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What are mid 90's Alfas like on LPG?



 
 
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  #11  
Old August 5th 04, 10:16 PM
Ppelectron
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>As the time to actually buy a new car approaches, I just an inredible
>thought. While the Saab has to go, period, I could get something with an
>equally juicy engine if it could be run on LPG.
>
>While I said before, no V6's because of economy, maybe that wouldn't be
>the case if it could safely and comfortabley run on LPG instead of
>petrol.
>
>That would put the 155 V6 and possibly the 164 v6 (only possibly because
>of the sheer size of the vehicle) firmly in the affordable luxury
>cruiser bracket. I know the conversion might cost way more than the car
>(depending on whether the 164 keeps climbing in price), but it wouldn't
>take long with a V6 to reap the fuel benefits, especially if I keep the
>car for a couple of years, and move it on before fuel duty on LPG equals
>that of Petrol.
>
>What does everyone think?


Personally, I refuse to play the governments silly games with fuel duty. If
everyone converted to LPG tomorrow, the government wouldn't hesitate to put
duty on LPG up overnight. I noticed today that diesel at the local garage is
now more expensive than unleaded. Did it not used to be considerably cheaper?
Surely this isn't because of the increasing use of diesels in the UK and the
corresponding drop in revenue?

Phil 156 V6 (unleaded)
Ads
  #12  
Old August 5th 04, 10:31 PM
T.
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Ppelectron wrote:
>
>
> Personally, I refuse to play the governments silly games with fuel duty. If
> everyone converted to LPG tomorrow, the government wouldn't hesitate to put
> duty on LPG up overnight. I noticed today that diesel at the local garage is
> now more expensive than unleaded. Did it not used to be considerably cheaper?
> Surely this isn't because of the increasing use of diesels in the UK and the
> corresponding drop in revenue?
>


....also due to diesel cars filling up less often than a petrol one.
  #13  
Old August 5th 04, 10:33 PM
Catman
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Ppelectron wrote:

>>As the time to actually buy a new car approaches, I just an inredible
>>thought. While the Saab has to go, period, I could get something with an
>>equally juicy engine if it could be run on LPG.
>>
>>While I said before, no V6's because of economy, maybe that wouldn't be
>>the case if it could safely and comfortabley run on LPG instead of
>>petrol.
>>
>>That would put the 155 V6 and possibly the 164 v6 (only possibly because
>>of the sheer size of the vehicle) firmly in the affordable luxury
>>cruiser bracket. I know the conversion might cost way more than the car
>>(depending on whether the 164 keeps climbing in price), but it wouldn't
>>take long with a V6 to reap the fuel benefits, especially if I keep the
>>car for a couple of years, and move it on before fuel duty on LPG equals
>>that of Petrol.
>>
>>What does everyone think?

>
> Personally, I refuse to play the governments silly games with fuel duty.
> If everyone converted to LPG tomorrow, the government wouldn't hesitate to
> put duty on LPG up overnight. I noticed today that diesel at the local
> garage is now more expensive than unleaded. Did it not used to be
> considerably cheaper?


It's been more expensive for ages.

>Surely this isn't because of the increasing use of
> diesels in the UK and the corresponding drop in revenue?


You think?

--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk
  #16  
Old August 6th 04, 06:50 PM
SteveH
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MeatballTurbo > wrote:

> > > Even a V6? I thought a 155 V6 would be equally imbalanced as a 164 would
> > > be, maybe even more so, because of the smaller size?

> >
> > Who said anything about a 155?
> >

> Quite correct, only scan read your post.
>
> I originally asked about 155 or 164, didn't see you said 75 till just
> now. But surely the same applies, and probably more so as the V6 75's
> are slightly more nose heavy than the TS's aren't they and even finer
> balanced as a TS than the FWD cars?


The 75s are pretty well balanced as it is - due to the weight of the
gearbox mainly. But I _really_ wouldn't like an LPG tank back there,
too.
--
Steve H 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
http://www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - MZ ETZ300
VW Golf GL Cabrio - Alfa 75 TS - Alfa 155 TS Lusso - COSOC KOTL
BoTAFOT #87 - BoTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #
  #17  
Old August 8th 04, 07:49 AM
Dutchie
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"MeatballTurbo" > wrote in message
t...
> As the time to actually buy a new car approaches, I just an inredible
> thought. While the Saab has to go, period, I could get something with an
> equally juicy engine if it could be run on LPG.
>
> While I said before, no V6's because of economy, maybe that wouldn't be
> the case if it could safely and comfortabley run on LPG instead of
> petrol.
>
> That would put the 155 V6 and possibly the 164 v6 (only possibly because
> of the sheer size of the vehicle) firmly in the affordable luxury
> cruiser bracket. I know the conversion might cost way more than the car
> (depending on whether the 164 keeps climbing in price), but it wouldn't
> take long with a V6 to reap the fuel benefits, especially if I keep the
> car for a couple of years, and move it on before fuel duty on LPG equals
> that of Petrol.
>
> What does everyone think?
> --
> Carl Robson
> (The poster formerly known as Skodapilot)
> http://www.bouncing-czechs.com


Living in the Netherlands, me and my colleagues have been driving Alfas on
LPG since the 80's (33, 146, 156, 164).
Problems we noticed with LPG had to do with the specific brand of
installation. Some were crap, others never had a problem. Ask for
experience/guarantee with Alfas, especially V6.

Performance didn't seem to be influenced. There is some extra damage to the
valves because LPG burns hotter then gas, but that can be serviced easily
( I am told, never touched the inside of a car )

As for building a tank in the spare wheel area, it will make you stop at the
gasstation every 300km/200 miles.

Paul
a happy 2001 156SW owner


  #18  
Old August 8th 04, 09:10 AM
Alfistagj
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"Dutchie" > schreef in bericht
...
> There is some extra damage to the
> valves because LPG burns hotter then gas, but that can be serviced easily
> ( I am told, never touched the inside of a car )
>


Not the valves, but the exhaust valve seats may suffer from LPG.
As non-leaded petrol, LPG doesn't contain lead that works as a buffer /
shock absorber to cope with the forces that occur when the valve closes.
Combined with the heat, this damages the valve seat which will eventually
result in no more valve clearance (between top of the valve stem and the cam
shaft.
Due to this the valve will no longer close properly and due to this, the
heat from the valve which is normally transferred through the valve seat /
cylinder head / cooling fluid to the cooling system will result in a burned
valve.
In this, the higher burning temperature of LPG compared to will also be a
factor.

However, Alfa's, and this in contradiction to engined with steel heads,
cylinder heads are made from aluminium since decades and therefor equipped
with valve seat inserts of special steel (aluminium is not able to do the
job) AND the exhauist valve seat stem have been filled with sodium that
works as an additional cooling medium.
These combined make Alfa's cylinder heads resistent to the problems that may
occur when using LPG (and non-leaded fuel by the way)
Maintenance to the cylinder head using LPG is usually NOT effected; checking
the valve clearance at every 20.000km's (the older engines don't have
hydraulic tappets, but are adjusted the old fashioned way)
Some dealers will advice an additional valve clearanc check at 5 and
10.000km as well just to be sure.
--
Ciao from Holland
AlfistaGJ (Gert-Jan)
Alfa red 156 SW 1.8 Madeno tuned (2000)
Golden Montreal 1428700 (1973/4)


 




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