What Is an American Car?

On Jan 28, 10:41*am, Steve > wrote:
> Percival P. Cassidy wrote:
>
> > But some cars with US brand names are simply relabeled foreign cars,
> > aren't they? What about the little Korean-made Chevy whose name I
> > forget? Is that a US design?
>
> > Perce
>
> Yes, there have been foreign cars sold with US brands dating way back to
> the 70s. But those are still FOREIGN cars and everyone knew it. Dodge
> Colt (Mitsubishi), Geo Prism (Toyota), Ford Courier (Mazda), Plymouth
> Cricket (Hillman), Chevy Luv (Isuzu) are all examples.

NUMMI? Jointly-owned plant in CA by GM and Toyota. American?
Japanese?

what matters the most is were the money goes after a cars get financed and
these dumbass's whom buy Asian cars don't stop to think about!
they are sending 30 k to korea for those kias and hundyi's and the like !
they will be working a average of 6 years in doing so until they pay it off
so people now think we do not need American cars and they are starting to see
the fall out of their actions now as this nation sinks deeper into a
recession boarding on a depression what goes around comes around and people
will be finding they can't make car and house payments on McDonnell's wages
since clintons idea of a service country economy hit us full face now just
like his democratic plans did the banking industry in by allowing so much
abuses by deregulating fanny may and freddy mac as he amitted on the today
program in septemberas being one of the worst things he did in office after
lying to us all and now we have another dumbasscrate in office
whom will do it all over again

Steve wrote:

> Jim Higgins wrote:
> > Steve wrote:
> >> Jim Higgins wrote:
> >>> What Is an American Car?
> >>
> >>
> >> One manufactured in a plant owned and operated by Ford, GM, or
> >> Chrysler. End of story. Not a difficult question at all.
> >
> > Apparently it can be made in Mexico/Canada/Korea and have loads of parts
> > made all over the third world and still be an "American" car?
> >
>
> Absolutely. Where is the majority ownership of the parent company?
> Where is the engineering design done? Where is the aesthetic design
> done? Those are the important questions. Assembly is, face it, gruntwork
> that can be done anywhere there's space for a plant, access to shipping
> infrastructure, workers, and/or assembly robots. The engineering and
> design are what matters the most.

man of machines wrote:
> what matters the most is were the money goes after a cars get financed and
> these dumbass's whom buy Asian cars don't stop to think about!
> they are sending 30 k to korea for those kias and hundyi's and the like !
> they will be working a average of 6 years in doing so until they pay it off
> so people now think we do not need American cars and they are starting to see
> the fall out of their actions now as this nation sinks deeper into a
> recession boarding on a depression what goes around comes around and people
> will be finding they can't make car and house payments on McDonnell's wages
> since clintons idea of a service country economy hit us full face now just
> like his democratic plans did the banking industry in by allowing so much
> abuses by deregulating fanny may and freddy mac as he amitted on the today
> program in septemberas being one of the worst things he did in office after
> lying to us all and now we have another dumbasscrate in office
> whom will do it all over again
>
> Steve wrote:
>
>> Jim Higgins wrote:
>>> Steve wrote:
>>>> Jim Higgins wrote:
>>>>> What Is an American Car?
>>>>
>>>> One manufactured in a plant owned and operated by Ford, GM, or
>>>> Chrysler. End of story. Not a difficult question at all.
>>> Apparently it can be made in Mexico/Canada/Korea and have loads of parts
>>> made all over the third world and still be an "American" car?
>>>
>> Absolutely. Where is the majority ownership of the parent company?
>> Where is the engineering design done? Where is the aesthetic design
>> done? Those are the important questions. Assembly is, face it, gruntwork
>> that can be done anywhere there's space for a plant, access to shipping
>> infrastructure, workers, and/or assembly robots. The engineering and
>> design are what matters the most.
>

Your thought process is a fine example of why Detroit will fail.
Big Three lose ground in biggest U.S. market
http://tinyurl.com/aoejt4

--
Civis Romanus Sum

On Jan 29, 9:19*pm, man of machines > wrote:
> what matters the most is were the money goes after a cars get financed and
> these dumbass's whom buy Asian cars don't stop to *think about!
> they are sending 30 k to korea *for those kias and hundyi's and the like !

