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1994 miata stalled and now won't start



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 6th 06, 12:26 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
nano-miata
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default 1994 miata stalled and now won't start

Hi,

I have a 1994 miata. Back in March I started to have a few problems.
I noticed that the tachometer stopped working and then on the way home
one night the car just died and rolled to a stop. Since I have
~120,000 miles (~60,000 since the last timing belt change), I figured
that the two problems were unrelated and that the timing belt broke.
After the car died, the electrical system seemed to be working (stereo,
lights, starter) but the car just wouldn't start.

Well, today (8/5/2006) I found time to start working on my miata. The
timing belt is intact, but before I replace it (and the water pump, cam
seals, thermostat etc.), I thought I should ask the group if anyone has
had a similar problem. Could the stall be an electrical problem (fuse,
computer) or perhaps the timing belt slipped? I have "Rod's 1.8 Liter
Miata 'Shop manual'" and I have found the nice web-pages that show how
to replace the timing belt etc.

I haven't worked on cars for > 20 years and I could use some advice.
I'd hate to get stuck in a loop trying to figure out if the timing belt
was installed incorrectly or whether the initial stall is due to
something else.

Thanks!


Joseph

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  #2  
Old August 6th 06, 12:49 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
pws[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,424
Default 1994 miata stalled and now won't start

nano-miata wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I have a 1994 miata. Back in March I started to have a few problems.
> I noticed that the tachometer stopped working and then on the way home
> one night the car just died and rolled to a stop. Since I have
> ~120,000 miles (~60,000 since the last timing belt change), I figured
> that the two problems were unrelated and that the timing belt broke.
> After the car died, the electrical system seemed to be working (stereo,
> lights, starter) but the car just wouldn't start.
>
> Well, today (8/5/2006) I found time to start working on my miata. The
> timing belt is intact, but before I replace it (and the water pump, cam
> seals, thermostat etc.), I thought I should ask the group if anyone has
> had a similar problem. Could the stall be an electrical problem (fuse,
> computer) or perhaps the timing belt slipped? I have "Rod's 1.8 Liter
> Miata 'Shop manual'" and I have found the nice web-pages that show how
> to replace the timing belt etc.
>
> I haven't worked on cars for > 20 years and I could use some advice.
> I'd hate to get stuck in a loop trying to figure out if the timing belt
> was installed incorrectly or whether the initial stall is due to
> something else.
>
> Thanks!
>
>
> Joseph


If the timing belt was installed incorrectly, you would have noticed it
long before 60K miles.

If your lights, stereo, etc. were not working, I would guess that a
broken alternator was a likely problem, but that obviously would have
drained your battery to no charge. It sounds like your battery has a
very good charge since it is still running your accessories after
sitting since March.
Since the car died while running that probably rules out the ignition
and definitely nixes the starter as a problem.

With that, my guess would be a fuel delivery problem or an electrical
problem such as a defective/broken ECU.
There are a lot of other possible reasons as well, and a lot of people
here with far more knowledge than myself, so you should be able to get
pointed in the right direction.

You may as well check the fuses, especially the main protection fuse
that blows if jumper cables are ever reversed on the battery.
It is a 30 amp, iirc. The fuses are very easy to access on a 1994 model.

Are you getting any spark at all when you crank the ignition, and is the
engine making any attempt to turn over?

Pat
  #3  
Old August 6th 06, 03:35 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Lanny Chambers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 832
Default 1994 miata stalled and now won't start

In article .com>,
"nano-miata" > wrote:

> I noticed that the tachometer stopped working and then on the way home
> one night the car just died and rolled to a stop.


Check for spark. Was the tach jumpy or laggy before it quit? That's a
classic symptom of dirty ground connections at the head near the
alternator and/or at the multi-connector below the master cylinder. If
the bad ground isn't fixed, it may eventually burn out the coil packs.
Bingo, no sparks.

--
Lanny Chambers
'94C, St. Louis
http://www.hummingbirds.net/alignment.html
  #4  
Old August 6th 06, 04:36 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
nano-miata
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default 1994 miata stalled and now won't start


>
> You may as well check the fuses, especially the main protection fuse
> that blows if jumper cables are ever reversed on the battery.
> It is a 30 amp, iirc. The fuses are very easy to access on a 1994 model.
>


Hi Pat,

Thanks for the fast reply. The fuse for the gauges (found underneath
the
steering column) was broken. The manual said it should be a 10 A fuse,
but there
was a 20 A (broken) fuse there (the metal wire in the center was
broken), probably
put there by the previous owner.

I haven't checked for a spark yet, as I had the engine pulled apart to
change
the timing belt. I'll put it back together as is and keep
troubleshooting the electrical problem.

Cheers,

Joseph

  #5  
Old August 6th 06, 04:46 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
nano-miata
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default 1994 miata stalled and now won't start


>
> Check for spark. Was the tach jumpy or laggy before it quit? That's a
> classic symptom of dirty ground connections at the head near the
> alternator and/or at the multi-connector below the master cylinder. If
> the bad ground isn't fixed, it may eventually burn out the coil packs.
> Bingo, no sparks.
>
> --


There are a couple "ground" connections near the master cylinder. One
on the
block under the cam position (steering) sensor which is covered with
oil from the
sensor, and one on the firewall that has a clothlike wire onto a rusty
bolt. I found
the multi-connector as well.

I found one connector near the alternator (extended bracket on the
right side
of the fuel-injectors, with the bracket eventually connecting to the
head).

What is the best way to fix all of these? Buy new factory screws, sand
down the
connectors etc.?

I'll put the timing belt tear-down back together (unscathed) and check
for spark.

More later (and thank you!!!),

Cheers,

Joseph

  #6  
Old August 6th 06, 08:21 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
pws[_1_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,424
Default 1994 miata stalled and now won't start

nano-miata wrote:

> Hi Pat,
>
> Thanks for the fast reply. The fuse for the gauges (found underneath
> the
> steering column) was broken. The manual said it should be a 10 A fuse,
> but there
> was a 20 A (broken) fuse there (the metal wire in the center was
> broken), probably
> put there by the previous owner.
>
> I haven't checked for a spark yet, as I had the engine pulled apart to
> change
> the timing belt. I'll put it back together as is and keep
> troubleshooting the electrical problem.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Joseph



Wow! I actually guessed correctly on something. Of course, now the
problem is finding out what is blowing your fuse, even when it is rated
at double what it should be.
Electronics are my weakest car area, but it sounds like the bad coil
situation that Lanny described could possibly cause this fuse to fail.
Lanny?
In any case, it sounds like you also need a new CAS seal while you are
at it.

Good luck!

Pat

  #7  
Old August 6th 06, 11:58 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.mazda.miata
Lanny Chambers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 832
Default 1994 miata stalled and now won't start

In article >,
pws > wrote:

> Electronics are my weakest car area, but it sounds like the bad coil
> situation that Lanny described could possibly cause this fuse to fail.
> Lanny?


Sorry, I've never blown that fuse. I always clean my grounds at the
first sign of a jumpy tach. I use emery cloth to make everything shiny.

> In any case, it sounds like you also need a new CAS seal while you are
> at it.


Definitely replace the O-ring. It's a snap while the cam cover is off, a
PITA once it's back on. The oil drool will eventually rot through the
heater hoses, so you might want to check the hoses before they blow.

--
Lanny Chambers
'94C, St. Louis
http://www.hummingbirds.net/alignment.html
 




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