How long does it take a truck to stop & is it criminal if he doesn't?

What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/local/...hway-17/ngcnY/

This accident yesterday blocked the highway for 10 hours, with the CHP
saying it was a crime scene where one person died.
http://www.mercurynews.com/bay-area-...hbound-highway

The driver is quoted in that article as saying he had too much speed with
too much weight with too little distance.

How long does it take a truck to stop & is it criminal if it doesn't stop
in that distance?

On 7/11/14, 3:33 PM, Ann Marie Brest wrote:
> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
> http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/local/...hway-17/ngcnY/
>
> This accident yesterday blocked the highway for 10 hours, with the CHP
> saying it was a crime scene where one person died.
> http://www.mercurynews.com/bay-area-...hbound-highway
>
> The driver is quoted in that article as saying he had too much speed with
> too much weight with too little distance.
>
> How long does it take a truck to stop & is it criminal if it doesn't stop
> in that distance?
>

It was criminal in this case where the owner allowed a defective truck
to be operated over a steep grade.

articles.courant.com/2013-06-12/news/hc-avon-mountain-wilcox-release-0612-20130611_1_barbara-bongiovanni-dump-truck-abdulraheem-naafi

The driver in the CA crash should probably not been driving a
double-bottom yet, due to inexperience.

"Singh's two trailers were fully loaded with dirt.

He said he has been a truck driver for not quite three months,"

On 7/11/14 2:33 PM, Ann Marie Brest wrote:
> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?

d = V^2/(2*g*(f + G))

Whe
d = Braking Distance (ft)
g = Acceleration due to gravity (32.2 ft/sec2)
G = Roadway grade as a percentage
V = Initial vehicle speed (ft/sec)
f = Coefficient of friction between the tires and the roadway

So if the truck were going 55mph, that would be about 80 feet per second.

The coefficient of friction for treaded tires is about .7 on dry roads.

d = (80*80)/(2*32*(.7+.06))

or about 132 feet (from the time the driver hits the brakes). Assuming
a lot of things, like the brakes don't burn out.

> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?

Of course not. The driver must have been doing something recklessly
negligent before it's criminal.

<snip/>

Ann Marie Brest wrote:
> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
> http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/local/...hway-17/ngcnY/
>
> This accident yesterday blocked the highway for 10 hours, with the CHP
> saying it was a crime scene where one person died.
> http://www.mercurynews.com/bay-area-...hbound-highway
>
> The driver is quoted in that article as saying he had too much speed with
> too much weight with too little distance.
>
> How long does it take a truck to stop & is it criminal if it doesn't stop
> in that distance?


No way to tell how long it would take without much better data. Weight
of the trailers, how many axles, condition of the pavement, condition of
the vehicle, speed, angle of momentum (straight travel, curved) angle of
the roadway and much more.

Even then you would come up with the best possible braking distance
assuming nothing interfered.

The figure most drivers are told is that a fully loaded twin screw
tractor trailer (80,000 pounds) with one two axle trailer, on level dry
pavement at 55 mph takes approximately 100 yards (one football field) to
stop under ideal conditions.


From the video and the articles it looks like he came around a slight
curve downhill and cars were slowing/stopping in front of him.
It looks like he had a single screw tractor and pulling two trailers.
Couldn't tell how many axles total.
It looks like he got on the brakes as soon as he could, then the
trailers started to jackknife and slide down the pavement. Once that
happens the driver has no control over the outcome. It strictly becomes
a physics question then.

The drivers quotes will likely come back to haunt him because there will
be people looking to sue or like you assign the blame solely to the driver.

What was basically said was he had too much speed for the weight he was
carrying to stop in the distance that was left when he saw the cars
slowing/stopped.

However they are the same things you would say if you came around a
curve and found a deer standing in the road.
"It was too close and I couldn't slow down enough to avoid hitting it"


The police will investigate and probably agree with the drivers
statement. BUT it will then be up to them to determine if the driver
actually is at fault.

--
Steve W.

