow, you admit the factory might be wrong but you can't. > I find that NOT hard to believe. "you admit the factory might be wrong but you can't"??? on the basis that you're evidencing an english language "garbage out" problem, there must also be english language "garbage in" problem with you too. which explains everything! |
#26
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new Honda CR-V break in
On 01/02/2010 06:57 AM, Tegger wrote:
> jim > wrote in news:Kf- > : > > >>> >> >> [much to the delight of "crv guy" no doubt] i actually disregard factory >> oil pan plug torque. 45N.m is very high for something with a soft >> aluminum crush washer under it. i use ~30N.m and have never had a >> thread strip, nor a plug loosen or leak. replicate at your own risk. >> > > > > I've used the factory washer and torque setting of 33 ft/lbs (45 Nm) for > close to ten years now. The six years prior to that I mostly used a fiber > washer and 20 ft/lbs. > > My suspicion is that oil pan thread stripping is due to /severe/ > overtightening, not adherence to the factory setting. in my opinion, 45 N.m is over-tightening. two reasons: 1. the oil pan is a relatively soft material - it has to be to be formed out of a single piece of steel like that. torque near yield, plus thermal cycling loads - too close for my comfort. 2. the annealed aluminum washer starts out pretty much as soft as the fiber washer - it seals by deformation filling all the crevices, not by compression as such. bottom line - once it's deformed enough to seal, it doesn't need to be deformed any more. torque similar to the fiber washer is sufficient. > > I also suspect the factory beefed up the threads on pans made after 1991 by > using a slightly heavier gauge of steel for the thread insert. i'm not sure most of them even have a thread insert. if they did, it could indeed be a stronger material and higher torque, but that's not the point - the point is that torque only needs to be sufficient to cause washer deformation sufficient to seal - and to provide sufficient friction to prevent loosening. anything over that is excess. honda have specified a mechanical load torque on a non-mechanical load fastener. |
#27
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new Honda CR-V break in
On Sat, 02 Jan 2010 08:11:21 -0800, jim beam > wrote:
>On 01/01/2010 09:35 PM, Guy wrote: >> On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 18:36:52 -0800, jim > wrote: >> >>> On 01/01/2010 06:23 PM, Guy wrote: >>>> On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 17:14:37 -0800, jim > wrote: >>>> >>>>> On 01/01/2010 04:54 PM, JRE wrote: >>>>>> Tegger wrote: >>>>>>> jim > wrote in >>>>>>> t: >>>>>>>> On 01/01/2010 12:38 PM, Joe wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It makes sense to be informed. Talk to the technician doing the work >>>>>>>>> before and after. Make sure they're not cutting corners... >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> while the dealer is the safest long term bet, i have to say, they're >>>>>>>> not infallible. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Ain't that the truth. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My own dealer got three years out of the original oil pan. Then they >>>>>>> managed to strip the plug. The monkeys were severely overtightening >>>>>>> the plug, probably by using a combo wrench and tightening it by >>>>>>> hanging from it, as monkeys do. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I'm still running with the replacement pan, sixteen years later. The >>>>>>> plug is not stripped. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> The faithfully torqued (with a torque wrench, to spec, every time, >>>>>> without exception, since the car was new) drain plug in my '91 Accord >>>>>> stripped about a year and a half ago. Pretty annoying...and very >>>>>> unusual. But that's why they make self-tapping replacements, I suppose. >>>>>> >>>>>> (Note: I recently got a new torque wrench and checked it against the old >>>>>> one. They're within a foot-pound of each other.) >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> [much to the delight of "crv guy" no doubt] i actually disregard factory >>>>> oil pan plug torque. 45N.m is very high for something with a soft >>>>> aluminum crush washer under it. i use ~30N.m and have never had a >>>>> thread strip, nor a plug loosen or leak. replicate at your own risk. >>>> >>>> >>>> Thanks Jim for your honesty<smile>. At least we can agree here. >>> >>> so /you/ did the math too??? somehow, i find that hard to believe. >> >> Wow, you admit the factory might be wrong but you can't. >> I find that NOT hard to believe. > >"you admit the factory might be wrong but you can't"??? > >on the basis that you're evidencing an english language "garbage out" >problem, there must also be english language "garbage in" problem with >you too. which explains everything! Thanks for giving me the best word to describe what I think of your opinion now... "garbage". People disagree but when some people carry on the way you do, they have something wrong. Why not make yourself happy and PLONK me so I don't have to see your "garbage" posts any longer. |
