Mazda Protege AC question

Please offer advice, point me to the correct newsgroup - any help is
appreciated.

98 Mazda Protege - AC failed so took it to a Japanese shop with a decent
reputation.

Was told I had a hole in the condenser - which I didn't dispute. Paid for
the condenser ($300), Freon&Oil ($90) and 2 hours Labor ($140)

so whole deal ended up being close to $600 - AC worked great but less than a
day later, no AC and the system is empty again.

Called the mechanic and he's acting like it must be some other problem. I
doubt it. Condenser is brand new and it looks like oil coming from drivers
side, but not sure if that was the first time around.

Repair came with a limited warranty of course and I'm guessing the guy may
try a stunt. I was hoping somebody on this group may have some input.

1 - did I pay too much to begin with? Compressor seemed a little high but
not too bad compared to internet prices.

2 - $90 bucks for freon and oil? That seems a little high.

3 - the condenser seems to be something that would be easy to damage during
installation - is this the case?

4 - what's the chance somebody fogot to tighten something

5 - should I pay another dime?

Thanks for the help.

Ricky

First off to help with your cost questions Rick:
1. About $200 is average wholesaler price for the condenser
2. $ 90 for Freon and oil is completely reasonable.
3. 2 hours labor for $140 is possibly a little on the high side but not
much.
I would take it back to the same shop and insist that they refill and
perform an additional leak check for no cost and then only pay for
additional parts and labor from there. Also if the system was opened to
replace the condenser the Accumulator/drier should have also been
changed at the same time. This is a best practice, performed by most
all reputable shops.

-Jerry
Texas Auto Air Guy

First off to help with your cost questions Rick:
1. About $200 is average wholesaler price for the condenser
2. $ 90 for Freon and oil is completely reasonable.
3. 2 hours labor for $140 is possibly a little on the high side but not
much.
I would take it back to the same shop and insist that they refill and
perform an additional leak check for no cost and then only pay for
additional parts and labor from there. Also if the system was opened to
replace the condenser the Accumulator/drier should have also been
changed at the same time. This is a best practice, performed by most
all reputable shops.

-Jerry
Texas Auto Air Guy

And FWIW, having had many AC problems with old cars over the years, it is my
experience that the "weakest link" theorem applies, but augmented, when it
comes to AC stuff.

Mostly if you had a leak in your condenser, it is possible that when the
system was evacuated, debris/oil&dirt/whatever that was formerly under
pressure and crammed in some o-ring junction or whatever, or even a deformed
o-ring itself, may have been allowed to "relax" and expose a new opportunity
for a leak. So when you recharge it, the original cause for the leak is
gone but a whole new one (probably at a hose joint) is created by no fault
of the repairman, except that they didn't thoroughly check for leaks when
they reassembled the system.

This has happened to me numerous times and is why I began doing my own AC
repair work to a limited extent, since once something goes south, it can be
a very long road of repeated sequential leaks before basically every
junction is broken down and refitted with new o-rings. It's so much that
it's probably worthwhile as soon as the system leaks 100% (like with a hole
in the condenser) and requires evac, if the car's nearly 10 years old like
your Protege, to pay not only for the condenser repair, but while the system
is open, replace all of the o-rings at every fitting. While this may seem
expensive, IMHO in the long run it can save you money because you won't have
to repeatedly pay for evac & recharge and new material each time the next
weak link is broken. Doing the o-ring replacement over the whole system
will also allow the tech to discover any hoses or whatever that merit
replacement while he's in there.

Thanks for the reply guys -

An update on the situation:

The problem was diagnosed as a bad new condenser. Shop was good about it -
though it took them forever to get the replacement (they still have the car
as of today, Tuesday afternoon but I'm getting it back tonight)

However, they have located a problem with one of the condenser fans
(passenger side) - he will do it for $250 (dealer part + one hour @ $70) but
I can get the fan online for ~$50 and am confident I can put it in easily.

I am certainly not against the idea of cleaning up the whole system - except
for the fact that the car is worth at best $3K and we're only trying to get
through the summer with it. As far as the new drier should have been
installed remark, well I find that a bit disconcerting that it wasn't
suggested but at the same time I did express a desire to get it going as
inexpensively as possible.

As far as I can tell this guy has a good reputation - and is real busy right
now as we are also in TX and it seems like everybody's AC has gone bad.

Thanks again for the tips,

Ricky

As long as the shop puts the system on a vacuum pump for a good long time
and there are no leaks, the filter/dryer shouldn't be a problem. They are
in there to pick up that last little bit of water vapor that can be tough to
extract with the vacuum pump, due to constraints in time and other reasons.
If the system has been open to atmosphere for a while, then the filter/dryer
will be saturated with water and won't pick up anymore. But since you just
want to go another season, then try to get them to leave it on the pump as
long as they can .. leave the car with them for a while if you can.




"Ricky" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for the reply guys -
>
> An update on the situation:
>
> The problem was diagnosed as a bad new condenser. Shop was good about it -
> though it took them forever to get the replacement (they still have the
> car as of today, Tuesday afternoon but I'm getting it back tonight)
>
> However, they have located a problem with one of the condenser fans
> (passenger side) - he will do it for $250 (dealer part + one hour @ $70)
> but I can get the fan online for ~$50 and am confident I can put it in
> easily.
>
> I am certainly not against the idea of cleaning up the whole system -
> except for the fact that the car is worth at best $3K and we're only
> trying to get through the summer with it. As far as the new drier should
> have been installed remark, well I find that a bit disconcerting that it
> wasn't suggested but at the same time I did express a desire to get it
> going as inexpensively as possible.
>
> As far as I can tell this guy has a good reputation - and is real busy
> right now as we are also in TX and it seems like everybody's AC has gone
> bad.
>
> Thanks again for the tips,
>
> Ricky
>

I had the same problem with my 97, but the shop did a trace for a leak
BEFORE the new condenser .... I'd insist for a tracer with dye before any
more real $$$$

Don

"Ricky" > wrote in message
...
> Please offer advice, point me to the correct newsgroup - any help is
> appreciated.
>
> 98 Mazda Protege - AC failed so took it to a Japanese shop with a decent
> reputation.
>
> Was told I had a hole in the condenser - which I didn't dispute. Paid for
> the condenser ($300), Freon&Oil ($90) and 2 hours Labor ($140)
>
> so whole deal ended up being close to $600 - AC worked great but less than
a
> day later, no AC and the system is empty again.
>
> Called the mechanic and he's acting like it must be some other problem. I
> doubt it. Condenser is brand new and it looks like oil coming from drivers
> side, but not sure if that was the first time around.
>
> Repair came with a limited warranty of course and I'm guessing the guy may
> try a stunt. I was hoping somebody on this group may have some input.
>
> 1 - did I pay too much to begin with? Compressor seemed a little high but
> not too bad compared to internet prices.
>
> 2 - $90 bucks for freon and oil? That seems a little high.
>
> 3 - the condenser seems to be something that would be easy to damage
during
> installation - is this the case?
>
> 4 - what's the chance somebody fogot to tighten something
>
> 5 - should I pay another dime?
>
> Thanks for the help.
>
> Ricky
>
>