7-Series Makeover

I heard that they are going to do a 7 Series makeover, possibly smoothing out some of the Bangleness. Does anyone know when this is going to happen? Any pics yet?

"Meg R." > wrote in message
news:Ej3Cd.18555$CH5.15970@fed1read01...
I heard that they are going to do a 7 Series makeover, possibly smoothing
out some of the Bangleness. Does anyone know when this is going to happen?
Any pics yet?


Yeah, every time I see one from the outside I want one, especially if they
would refine the look a bit, per your comment. Then I go to the website and
view the interior and that bare console and I start to think about twidling
with the iDrive for everything and I start to sweat. It would be nice it
they put a few of the often most used controls back on the dash like they
did with the 5 series.

"BTF" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Meg R." > wrote in message
> news:Ej3Cd.18555$CH5.15970@fed1read01...
> I heard that they are going to do a 7 Series makeover, possibly smoothing
> out some of the Bangleness. Does anyone know when this is going to
> happen? Any pics yet?
>
>
> Yeah, every time I see one from the outside I want one, especially if they
> would refine the look a bit, per your comment. Then I go to the website
> and view the interior and that bare console and I start to think about
> twidling with the iDrive for everything and I start to sweat. It would be
> nice it they put a few of the often most used controls back on the dash
> like they did with the 5 series.
>

They already have dual zone temp control, fan speed, a/c, radio volume, rear
defroster, windshield defogger and recirc controls on the dash. Radio
preset/scan and volume are on the steering wheel. What other often most
used controls should they have left on the dash?

Kyle.

"Kyle and Lori Greene" > wrote in message
om...
>
> "BTF" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Meg R." > wrote in message
>> news:Ej3Cd.18555$CH5.15970@fed1read01...
>> I heard that they are going to do a 7 Series makeover, possibly smoothing
>> out some of the Bangleness. Does anyone know when this is going to
>> happen? Any pics yet?
>>
>>
>> Yeah, every time I see one from the outside I want one, especially if
>> they would refine the look a bit, per your comment. Then I go to the
>> website and view the interior and that bare console and I start to think
>> about twidling with the iDrive for everything and I start to sweat. It
>> would be nice it they put a few of the often most used controls back on
>> the dash like they did with the 5 series.
>>
>
> They already have dual zone temp control, fan speed, a/c, radio volume,
> rear defroster, windshield defogger and recirc controls on the dash.
> Radio preset/scan and volume are on the steering wheel. What other often
> most used controls should they have left on the dash?
>
> Kyle.
>
> How do you change the mode of the stereo, I do that most often. i.e. from
> single CD to CD changer to Satelite Radio to FM, etc...?

Thanks.
>

Boy another whiner about about the Bangle. Do you realize that you are
whining about exactly what has made BMW stand apart from other cars for
upwards of 30 years now? When is the last time you mistook a new 5 or 7
for a Diamante or an Accord? I remember in the early 80s about the M1,
was this what to expect in the future? It was ugly, bulky and speed was
the main concern. Now its a classic. Then there were the 6 series
whiners. My favorite was I remeber someone calling the 635CSI a "german
camaro", more people bitching about how BMW was steering away from
their classic styling, blah, blah, the interior controls were too
complicated, the rear climate control was completely idiotic.... etc,
etc, etc..., Now this is also a classic. Last but not least was the
whining about the e36, how it was a cheap 5 series knock off, it had no
sportiness, and it was only a way to get a younger crowd into the
dealership. Well, time will tell on this but people seem to like the
M3...
And the I-Drive?? geez... this is technology people, wake up an figure
out how to use it!!! It is already being copied by Lexus, Infiniti and
the new Lincoln Nerdigator is slated for a new central control system
too. Hmm. sounds like BMW has done it again. Let me put it this way, if
you are too lazy or stupid to learn about the controls in your car then
you should buy something else, maybe a Civic. Learn how to use it and
you will be impressed.
I guess it can be summed up by a quote I once heard. it went something
like this... The true measure of intelligence is the ability to adapt
to change... if you cant deal with the new technology and body
styles... well....

Corey Shuman ranted incoherently:

> Boy another whiner about about the Bangle. Do you realize that you are
> whining about exactly what has made BMW stand apart from other cars for
> upwards of 30 years now? When is the last time you mistook a new 5 or 7
> for a Diamante or an Accord?

Actually - I find the new 5er very hard to tell it's a BMW at a glance.

When I see one it first looks like a Pontiac (front view) then some sort
of Japanese car (rear view).. I actually have to look for the Roundel to
tell what it is. I'd have to guess they don't have Pontiac's in Germany
so perhaps the board that approved the design didn't see the quite
obvious similarity.

I never had that problem with an E28, E34 or E39 - they are
distinctively BMW.

