Fix-it exhaust ticket in Virginia?

Got a call from the girlie this AM... apparently she got pulled over
over the weekend and got a ticket in Fairfax County for a loud exhaust.
Fair enough, it is pretty loud.* Question is this - from her
description of the ticket and the statute she is accused of violating,
it sounds like this isn't a "fix-it" ticket the way i'm used to seeing
them - what I expected was that she would have "x" days to get the car
fixed and inspected and then the ticket would go away. Now the way she
described it to me was that she has a choice of either paying the
ticket or going to court to fight it. Does this sound right? If she
goes to court and has had a new exhaust put on the car before the court
date, does that tend to get one any leniency? At any point would the
car need to be inspected, and if so how do they determine whether the
exhaust is too loud or not?

Second question - the way the Virginia law is written it seems to imply
that one actually needs to have a factory-spec exhaust system on the
car. How much leniency is there in that law? My inclination is to try
to get the center pipe and resonator that I intended to get from the
mfgr. of the system years ago, swap that in, and see if it flies - but
I'm sure that it still won't be as quiet as stock. In fact, I'm not
aware of any systems available that *are* as quiet as stock, other than
actually getting the factory-spec parts - which would cost more than
the car's worth. I'm thinking if it is still loud to just get a cheap
"turbo" muffler and replace the one that came with the system, but
don't know if that would give any measurable improvement or not.

Sad thing is, she's not enough of a girly girl to pull off the weepy
and apologetic thing... knowing her she was probably biting back some
comment about all the other drivers around her driving like a-holes and
she gets pulled for a loud exhaust? LOL

nate

* There's a story behind that. When she moved here from Michigan, her
car failed inspection because of a little tiny pinhole in the factory
muffler. I ordered her an aftermarket exhaust system, and one for
myself as well - she has a Corrado G60, I had a Scirocco which also
needed a new exhaust - as the whole mandrel-bent aftermarket system in
stainless was cheaper than the factory replacement muffler. Since the
Scirocco was very low to the ground and the old exhaust scraped over
speed bumps, I ordered a system without the center resonator. Well,
they got the orders mixed up and I ended up with a new Scirocco system
*with* resonator, and a Corrado G60 system *without.* Didn't have
enough time to send it back before her MI tags ran out, so it was
installed. It is, honestly, obnoxiously loud, but she's been running
it for something like four years now and this is the first time it's
been an issue. Of course if the inspection guy wasn't a complete
prick, this wouldn't be an issue - I would have just welded a little
patch over the hole in the old muffler, which was still mostly solid,
and it'd be nice and quiet today. But he insisted that the muffler be
replaced, so here we are. Oh well, such is life.

> she described it to me was that she has a choice of either paying the
> ticket or going to court to fight it. Does this sound right?


That must be one loud car! Sorry for her, but I'm personally getting fed up
with the fart cans, harleys and other intentionally obnoxious exhaust (not
that yours is intentional, mind you) so I have limited sympathy. My own
boat's stock muffler is insufficient IMHO and I'm actively searching for a
better solution.

Going to court is always better than not, and if you muzzle it beforehand,
the judge may toss it - but judges are an arbitrary lot, so nobody can know
for sure. Certainly you will want to get it quieter before she gets yet
*another* ticket.

JohnH wrote:
> > she described it to me was that she has a choice of either paying the
> > ticket or going to court to fight it. Does this sound right?
>
>
> That must be one loud car!

Yeah, it is. The exhaust would have been acceptable on my Scirocco,
but on the Corrado it's just too loud. The addition of the
supercharger really makes a big difference in the exhaust note. On the
upside, it's a pleasant, deep bass rumble, not the annoying rasp that
you'd get from a typical high-winding Japanese four-banger, but it's
easy to understand why someone would find it objectionable. It's about
as loud as your typical fart-canned
Integra, even if the sound is more pleasing to a car guy.