Dumbasses are those who don't know what a capital letter is. Or how
to spell. Or that an apostrophe means possessive, not plural. Or
what a run-on sentence is.

> they *will be working a average of 6 years in doing *so until they *pay it off
> so people now think we do not need American cars and they are starting to see
> the fall out of their actions now as this nation *sinks deeper into a
> recession boarding on a depression what goes around comes around and people
> will be finding they can't make car and house payments on McDonnell's wages
> since clintons idea of a service country economy hit us full face now just
> like his democratic plans did the banking industry in by allowing so much
> abuses by deregulating fanny may and freddy mac as he amitted on the today
> program *in septemberas being one of the worst things he did in office after
> lying to us all and now we have another dumbasscrate in office
> whom will do it all over again

You are a typical right-winger -- illiterate and dumb as a fence
post. Thanks for putting your face on conservatism.

>
> Steve wrote:
> > Jim Higgins wrote:
> > > Steve wrote:
> > >> Jim Higgins wrote:
> > >>> What Is an American Car?
>
> > >> One manufactured in a plant owned and operated by Ford, GM, or
> > >> Chrysler. End of story. Not a difficult question at all.
>
> > > Apparently it can be made in Mexico/Canada/Korea and have loads of parts
> > > made all over the third world and still be an "American" car?
>
> > Absolutely. Where is the majority ownership of the parent company?
> > Where is the engineering design done? Where is the aesthetic design
> > done? Those are the important questions. Assembly is, face it, gruntwork
> > that can be done anywhere there's space for a plant, access to shipping
> > infrastructure, workers, and/or assembly robots. The engineering and
> > design are what matters the most.
>
>

"Lloyd" > wrote in message
...
>
>> Actually, where the PROFITS are going are what matters most.
>>

>Any American can buy stock in Toyota.

Very GOOD Lloyd, I'll rush out and buy some so that I can NOT get
any dividend since they are declaring a loss for FY 2009.

Let's see now - last FY they declared a $2.50 dividend. So with stock
price around $65 now that will take--let's see - TWENTY SIX YEARS
of dividends before I make back my purchase price of the stock. And that's
assuming that such rosy projections of dividends hold - and there's no
guarentee
the stock price won't drop to practically nothing at the end of that time.

For the price of 2 pieces of Toyota stock I could go buy a lawnmower and
spend the summer pushing it around town on the weekend offering to mow
people's lawns - and in one summer I could easily make the entire amount of
the lawnmower back as well as the gasoline with money left over - and then
sell the mower for more money.

Boy, Lloyd, you are SUCH A WISE INVESTOR....NOT!!

Don't try your claptrap about dividends on me. We all know why people buy
stock - it's so they can sit on it and hope the price goes up so they can
sell
it at a profit.

As I said, the stockholders get a pittance in dividends. The bulk of the
profit is spent on executive salaries, big fancy office buildings, R&D, and
all of the high-dollar jobs - and those jobs are in the country of origin of
the company.

> Plus, what about the profits
> dealers make? Suppliers? Heck, what about worker salaries?

They all make the same thing if the car company is foreign or domestic,
since there's always going to be a dealership around selling cars - whether
they are selling foreign or domestic cars.

>> Most corporations IMHO hand out a paltry amount of profit to their
>> stockholders, many companies don't even bother to dividend anymore,

>Totally false. The main ones who don't are tech companies and those
>in trouble.

Totally true. As I said, MOST hand out a paltry dividend.

>> and those that do, their dividends are what they cannot figure out how to
>> spend. The bulk of the real profit is plowed back into expenditures on
>> the business.

