New '06 models

"marx404" > wrote in message
...
> We just got in a "secret" stash of 2006 ION and VUEs. First of all, I am
> already impressed with the changes in the ION:
>
> Optonal 2.4L engine has performance suspension and sportier sounding
> exhaust. Engine has built-in oil cooler module.
>
> ION & VUE:
> New radio! Center large selector dial with tabbed red LCD display and
better
> sound. sweeet. Lots of chrome inside. A much more classy look for the VUE.
> New 5 spoke wheels and wheel covers for the ION.
>
> marx404

Does the 2006 4 door ION sedan have a fold flat front passenger seat or is
that still just in the 2 door?
ron

Gas savings don't pay for the price deference. MSN has had comparisons between the small hybrids and the Hummer H1.
"marx404" > wrote in message ...
I haven't seen any new colors yet, they should start appearing soon.

As far as hybrids, do check out Saturnfans.com where there are pics of the
hybris VUE that they have been working on. Supposedly, I hear that Saturn
has been silently working on hybrids for years, but just has not found a way
to make them efficient, safe, reliable or affordable.

marx404

no one wrote:
> Gas savings don't pay for the price deference. MSN has had comparisons
> between the small hybrids and the Hummer H1.
>
> "marx404" >> wrote in message
> ...
> I haven't seen any new colors yet, they should start appearing soon.
>
> As far as hybrids, do check out Saturnfans.com where there are pics
> of the
> hybris VUE that they have been working on. Supposedly, I hear that
> Saturn
> has been silently working on hybrids for years, but just has not
> found a way
> to make them efficient, safe, reliable or affordable.
>
> marx404
>

About the only hybrid I'd be seriously looking at (provided it hits
production) is the Mercury Meta 1. Diesel electric has been around for
ages (just look at you local railway yard) and, at least in large scale,
it seems to get the job done.

I think that a better choice these days, provided the north american
regulators get on board, is ultra low sulphur diesel. There are some
killer sweet diesel engines in europe that I'd take over a hybrid any
day...but they'd die a fairly quick and horribly painful death with the
garbage we call diesel over here.

As for the trucks....I've driven a good number of all the ones mentioned
here at work. The Colorados/Canyons are nice, though they are a medium
sized (as compared to the old S-10 small) truck. I find the Dakotas
bigger, but they sound tinny and don't get as nice mileage with the
small 8 as the I-5 does. The Tundra I had wasn't bad, but I have to
agree, for a full size, go domestic....we really have done a better job
with them....not to say that the toyota won't go on for years and
years...it is just that we have better idea of what a truck is and what
it is used for.

Cheers,

Michael Halliwell

"Philip Nasadowski" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> blah blah > wrote:
>
>> No worries, hybrids cost to much and dont meet EPA numbers. GM always
>> meets EPA numbers.
>
> Hybrids aren't big sellers, nd even the optimists are now saying they
> won't get much more than 10% of the total market...
>
> In real life, hybrids just don't get that much better mileage. I bet
> Toyota could have just taken the Prius's laughable 70hp motor, put it in
> an Echo, gotten nearly the same EPA numbers. But it wouldn't have sold
> because it'd be seen as what the Prius really is - a ****ty gutless
> Toyota.
>
>> Batteries can be recycled. The problem with Hybrids is they are a money
>> pit! You spend more money than you could ever possibly save in fuel
>> cost.
>
> *ding!* They don't make economic sense. If you drive high miles,
> you're mostly highway - Hybrids suck there. If you don't, the costs
> NEVER outweight the savings, especially in normally hot or cold climates
> where the engine runs all the time. It's the same reason why those
> $1000 front load eco washers aren't worth it - you'll never save that
> much water/electricity over the 4 year lifespan of them

Our Maytag Neptune front loader is 9 years old now and the only repair it
needed was a free upgrade provided by Maytag to replace circuit board and
provide a door seal with drain. Major advantage to front loaders is that
you can wash a king size comforter without it floating in the washer.