> Sorry for her, but I'm personally getting fed up
> with the fart cans, harleys and other intentionally obnoxious exhaust (not
> that yours is intentional, mind you) so I have limited sympathy. My own
> boat's stock muffler is insufficient IMHO and I'm actively searching for a
> better solution.
>
> Going to court is always better than not, and if you muzzle it beforehand,
> the judge may toss it - but judges are an arbitrary lot, so nobody can know
> for sure. Certainly you will want to get it quieter before she gets yet
> *another* ticket.

yeah, I was hoping someone from Ffx. Co. could speak from experience
there...

nate

"JohnH" > wrote in message
...
>
> > she described it to me was that she has a choice of either paying the
> > ticket or going to court to fight it. Does this sound right?
>
>
> That must be one loud car! Sorry for her, but I'm personally getting fed
up
> with the fart cans, harleys and other intentionally obnoxious exhaust (not
> that yours is intentional, mind you)

He had four years to resolve the isue with the company he bought the exhaust
from and get the right parts to install. After a "reasonable" amount of time
it is no longer a mistake, but rather intentional as there is a problem that
is not intended to be fixed. personally I consider 4 years plenty of time to
get a loud exhaust fixed, and I believe most would agree with me.

Not bashing you Nate, but you had plenty of time to fix it and not be
obnoxious. Instead you chose to be obnoxiously loud and pay the price. I
certianly feel any fines or other form of punishment is ridiculous and
should not be imposed. The situation should be corrected, with no
punishment. That'll never happen though, with our corrupt government.

Cory Dunkle wrote:
> "JohnH" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>>she described it to me was that she has a choice of either paying the
>>>ticket or going to court to fight it. Does this sound right?
>>
>>
>>That must be one loud car! Sorry for her, but I'm personally getting fed
>
> up
>
>>with the fart cans, harleys and other intentionally obnoxious exhaust (not
>>that yours is intentional, mind you)
>
>
> He had four years to resolve the isue with the company he bought the exhaust
> from and get the right parts to install. After a "reasonable" amount of time
> it is no longer a mistake, but rather intentional as there is a problem that
> is not intended to be fixed. personally I consider 4 years plenty of time to
> get a loud exhaust fixed, and I believe most would agree with me.
>
> Not bashing you Nate, but you had plenty of time to fix it and not be
> obnoxious. Instead you chose to be obnoxiously loud and pay the price. I
> certianly feel any fines or other form of punishment is ridiculous and
> should not be imposed. The situation should be corrected, with no
> punishment. That'll never happen though, with our corrupt government.
>

Ain't my car. Personally I couldn't have stood it this long, but she
liked it. In her defense, the car is basically a weekend toy, and is
rarely driven.

nate

--
replace "fly" with "com" to reply.
http://home.comcast.net/~njnagel

On Mon, 11 Jul 2005, N8N wrote:

> Got a call from the girlie this AM... apparently she got pulled over
> over the weekend and got a ticket in Fairfax County for a loud exhaust.

*snip*

> It is, honestly, obnoxiously loud, but she's been running it for
> something like four years now and this is the first time it's been an
> issue.

****in' is *NOT*. It's just the first time she's been pulled over for it.
I'm behind the cop on this one, a hundred percent. You know it's
obnoxiously loud, but the hell with everyone else, it's OK with *you*, and
that's all that matters, eh?

Very disappointing, Nate. I really thought you were more civic-minded than
this.

In article >, Cory Dunkle wrote:

> He had four years to resolve the isue with the company he bought the exhaust
> from and get the right parts to install.

No, he had until the tags ran out. Once installed there is no going back
to the people you bought the stuff from for a messed up order.

> After a "reasonable" amount of time
> it is no longer a mistake, but rather intentional as there is a problem that
> is not intended to be fixed. personally I consider 4 years plenty of time to
> get a loud exhaust fixed, and I believe most would agree with me.

It obviously passed inspection, that would drop it to the bottom of the
list. How many times has a cop picked you out of the crowd for something
at the bottom of your to do list? I seem to recall you posting on a few.