>So why would people buy the stock?

To sell. They buy it, assume the stock price will rise, then sell it when
the
price rises. Why do you think the Dow went up and up and up - stock is a
giant Ponzi scheme. If you happen to have real money, you can make far more
investing it in venture capital on startups, or building up a business that
you
know something about.

>> and take their money with them. They are not spending any more money in
>> the
>> US
>> and helping the US economy than a minimum wage employee would.

>So all the time they're here, what, they're getting food sent from
>back home? Transportation? Clothes?

What part of "helping the US economy than a minimum wage employee
would" do you not understand? A min wage employee spends on food,
transport, clothing, etc. also.

>>
>> Sure, the Japanese automakers may be paying a bunch of grunt assembly
>> jobs.
>> Those workers are just turning around and spending all their paycheck on
>> food and groceries.

>Uh, $25 a hour buys more than food and groceries.

They would get the same from a domestic manufacturer. I see no net benefit
for
the foreign manufacturer over the domestic manufacturer to the US economy
here.

>> The high-dollar auto jobs
>> are in Japan, and those help the Japanese economy.

>Toyota employs engineers, designers, etc. here too.

Not as many and not as high dollar - the ones here simply rework Japanese
designs for the US market.

>>
>> An American car is one where the people who got the big bucks for
>> building
>> that car are spending those bucks in America, helping build up our
>> economy.

> So you consider what, just the million-dollar executives? The rank-
> and-file workers help our economy much more, just by numbers.

No they don't. There is a cost for every person to the US economy for
that person to just exist, walking down the street. In short, someone
making
$25K a year costs the US economy more to support than they put back
into the economy.

The million-dollar executive also costs the US economy the same $26K to
support - but he is putting back 50 to 100 times the amount of economic
stimulus into the US economy as a rank and file worker puts into the
economy. And he isn't as likely to get laid off during an economic
downturn.

Others have said it better than I in many other places - the US economy
cannot survive based on people flipping hamburgers and selling them to each
other. The US economy MUST have industries that create real products.
And we are losing them. Meanwhile, other countries are gaining those
industries - and countries like Japan, who are probably even more highly
developed than the US is - are somehow managing to retain their own
manufacturing industries, even against cheap Chinese labor.

The idea that there's such a thing as an "information economy" and it's OK
for the US to allow it's manufacturing base to erode because, hey, well,
there's all these information jobs that will replace manufacturing, is pure
baloney.