While I can agree that Bangle Bashing probably is overdone - having
objections to the direction a companies styling is going is valid, and
really should be something the company would be vitally interested in.

After owning 6 BMWs - there is nothing at all in the showroom at the
moment that interests me once the E46 models go away. When it comes time
to look for a new car, I don't think I'll spend a lot of time at the BMW
store.

Snipporanto..

Last but not least was the
> whining about the e36, how it was a cheap 5 series knock off, it had no
> sportiness, and it was only a way to get a younger crowd into the
> dealership. Well, time will tell on this but people seem to like the
> M3...

Yes - but the M3 is all about driving. That is the reason people will
pay a large premium for a car that basically is built on an economy (for
BMW) model platform.

The E36/M3 styling - while attractive, isn't really a very "special"
design (and I own one so I'm not particularly biased against it, I'm
just not terribly impressed either.)

> And the I-Drive?? geez... this is technology people, wake up an figure
> out how to use it!!! It is already being copied by Lexus, Infiniti and
> the new Lincoln Nerdigator is slated for a new central control system
> too. Hmm. sounds like BMW has done it again. Let me put it this way, if
> you are too lazy or stupid to learn about the controls in your car then
> you should buy something else, maybe a Civic. Learn how to use it and
> you will be impressed.

Reading this - I'd have to guess you've never driven one of the I-Drive
equipped cars.

BMW used to be about driver involvement, and easy use of all the
controls by the driver with minimal distraction from the task at hand -
driving. THAT is where I-drive fails. If you have to look at a screen to
see what the control you're trying to adjust is doing, you are now
distracted from driving the car.

This is a BAD thing, and your statement about other auto makers using
this sort of design reminds me of the kid caught smoking "But...
everyone is doing it.." (And it seems the other auto makers on a whole
have learned from BMW's mistakes - their implementations are much easier
and more intuitive to use.

Being lazy or stupid has nothing to do with a dislike for I-Drive.
I-Drive is a poorly implemented answer for a question that no one asked.

Question for you - since you seem to love "new" technology...

What is the actual advantage of the new 5 series (and I'd assume 6
series) turn-signal activation/cancel control? To me - once again, it
seems like an answer to an unasked question. The original design that
has been around since the late 40's seems to work for everyone else and
is a "standard" so you don't have to learn different techniques for
every car you might drive.

What is the reason they changed this and how is it better?

> I guess it can be summed up by a quote I once heard. it went something
> like this... The true measure of intelligence is the ability to adapt
> to change... if you cant deal with the new technology and body
> styles... well....

It appears that you judge yourself and others by this quote, so I'll
pass another one back to you.

"The difference between stupidity and genius is there is a limit to
genius" - Albert Einstein.

I'd have to say your rant demonstrated that we don't have to worry about
your reaching the limits here.

It didnt seem to be to incoherent as you were able to respond to each
point.... but as to styling..Wow, you must be getting better e39s where
ever you are at, take a look at the diamante of the same years..
similar grill and near identical light and fog placement. Anyway that
could be left to personal preference. Accords and maximas have the
exact same placement of rear lights etc...

>Reading this - I'd have to guess you've never driven one of the
I-Drive
>equipped cars.

>BMW used to be about driver involvement, and easy use of all the
>controls by the driver with minimal distraction from the task at hand
-
>driving. THAT is where I-drive fails. If you have to look at a screen
to
>see what the control you're trying to adjust is doing, you are now
>distracted from driving the car.


>This is a BAD thing, and your statement about other auto makers using
>this sort of design reminds me of the kid caught smoking "But...
>everyone is doing it.." (And it seems the other auto makers on a whole

>have learned from BMW's mistakes - their implementations are much
easier
>and more intuitive to use.


>Being lazy or stupid has nothing to do with a dislike for I-Drive.
>I-Drive is a poorly implemented answer for a question that no one
asked.



As to the I-Drive, well, I completely disagree and refer back to the
"if your too dumb to use it then dont" comment. My sig others father
purchased an 04 745il a few months ago, both being BMW fanatics we dug
right into all the neat new stuff in it. While the I-Drive took a bit
to get used to, once mastered its as simple as other basic controls. I
can drive and use the I-Drive as easily as I could drive and change the
radio station or adjust the temperature in a regular vehicle. Its not
rocket science, if you have a computer running windows you already know
the basic structure. It doesnt make it less of a drivers car, it makes
it more because you only have to go one place to control everything,
not wandering your hands all over the dash looking for the correct
button or dial.
If other cars have made this more simple its because their drivers
arent capable of using the complex system or enjoying the benefits of
the same. And on the topic of drive, these new cars drive like nothing
I've ever been in, navigating canyons and flatlands with pinpointed
control and accuracy. BMW is still just as much about driver
involvement, they just ask that you understand how the car operates
before you get in and rally it.
I have test driven the 545 and when my loan is paid up next year that
is what I intend to buy, why because

>Question for you - since you seem to love "new" technology...