"Brent P" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, Cory Dunkle wrote:
>
> > He had four years to resolve the isue with the company he bought the
exhaust
> > from and get the right parts to install.
>
> No, he had until the tags ran out. Once installed there is no going back
> to the people you bought the stuff from for a messed up order.

There's never "no going back". Their screw up put Nate in a legal
predicament and he needed the car to be legal by a certain date. Any
reputable company will correct their wrong. There are ways to deal with
non-reputable companies that are out to shaft their customers.

After all, all Nate needed was a resonator. A relatively small and cheap
part. A part of the exhaust can be cut out adn the resonator welded in. Very
easy. Hardly a "no going back" scenario. Most reputable companies will eat
the loss on their mistake to make right with the customer. The cost of one
resonator is a fairly small loss when you just sold the customer two
stainless mandrel bent exhaust systems.

> > After a "reasonable" amount of time
> > it is no longer a mistake, but rather intentional as there is a problem
that
> > is not intended to be fixed. personally I consider 4 years plenty of
time to
> > get a loud exhaust fixed, and I believe most would agree with me.
>
> It obviously passed inspection, that would drop it to the bottom of the
> list. How many times has a cop picked you out of the crowd for something
> at the bottom of your to do list? I seem to recall you posting on a few.

The exhaust was self-admittedly "obnoxiously loud" and comparable in volume
to a "fart-canned Integra". I can understand a few weeks, or even a month or
two to get everythin in order and the problem fixed, but 4 years is
neglecting the problem with no intention of fixing it. Heck, for all we know
this particular cop could have been annoyed with this particular girl
fart-can-ish exhaust for several years and finally couldn't stand it any
more.

Personally, I've never been picked out of a crown and ticketed for anything
at the bottom of my to-do list. The only time I was stopped for anything
that my car needed was after that one 1st gear blast to 6500 RPM with open
headers on Rt. 73. I was on lunch break and going back to work from Wawa.
Due to that ticket I had to run open headers even longer before I could
afford to put an exhaust on the car. Ironically I was going to do it that
weekend, but I had to wait two more weeks before I could afford it due to
the fine threatened from the ticket.

Now should I have done a 1st gear blast to 6500 RPM with open headers on a
public highway? Well, not unless it was for a safety reason. I did it for
fun. I got stopped and ticketed for the noise. Sure I probably should have
stayed out of the throttle like I had been, so as to keep the noise at a
reasonable level. As for the ticket, maybe I deserved it, maybe I didn't. Oh
well, that's life. The monetary punishment of the system made sure my car
was extremely loud for two weeks longer than it had to be.

The end result, the system rapes another wallet and collects more revenue. I
wait two weeks longer to buy my exhaust, and all my neighbors and nearly
everyone everywhere I drive is annoyed for another two weeks. That's police
action at work, 'making the world a better place' with their "protect and
serve" mantra.

This is exactly why I oppose any fine levied against Nate. It should be
either a fine, or fix the problem within a reasonable amount of time. The
police should not be paid from tickets and fines. If they are protecting and
serving me, I am happy to pay for part of their wages and equipment.
Unfortunately they are not protecting or serving me, and I am paying for
part of their wages and equipment.

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On Mon, 11 Jul 2005 13:04:54 -0400, "JohnH" >
wrote:

>That must be one loud car! Sorry for her, but I'm personally
>getting fed up with the fart cans, harleys and other intentionally
>obnoxious exhaust

Some Harleys come loud from the factory.
Obnoxious? Yes, but hardly as ridiculous as that riced out '73
Pinto runabout with the Bassani glasspack...


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--
-john
wide-open at throttle dot info

On Tue, 12 Jul 2005, ~^Johnny^~ wrote:

> Some Harleys come loud from the factory.

Not really, not any more. From the *dealer*, yes, but not from the
factory. There are pretty stringent Federal noise regulations for
motorcycles.