Art wrote:
> "Philip Nasadowski" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>In article >,
>>blah blah > wrote:
>>
>>
>>>No worries, hybrids cost to much and dont meet EPA numbers. GM always
>>>meets EPA numbers.
>>
>>Hybrids aren't big sellers, nd even the optimists are now saying they
>>won't get much more than 10% of the total market...
>>
>>In real life, hybrids just don't get that much better mileage. I bet
>>Toyota could have just taken the Prius's laughable 70hp motor, put it in
>>an Echo, gotten nearly the same EPA numbers. But it wouldn't have sold
>>because it'd be seen as what the Prius really is - a ****ty gutless
>>Toyota.
>>
>>
>>>Batteries can be recycled. The problem with Hybrids is they are a money
>>>pit! You spend more money than you could ever possibly save in fuel
>>>cost.
>>
>>*ding!* They don't make economic sense. If you drive high miles,
>>you're mostly highway - Hybrids suck there. If you don't, the costs
>>NEVER outweight the savings, especially in normally hot or cold climates
>>where the engine runs all the time. It's the same reason why those
>>$1000 front load eco washers aren't worth it - you'll never save that
>>much water/electricity over the 4 year lifespan of them
>
>
> Our Maytag Neptune front loader is 9 years old now and the only repair it
> needed was a free upgrade provided by Maytag to replace circuit board and
> provide a door seal with drain. Major advantage to front loaders is that
> you can wash a king size comforter without it floating in the washer.
>
>
Got a Kenmore top load set about the same age, looking to replace with
front loader in the new few years. I've only replaced a level switch in
the washer to date, but am due for something in the dryer as it's
starting to get noisy. I'm currently buying the Tide cold water wash
concentrate thinking washing in cold will save a couple of bucks (we
have a rooftop solar water heater, but it's got a 9,000 watt electric
backup to keep the temp up on cloudy days - seems expensive to operate).

> "Philip Nasadowski" wrote:
> Hybrids aren't big sellers, nd even the optimists are now saying they
> won't get much more than 10% of the total market...

??

Explain then why Toyota cannot produce those hybrids fast enough. Sure
didn't stop their Lexus hybrid nor Toyota's reluctance to build a new plant
for their Camry 2006 hybrid or the Outback hybrid SUV.

> In real life, hybrids just don't get that much better mileage.

??

So the guy in the Toyota Prius forum who is getting 111 mpg is wasting gas?
Surely you jest. Even with it getting a wasteful 49-50 mpg (which seems
average) it still beats any other thing out there.

> I bet Toyota could have just taken the Prius's laughable 70hp motor, put
> it in
> an Echo, gotten nearly the same EPA numbers. But it wouldn't have sold
> because it'd be seen as what the Prius really is - a ****ty gutless
> Toyota.

Try driving one if you think it's gutless. I have driven it and it
accelerates like hell with the electrics. Local dealer sends his
salespeople to LA over a mountain called the Grapevine from Central Valley
and got it up to 104 mph with 4 people in it.

>> Batteries can be recycled. The problem with Hybrids is they are a money
>> pit! You spend more money than you could ever possibly save in fuel
>> cost.
> *ding!* They don't make economic sense. If you drive high miles,
> you're mostly highway - Hybrids suck there. If you don't, the costs
> NEVER outweigh the savings, especially in normally hot or cold climates
> where the engine runs all the time.

What a load. If you look at the mileage numbers of some of the used 2001
models, they have over 100,000 miles on them. What loss? If you tend to
toss a vehicle every 2-3 years maybe, but if you hold onto it for 5-7 you'll
come out ahead. Besides, what stops a person from buying a pickup, say a
Dodge Ram Hemi verses a cheaper Nissan Titan (a $10,000 difference) when the
Titan gets better mileage? You could say you're wasting money on the Dodge
couldn't you? Paying a lease, for what amounts as a rental, could be seen
as wasteful too. To be fair, you need to compare it to an equivalent model
like a non-hybrid Prius. Remember the base price is around $21,000 or
similar to the Camry, but loading it up with all the electronic goodies
(GPS, etc) runs it, and any other model, up really quick to around $28,000.