>What is the actual advantage of the new 5 series (and I'd assume 6
>series) turn-signal activation/cancel control? To me - once again, it
>seems like an answer to an unasked question. The original design that
>has been around since the late 40's seems to work for everyone else
and
>is a "standard" so you don't have to learn different techniques for
>every car you might drive.


>What is the reason they changed this and how is it better?

I have no idea why they changed it, simply to make it better in an
engineers eye. Remeber the original OBCs really didnt improve anything,
they were just a neat gadget. But now its something you rely on. BMW
has barely begun to push the envelope as to what can be done.
(seriously, are you quoting 1940s technology and saying it cant be
improved???) If they followed your council and never asked questions
then they would never evolve...we would all still be driving
2002s.(which is a great car too btw...) sure maybe some ideas are
better than others (the head cradles on the headrest are lame) but they
are treading new ground, Xenon lighting, side marker lights, HUD, F1
launches... none of these are necessary, but they are the evolution of
BMW, if this is what you would consider stupidity then so be it. This
arguement could be left that if no one every improved on a good idea,
then we wouldnt even have an internet to argue on...

Corey Shuman wrote:

> It didnt seem to be to incoherent as you were able to respond to each
> point....

Only after sorting the points (as they were) out into separate paragraphs.

but as to styling..Wow, you must be getting better e39s where
> ever you are at, take a look at the diamante of the same years..
> similar grill and near identical light and fog placement. Anyway that
> could be left to personal preference. Accords and maximas have the
> exact same placement of rear lights etc...

I'm guessing you didn't notice - the Japanese cars you're referring to
ALL copied BMW styling **AFTER** the BMW E39 styling was released. In
the case of the new 5 series - it looks like BMW copied Pontiac and
Honda. There isn't a lot BMW can do about others copying their styling,
but to use styling easily mistakable for a Pontiac? Well.. if you like
it maybe you should try a GTO for a while.

Giant Snipperoo again..

>>Being lazy or stupid has nothing to do with a dislike for I-Drive.
>>I-Drive is a poorly implemented answer for a question that no one
>> asked.
> >
> As to the I-Drive, well, I completely disagree and refer back to the
> "if your too dumb to use it then dont" comment.

In English this would be "If you're too dumb to use it than don't
comment" I find it a bit ironic that you're claiming other people are
dumb and using incorrect grammar to do so.

My sig others father
> purchased an 04 745il a few months ago, both being BMW fanatics we dug
> right into all the neat new stuff in it. While the I-Drive took a bit
> to get used to,

WHY should driving a car need to be "a bit to get used to"? You don't
see something wrong with that statement?

once mastered its as simple as other basic controls. I
> can drive and use the I-Drive as easily as I could drive and change the
> radio station or adjust the temperature in a regular vehicle. Its not
> rocket science, if you have a computer running windows you already know
> the basic structure.

How many people actually do know how to run Windows? Think about that
for a while.

It doesnt make it less of a drivers car, it makes
> it more because you only have to go one place to control everything,
> not wandering your hands all over the dash looking for the correct
> button or dial.

I've never had a real problem with my hands wandering all over the dash
on the older BMW models since the controls "fall readily to hand" (as
was said in the magazine reviews.)

> If other cars have made this more simple its because their drivers
> arent capable of using the complex system or enjoying the benefits of
> the same.

My Gawd - there appears to be no boundary to your self-importance is
there? (This is a rhetorical question - so you don't have to answer it.)

And on the topic of drive, these new cars drive like nothing
> I've ever been in, navigating canyons and flatlands with pinpointed
> control and accuracy. BMW is still just as much about driver
> involvement, they just ask that you understand how the car operates
> before you get in and rally it.
> I have test driven the 545 and when my loan is paid up next year that
> is what I intend to buy, why because

You seem to have left this question unanswered - or resorted to a 5 year
olds answer of "Why?" "Because"


>>Question for you - since you seem to love "new" technology...

>
>>What is the actual advantage of the new 5 series (and I'd assume 6
>>series) turn-signal activation/cancel control? To me - once again, it
>>seems like an answer to an unasked question. The original design that
>>has been around since the late 40's seems to work for everyone else
>
> and
>
>>is a "standard" so you don't have to learn different techniques for
>>every car you might drive.
>
>
>
>>What is the reason they changed this and how is it better?
>
>
> I have no idea why they changed it, simply to make it better in an
> engineers eye.

BING - wrong answer. It was simply to make it DIFFERENT. There is no
advantage to the scheme BMW is now using and the disadvantage that it
is different from every other car made. It will make the average new
BMW driver (the ones BMW wants to attract) really wonder what the hell
BMW is up to with bonehead engineering like this.