On 7/11/14, 4:25 PM, deadrat wrote:
> On 7/11/14 2:33 PM, Ann Marie Brest wrote:
>> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
>
> d = V^2/(2*g*(f + G))
>
> Whe
> d = Braking Distance (ft)
> g = Acceleration due to gravity (32.2 ft/sec2)
> G = Roadway grade as a percentage
> V = Initial vehicle speed (ft/sec)
> f = Coefficient of friction between the tires and the roadway
>
> So if the truck were going 55mph, that would be about 80 feet per second.
>
> The coefficient of friction for treaded tires is about .7 on dry roads.
>
> d = (80*80)/(2*32*(.7+.06))
>
> or about 132 feet (from the time the driver hits the brakes).
> Assuming a lot of things, like the brakes don't burn out.
>
>> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
>
> Of course not. The driver must have been doing something recklessly
> negligent before it's criminal.
>
> <snip/>
>

Where is vehicle weight or number of tires/brakes taken into
consideration ?

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 12:33:01 -0700, Ann Marie Brest wrote:

> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
> http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/local/...hway-17/ngcnY/
>
> This accident yesterday blocked the highway for 10 hours, with the CHP
> saying it was a crime scene where one person died.
> http://www.mercurynews.com/bay-area-...hbound-highway
>
> The driver is quoted in that article as saying he had too much speed with
> too much weight with too little distance.
>
> How long does it take a truck to stop & is it criminal if it doesn't stop
> in that distance?

You ask, is it criminal?
Of course it is. The driver will most likely be charged with manslaughter
of some degree.
He can forget about driving trucks now.

You ask, how long does it take to stop a truck?
Too many factors to say for that situation.
From a personal experience, hauling a single trailer, I was going down a
similar hill on an interstate. At the bottom, the road turns left.
I noticed the traffic had stooped and hit the brakes.
I stopped within inches of the rear car.
That was well over 500 feet easily.

The driver said he knew what to do and turned his rig right and aimed for
the guard rail.
Actually, that's a bad move, for long arm doubles.
As that sets up one hell of a whip lash reaction.

For those who may not know, the driver's inexperience shows.
Knowing there is a long steep grade, the first thing you do is back off the
pedal and begin down shifting.
There is one hill on an interstate where I will go down in a lower gear.
About midway, I will stop and park it for a few minutes.

On I-17 in Arizona, I will go through the mountains at 45mph downhill.

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 16:48:22 -0400, Retired wrote:

> On 7/11/14, 4:25 PM, deadrat wrote:
>> On 7/11/14 2:33 PM, Ann Marie Brest wrote:
>>> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
>>
>> d = V^2/(2*g*(f + G))
>>
>> Whe
>> d = Braking Distance (ft)
>> g = Acceleration due to gravity (32.2 ft/sec2)
>> G = Roadway grade as a percentage
>> V = Initial vehicle speed (ft/sec)
>> f = Coefficient of friction between the tires and the roadway
>>
>> So if the truck were going 55mph, that would be about 80 feet per second.
>>
>> The coefficient of friction for treaded tires is about .7 on dry roads.
>>
>> d = (80*80)/(2*32*(.7+.06))
>>
>> or about 132 feet (from the time the driver hits the brakes).
>> Assuming a lot of things, like the brakes don't burn out.
>>
>>> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
>>
>> Of course not. The driver must have been doing something recklessly
>> negligent before it's criminal.
>>
>> <snip/>
>>
>
> Where is vehicle weight or number of tires/brakes taken into
> consideration ?

I believe that formula is for a car.
Probably developed by some engineer who never had a driver's licemse or
drove a car.

On 7/11/2014 3:48 PM, Retired wrote:
> On 7/11/14, 4:25 PM, deadrat wrote:
>> On 7/11/14 2:33 PM, Ann Marie Brest wrote:
>>> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
>>
>> d = V^2/(2*g*(f + G))
>>
>> Whe
>> d = Braking Distance (ft)
>> g = Acceleration due to gravity (32.2 ft/sec2)
>> G = Roadway grade as a percentage
>> V = Initial vehicle speed (ft/sec)
>> f = Coefficient of friction between the tires and the roadway
>>
>> So if the truck were going 55mph, that would be about 80 feet per second.
>>
>> The coefficient of friction for treaded tires is about .7 on dry roads.
>>
>> d = (80*80)/(2*32*(.7+.06))
>>
>> or about 132 feet (from the time the driver hits the brakes).
>> Assuming a lot of things, like the brakes don't burn out.
>>
>>> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
>>
>> Of course not. The driver must have been doing something recklessly
>> negligent before it's criminal.
>>
>> <snip/>
>>
>
> Where is vehicle weight or number of tires/brakes taken into
> consideration ?