#28
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new Honda CR-V break in
On 1/2/2010 1:27 PM, Guy wrote:
> > Thanks for giving me the best word to describe what I think of your > opinion now... "garbage". People disagree but when some people carry > on the way you do, they have something wrong. Why not make yourself > happy and PLONK me so I don't have to see your "garbage" posts any > longer. You have to "plonk" him to avoid seeing his posts. |
#29
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new Honda CR-V break in
On Sat, 02 Jan 2010 13:36:32 -0400, Brian Smith
> wrote: >On 1/2/2010 1:27 PM, Guy wrote: >> >> Thanks for giving me the best word to describe what I think of your >> opinion now... "garbage". People disagree but when some people carry >> on the way you do, they have something wrong. Why not make yourself >> happy and PLONK me so I don't have to see your "garbage" posts any >> longer. > > You have to "plonk" him to avoid seeing his posts. You're right. Still hope he PLONKS me first. |
#30
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new Honda CR-V break in
On 01/02/2010 09:27 AM, Guy wrote:
> On Sat, 02 Jan 2010 08:11:21 -0800, jim > wrote: > >> On 01/01/2010 09:35 PM, Guy wrote: >>> On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 18:36:52 -0800, jim > wrote: >>> >>>> On 01/01/2010 06:23 PM, Guy wrote: >>>>> On Fri, 01 Jan 2010 17:14:37 -0800, jim > wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On 01/01/2010 04:54 PM, JRE wrote: >>>>>>> Tegger wrote: >>>>>>>> jim > wrote in >>>>>>>> t: >>>>>>>>> On 01/01/2010 12:38 PM, Joe wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> It makes sense to be informed. Talk to the technician doing the work >>>>>>>>>> before and after. Make sure they're not cutting corners... >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> while the dealer is the safest long term bet, i have to say, they're >>>>>>>>> not infallible. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Ain't that the truth. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My own dealer got three years out of the original oil pan. Then they >>>>>>>> managed to strip the plug. The monkeys were severely overtightening >>>>>>>> the plug, probably by using a combo wrench and tightening it by >>>>>>>> hanging from it, as monkeys do. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'm still running with the replacement pan, sixteen years later. The >>>>>>>> plug is not stripped. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The faithfully torqued (with a torque wrench, to spec, every time, >>>>>>> without exception, since the car was new) drain plug in my '91 Accord >>>>>>> stripped about a year and a half ago. Pretty annoying...and very >>>>>>> unusual. But that's why they make self-tapping replacements, I suppose. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> (Note: I recently got a new torque wrench and checked it against the old >>>>>>> one. They're within a foot-pound of each other.) >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> [much to the delight of "crv guy" no doubt] i actually disregard factory >>>>>> oil pan plug torque. 45N.m is very high for something with a soft >>>>>> aluminum crush washer under it. i use ~30N.m and have never had a >>>>>> thread strip, nor a plug loosen or leak. replicate at your own risk. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Thanks Jim for your honesty<smile>. At least we can agree here. >>>> >>>> so /you/ did the math too??? somehow, i find that hard to believe. >>> >>> Wow, you admit the factory might be wrong but you can't. >>> I find that NOT hard to believe. >> >> "you admit the factory might be wrong but you can't"??? >> >> on the basis that you're evidencing an english language "garbage out" >> problem, there must also be english language "garbage in" problem with >> you too. which explains everything! > > > Thanks for giving me the best word to describe what I think of your > opinion now... "garbage". People disagree but when some people carry > on the way you do, they have something wrong. Why not make yourself > happy and PLONK me so I don't have to see your "garbage" posts any > longer. i have a better solution: you stop flaunting your willful ignorance, then see what kind a reaction you get. think about it. if you can. |
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