Remeber the original OBCs really didnt improve anything,
> they were just a neat gadget. But now its something you rely on.

Really? What do you rely on it for?

BMW
> has barely begun to push the envelope as to what can be done.
> (seriously, are you quoting 1940s technology and saying it cant be
> improved???)

If there is an IMPROVEMENT - yes - perhaps it should be - but you
admitted yourself that you don't know what improvement the modified
turn-signal provides the driver. It's not an improvement. It is change
for the sake of change.

If they followed your council and never asked questions
> then they would never evolve...we would all still be driving
> 2002s.(which is a great car too btw...) sure maybe some ideas are
> better than others (the head cradles on the headrest are lame) but they
> are treading new ground, Xenon lighting, side marker lights, HUD, F1
> launches... none of these are necessary, but they are the evolution of
> BMW, if this is what you would consider stupidity then so be it.

You're generalizing and putting words into my mouth. I did not say they
should never change - but they have made changes in the recent models
that are not advances. They are simply changes to have something to
point to. They do not enhance the driving experience - and THAT is what
BMW used to be all about.

This
> arguement could be left that if no one every improved on a good idea,
> then we wouldnt even have an internet to argue on...

I'm not even going near that one.

Goodnight Gracie..

Opinions, opinions. I love BMWs, but if I was GIVEN a new 7-series, I'd sell
it and buy something else.

Randy

Holy Cow.... I think somebody is a little bit sensitive. Corey, are you sleeping with Mr. Bangle? I simply asked when is BMW going to do the next 7 series makeover, and you interpret it as "whining". I think the only "whining" is to be found in your defensive rant. And after your tirade is done, my original question is never even answered!!! When are they doing a makeover?

For the record, and since you brought the subject up, I do think the 7-Series has some issues. I did own a 2003 745i, but I lemon-lawed it after it was in the shop for over 45 days during my first 8 months of ownership. My problems all stemmed from the I-Drive. When one function went out, all the other functions fell like dominoes- just like a computer freezing up. I was unable to use the radio, stereo, i-drive related climate control, phone.... not what you expect from their flagship vehicle. And I was not alone in my grief, I know four other friends who have returned their 7s. I think that BMW made a big mistake in trying to seemlessly integrate so many components. Mechanics are not computer programmers, and I know that the mechanics that worked on my car would have loved to have the option of simply replacing a stereo or phone. Instead, when the i-drive failed, they would try (and fail) to successfully perform the automotive equivalent of a brain transplant.

With regards to the styling of the car, I thought it was interesting, but it did have some obscure lines. I bought it because it was different, but I never thought it was a natural beauty, like say a Meredes CL500 or a Ferrari Dino. I'm sure the 745i will be a classic one day.... age will do that to all vehicles (even a Yugo, Dodge Dart & Ford Pinto are all practically "classics"!!!), but it will never be a classic beauty. To me, being different isn't to be equated with being a great car, being a classic, or even being beautiful. If it was, the Pontiac Aztec would still be in production.

I look forward to the makeover of the 7-Series, when they can refine it, work out the kinks, and smooth out some of it's lines. Which brings me back to my original question: when are they going to do a makeover (however mild that makeover may be) and does anybody have an photos/renditions of what is to be expected?





"Corey Shuman" > wrote in message ups.com...
> Boy another whiner about about the Bangle. Do you realize that you are
> whining about exactly what has made BMW stand apart from other cars for
> upwards of 30 years now? When is the last time you mistook a new 5 or 7
> for a Diamante or an Accord? I remember in the early 80s about the M1,
> was this what to expect in the future? It was ugly, bulky and speed was
> the main concern. Now its a classic. Then there were the 6 series
> whiners. My favorite was I remeber someone calling the 635CSI a "german
> camaro", more people bitching about how BMW was steering away from
> their classic styling, blah, blah, the interior controls were too
> complicated, the rear climate control was completely idiotic.... etc,
> etc, etc..., Now this is also a classic. Last but not least was the
> whining about the e36, how it was a cheap 5 series knock off, it had no
> sportiness, and it was only a way to get a younger crowd into the
> dealership. Well, time will tell on this but people seem to like the
> M3...
> And the I-Drive?? geez... this is technology people, wake up an figure
> out how to use it!!! It is already being copied by Lexus, Infiniti and
> the new Lincoln Nerdigator is slated for a new central control system
> too. Hmm. sounds like BMW has done it again. Let me put it this way, if
> you are too lazy or stupid to learn about the controls in your car then
> you should buy something else, maybe a Civic. Learn how to use it and
> you will be impressed.
> I guess it can be summed up by a quote I once heard. it went something
> like this... The true measure of intelligence is the ability to adapt
> to change... if you cant deal with the new technology and body
> styles... well....
>