Ted

Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
> "Lloyd" > wrote in message
> ...
>>> Actually, where the PROFITS are going are what matters most.
>>>
>
>> Any American can buy stock in Toyota.
>
> Very GOOD Lloyd, I'll rush out and buy some so that I can NOT get
> any dividend since they are declaring a loss for FY 2009.
>
> Let's see now - last FY they declared a $2.50 dividend. So with stock
> price around $65 now that will take--let's see - TWENTY SIX YEARS
> of dividends before I make back my purchase price of the stock. And that's
> assuming that such rosy projections of dividends hold - and there's no
> guarentee
> the stock price won't drop to practically nothing at the end of that time.
>
> For the price of 2 pieces of Toyota stock I could go buy a lawnmower and
> spend the summer pushing it around town on the weekend offering to mow
> people's lawns - and in one summer I could easily make the entire amount of
> the lawnmower back as well as the gasoline with money left over - and then
> sell the mower for more money.
>
> Boy, Lloyd, you are SUCH A WISE INVESTOR....NOT!!
>
> Don't try your claptrap about dividends on me. We all know why people buy
> stock - it's so they can sit on it and hope the price goes up so they can
> sell
> it at a profit.
>
> As I said, the stockholders get a pittance in dividends. The bulk of the
> profit is spent on executive salaries, big fancy office buildings, R&D, and
> all of the high-dollar jobs - and those jobs are in the country of origin of
> the company.
>
>> Plus, what about the profits
>> dealers make? Suppliers? Heck, what about worker salaries?
>
> They all make the same thing if the car company is foreign or domestic,
> since there's always going to be a dealership around selling cars - whether
> they are selling foreign or domestic cars.
>
>>> Most corporations IMHO hand out a paltry amount of profit to their
>>> stockholders, many companies don't even bother to dividend anymore,
>
>> Totally false. The main ones who don't are tech companies and those
>> in trouble.
>
> Totally true. As I said, MOST hand out a paltry dividend.
>
>>> and those that do, their dividends are what they cannot figure out how to
>>> spend. The bulk of the real profit is plowed back into expenditures on
>>> the business.
>
>> So why would people buy the stock?
>
> To sell. They buy it, assume the stock price will rise, then sell it when
> the
> price rises. Why do you think the Dow went up and up and up - stock is a
> giant Ponzi scheme. If you happen to have real money, you can make far more
> investing it in venture capital on startups, or building up a business that
> you
> know something about.
>
>>> and take their money with them. They are not spending any more money in
>>> the
>>> US
>>> and helping the US economy than a minimum wage employee would.
>
>> So all the time they're here, what, they're getting food sent from
>> back home? Transportation? Clothes?
>
> What part of "helping the US economy than a minimum wage employee
> would" do you not understand? A min wage employee spends on food,
> transport, clothing, etc. also.
>
>>> Sure, the Japanese automakers may be paying a bunch of grunt assembly
>>> jobs.
>>> Those workers are just turning around and spending all their paycheck on
>>> food and groceries.
>
>> Uh, $25 a hour buys more than food and groceries.
>
> They would get the same from a domestic manufacturer. I see no net benefit
> for
> the foreign manufacturer over the domestic manufacturer to the US economy
> here.
>
>>> The high-dollar auto jobs
>>> are in Japan, and those help the Japanese economy.
>
>> Toyota employs engineers, designers, etc. here too.
>
> Not as many and not as high dollar - the ones here simply rework Japanese
> designs for the US market.
>
>>> An American car is one where the people who got the big bucks for
>>> building
>>> that car are spending those bucks in America, helping build up our
>>> economy.
>
>> So you consider what, just the million-dollar executives? The rank-
>> and-file workers help our economy much more, just by numbers.
>
> No they don't. There is a cost for every person to the US economy for
> that person to just exist, walking down the street. In short, someone
> making
> $25K a year costs the US economy more to support than they put back
> into the economy.
>
> The million-dollar executive also costs the US economy the same $26K to
> support - but he is putting back 50 to 100 times the amount of economic
> stimulus into the US economy as a rank and file worker puts into the
> economy. And he isn't as likely to get laid off during an economic
> downturn.
>
> Others have said it better than I in many other places - the US economy
> cannot survive based on people flipping hamburgers and selling them to each
> other. The US economy MUST have industries that create real products.
> And we are losing them. Meanwhile, other countries are gaining those
> industries - and countries like Japan, who are probably even more highly
> developed than the US is - are somehow managing to retain their own
> manufacturing industries, even against cheap Chinese labor.
>
> The idea that there's such a thing as an "information economy" and it's OK
> for the US to allow it's manufacturing base to erode because, hey, well,
> there's all these information jobs that will replace manufacturing, is pure
> baloney.
>
> Ted
>
>

Toyota stock has value, real value. GM's stock will be stuffed into
Cracker Jacks and generic cereal boxes in a vain attempt to drum up
interest.

--
Civis Romanus Sum

"Jim Higgins" > wrote in message
ology...
>
> Toyota stock has value, real value.

So do precious metals and many other things. If your goal is simply to find
some place to stick a few million dollars to let them do nothing, then your
welcome to buy all the Toy stock you want. But most people who have a
few million dollars sitting around doing nothing, prefer to have that money
working to make even more money for them. That's called "investing" and
sticking money in Toy stock isn't going to do that for you, at least not
right
now.

Ted