It isn't as it's immaterial. Two identical trucks, with the same tires,
driving the same speed, traveling on the same pavement will stop in the
same distance regardless of one being filled with concrete and the other
empty.

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 19:30:48 -0500, Unquestionably Confused wrote:

> On 7/11/2014 3:48 PM, Retired wrote:
>> On 7/11/14, 4:25 PM, deadrat wrote:
>>> On 7/11/14 2:33 PM, Ann Marie Brest wrote:
>>>> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
>>>
>>> d = V^2/(2*g*(f + G))
>>>
>>> Whe
>>> d = Braking Distance (ft)
>>> g = Acceleration due to gravity (32.2 ft/sec2)
>>> G = Roadway grade as a percentage
>>> V = Initial vehicle speed (ft/sec)
>>> f = Coefficient of friction between the tires and the roadway
>>>
>>> So if the truck were going 55mph, that would be about 80 feet per second.
>>>
>>> The coefficient of friction for treaded tires is about .7 on dry roads.
>>>
>>> d = (80*80)/(2*32*(.7+.06))
>>>
>>> or about 132 feet (from the time the driver hits the brakes).
>>> Assuming a lot of things, like the brakes don't burn out.
>>>
>>>> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
>>>
>>> Of course not. The driver must have been doing something recklessly
>>> negligent before it's criminal.
>>>
>>> <snip/>
>>>
>>
>> Where is vehicle weight or number of tires/brakes taken into
>> consideration ?
>
>
> It isn't as it's immaterial. Two identical trucks, with the same tires,
> driving the same speed, traveling on the same pavement will stop in the
> same distance regardless of one being filled with concrete and the other
> empty.

You know nothing about real life.
"Top Gear" did a demo of this. With just the driver, the car stopped as
predicted.
Add 3 passengers who all weighed over 300 pounds, it took another 100 feet
to stop.

Having been a professional truck driver, it takes much longer to stop a
loaded tuck. At 70mph and fully loaded, even longer.

On Fri, 11 Jul 2014 16:32:23 -0400, Steve W. wrote:

> Ann Marie Brest wrote:
>> What distance does a sand truck take to slow down on a 6% grade?
>> If it can't stop in that distance, is it criminal?
>> http://www.ktvu.com/news/news/local/...hway-17/ngcnY/
>>
>> This accident yesterday blocked the highway for 10 hours, with the CHP
>> saying it was a crime scene where one person died.
>> http://www.mercurynews.com/bay-area-...hbound-highway
>>
>> The driver is quoted in that article as saying he had too much speed with
>> too much weight with too little distance.
>>
>> How long does it take a truck to stop & is it criminal if it doesn't stop
>> in that distance?
>
>
> No way to tell how long it would take without much better data. Weight
> of the trailers, how many axles, condition of the pavement, condition of
> the vehicle, speed, angle of momentum (straight travel, curved) angle of
> the roadway and much more.
>
> Even then you would come up with the best possible braking distance
> assuming nothing interfered.
>
> The figure most drivers are told is that a fully loaded twin screw
> tractor trailer (80,000 pounds) with one two axle trailer, on level dry
> pavement at 55 mph takes approximately 100 yards (one football field) to
> stop under ideal conditions.
>
>
> From the video and the articles it looks like he came around a slight
> curve downhill and cars were slowing/stopping in front of him.
> It looks like he had a single screw tractor and pulling two trailers.
> Couldn't tell how many axles total.
> It looks like he got on the brakes as soon as he could, then the
> trailers started to jackknife and slide down the pavement. Once that
> happens the driver has no control over the outcome. It strictly becomes
> a physics question then.
>
> The drivers quotes will likely come back to haunt him because there will
> be people looking to sue or like you assign the blame solely to the driver.
>
> What was basically said was he had too much speed for the weight he was
> carrying to stop in the distance that was left when he saw the cars
> slowing/stopped.
>
> However they are the same things you would say if you came around a
> curve and found a deer standing in the road.
> "It was too close and I couldn't slow down enough to avoid hitting it"
>
>
> The police will investigate and probably agree with the drivers
> statement. BUT it will then be up to them to determine if the driver
> actually is at fault.

I was told 2 to 3 times that.