Besides, the fuel savings "alone" on the hybrid is worth something to
future generations, regardless of cost. If the price of gas rises, then
you'' come out ahead if you hold onto the vehicle until 100,000 miles or
more. A three-fold mpg efficiency and the eco-savings negates the price of
any non-hybrid. Not to mention those with a $2-3K Gas-Guzzler Tax" imposed
(usually applied to the higher priced exotics over $70,000).

B~

> It's the same reason why those
> $1000 front load eco washers aren't worth it - you'll never save that
> much water/electricity over the 4 year lifespan of them (a better idea -
> make appliances that last 20 years, you'll save more energy)
>
>> Btw you hear about the Toyota(or honda?) hybrid stalling problem?

Yes. It was a software problem and has been corrected.

In time, the hybrid's price will fall. Same hold true for just about
anything. Try and buy a mechanical watch cheaper than an electronic.

> GM's biggest issue now is interior fit/finish, and lack of a nice RWD
> sedan platform or two. And B-O-R-I-N-G styling....

I agree on that one. Always loved Ford's styling, just their lousy engines
and powertrains I had problems with.

B~

B. Peg wrote:
>>"Philip Nasadowski" wrote:
>>Hybrids aren't big sellers, nd even the optimists are now saying they
>>won't get much more than 10% of the total market...
>
>
> ??
>
> Explain then why Toyota cannot produce those hybrids fast enough. Sure
> didn't stop their Lexus hybrid nor Toyota's reluctance to build a new plant
> for their Camry 2006 hybrid or the Outback hybrid SUV.
>
>
>>In real life, hybrids just don't get that much better mileage.
>
>
> ??
>
> So the guy in the Toyota Prius forum who is getting 111 mpg is wasting gas?
> Surely you jest. Even with it getting a wasteful 49-50 mpg (which seems
> average) it still beats any other thing out there.
>

http://www.edmunds.com/advice/specia...8/article.html

"Jonnie Santos" > wrote in message
news:KylAe.30368$8o.14604@fed1read03...
> Art wrote:
>> "Philip Nasadowski" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>In article >,
>>>blah blah > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>No worries, hybrids cost to much and dont meet EPA numbers. GM always
>>>>meets EPA numbers.
>>>
>>>Hybrids aren't big sellers, nd even the optimists are now saying they
>>>won't get much more than 10% of the total market...
>>>
>>>In real life, hybrids just don't get that much better mileage. I bet
>>>Toyota could have just taken the Prius's laughable 70hp motor, put it in
>>>an Echo, gotten nearly the same EPA numbers. But it wouldn't have sold
>>>because it'd be seen as what the Prius really is - a ****ty gutless
>>>Toyota.
>>>
>>>
>>>>Batteries can be recycled. The problem with Hybrids is they are a money
>>>>pit! You spend more money than you could ever possibly save in fuel
>>>>cost.
>>>
>>>*ding!* They don't make economic sense. If you drive high miles,
>>>you're mostly highway - Hybrids suck there. If you don't, the costs
>>>NEVER outweight the savings, especially in normally hot or cold climates
>>>where the engine runs all the time. It's the same reason why those
>>>$1000 front load eco washers aren't worth it - you'll never save that
>>>much water/electricity over the 4 year lifespan of them
>>
>>
>> Our Maytag Neptune front loader is 9 years old now and the only repair it
>> needed was a free upgrade provided by Maytag to replace circuit board and
>> provide a door seal with drain. Major advantage to front loaders is that
>> you can wash a king size comforter without it floating in the washer.
> Got a Kenmore top load set about the same age, looking to replace with
> front loader in the new few years. I've only replaced a level switch in
> the washer to date, but am due for something in the dryer as it's starting
> to get noisy. I'm currently buying the Tide cold water wash concentrate
> thinking washing in cold will save a couple of bucks (we have a rooftop
> solar water heater, but it's got a 9,000 watt electric backup to keep the
> temp up on cloudy days - seems expensive to operate).

The dryer is probably easy to fix. Post the model number on alt.home.repair
and you will probably get the help you need on dissasmbly and parts
required. If you are talking an electric dryer though, Kenmore has a best
buy according to Consumer Reports that sells for around $350 so repairing
old one may not be worth it even if easy.