Disabling the power antenna

In freezing temperatures the power antenna on my '94 Accord LX is
often stuck because of the plastic strip that moves the antenna telescop
is just not able to handle the extra friction. Since I still want to use
my mp3 player through the radios FM band under those conditions, I'd
like to splice in a toggle switch in the line that sends the "radio-on"
signal to the antenna servo.
From what I see in the wiring diagram, the servo motor gets both a
constant +12V voltage and a "radio-on" 12V (?) on two separate lines (in
addition of Ground) and from that I gather that the radio-on voltage
supplies low signal power only to a relay that then applies the constant
12V power to the motor. So, it's pretty obvious that the toggle switch
should be installed serially in the radio-on line. What is not obvious
to me is from the wiring diagram just where the best place in that line
would be because I can't see where that line originates under the
dashboard. Has any of you installed such a switch and can lend me a hand
in this?

Rudy

"R. P." wrote:
>
> In freezing temperatures the power antenna on my '94 Accord LX is
> often stuck because of the plastic strip that moves the antenna telescop
> is just not able to handle the extra friction. Since I still want to use
> my mp3 player through the radios FM band under those conditions, I'd
> like to splice in a toggle switch in the line that sends the "radio-on"
> signal to the antenna servo.
> From what I see in the wiring diagram, the servo motor gets both a
> constant +12V voltage and a "radio-on" 12V (?) on two separate lines (in
> addition of Ground) and from that I gather that the radio-on voltage
> supplies low signal power only to a relay that then applies the constant
> 12V power to the motor. So, it's pretty obvious that the toggle switch
> should be installed serially in the radio-on line. What is not obvious
> to me is from the wiring diagram just where the best place in that line
> would be because I can't see where that line originates under the
> dashboard. Has any of you installed such a switch and can lend me a hand
> in this?
>
> Rudy

I have no particular knowledge of the '94 Accord, but I would think the
least painful would be to remove the stereo and tap into the wiring
harness that plugs in at the back of the stereo.

http://tinyurl.com/3wh3a (leads to http://www.installdr.com) will tell
you how to remove the stereo. It also says the wire is brown with white
stripe, same as right rear speaker negative. I believe this is wrong,
the factory manual says YEL/WHT for the antenna trigger (and BRN/WHT for
the right rear speaker negative).

"Randolph" > wrote:
> I have no particular knowledge of the '94 Accord, but I would think
> the
> least painful would be to remove the stereo and tap into the wiring
> harness that plugs in at the back of the stereo.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3wh3a (leads to http://www.installdr.com) will tell
> you how to remove the stereo. It also says the wire is brown with
> white
> stripe, same as right rear speaker negative. I believe this is wrong,
> the factory manual says YEL/WHT for the antenna trigger (and BRN/WHT
> for
> the right rear speaker negative).

I do have the '94 Accord service manual and using that I've already
replaced the radio once, so I know how to do it. However, I'm not sure
the best place is at that wiring harness to make the splice for the
toggle switch. Oh, and yes, you're right about the color coding of the
antenna trigger wi it is YEL/WHT at the antenna end. WHT/BLU is for
the constant battery voltage there.

Rudy

"R. P." wrote:
>
> "Randolph" > wrote:
> > I have no particular knowledge of the '94 Accord, but I would think
> > the
> > least painful would be to remove the stereo and tap into the wiring
> > harness that plugs in at the back of the stereo.

> I do have the '94 Accord service manual and using that I've already
> replaced the radio once, so I know how to do it. However, I'm not sure
> the best place is at that wiring harness to make the splice for the
> toggle switch. Oh, and yes, you're right about the color coding of the
> antenna trigger wi it is YEL/WHT at the antenna end. WHT/BLU is for
> the constant battery voltage there.

If you put in an after-market stereo, you probably used an adapter
harness that plugs in between the stereo and the original plug on the
car wiring harness. If so, I would splice the toggle switch into this
adapter harness.

"Randolph" > wrote:
> If you put in an after-market stereo, you probably used an adapter
> harness that plugs in between the stereo and the original plug on the
> car wiring harness. If so, I would splice the toggle switch into this
> adapter harness.

Actually, I installed the same model AM/FM radio as the original
was, so I needed no adapter harness. I got the replacement radio from a
junked car.

Rudy

This is an old thread but fits my question I forgot to ask originally.
What I am wondering about is whether the antenna motor's relay gets a
momentary +12 V from the radio when it is turned on or the trigger
voltage stays on during the entire time the radio is on.
Anybody knows?

Rudy

In article >, "R. P."
> wrote:

> This is an old thread but fits my question I forgot to ask originally.
> What I am wondering about is whether the antenna motor's relay gets a
> momentary +12 V from the radio when it is turned on or the trigger
> voltage stays on during the entire time the radio is on.
> Anybody knows?
>
> Rudy

The relay coil energizes and remains in that state as the antenna fully
extends. The hot power feed passes through the relay contacts, motor, SPDT
limit switch to ground. A timed rotating cam then engages the limit
switch to off, which removes the power feed to the antenna motor after
full extension. When the radio or ignition is turned off, the relay coil
is de-energized and the re-directed hot power feed passes through the
relay contacts, limit switch, motor and ground in a reverse polarity path,
allowing the antenna mast to retract. Once again, the cam engages the
limit switch to off, removing the power feed to the antenna motor after
full retraction. That's my best diagram interpretation...

BTW, in regard to your other post, I was able to purchase the original
antenna wrench from the dealer when I replaced the mast in our 92 Accord.
As for grease, mine had plenty of residual on the drive gears inside the
antenna housing to self lube the new drive cable. Be sure to remove any
broken cable inside the housing. After installation, torque antenna nut to
20lbs-in...HTH

--
Mike

"Mike" > wrote:
> The relay coil energizes and remains in that state as the antenna
> fully
> extends. The hot power feed passes through the relay contacts, motor,
> SPDT
> limit switch to ground. A timed rotating cam then engages the limit
> switch to off, which removes the power feed to the antenna motor after
> full extension. When the radio or ignition is turned off, the relay
> coil
> is de-energized and the re-directed hot power feed passes through the
> relay contacts, limit switch, motor and ground in a reverse polarity
> path,
> allowing the antenna mast to retract. Once again, the cam engages the
> limit switch to off, removing the power feed to the antenna motor
> after
> full retraction. That's my best diagram interpretation...

Thanks for that detailed explanation. My intention is to splice in a
SPDT On-Off-On toggle switch into the control line running from the
radio to the antenna motor that would allow me to manually override the
radio controlled antenna motor operation. The idea is to be able to
swich the line running from the motor to the lead from the radio in one
of the On positions for normal operation, applying battery voltage at
the other On position to keep the antenna extended during extreme cold
temps, and also keep it retracted in the center Off position when the
line between the radio and motor is effectively cut. I think this is
doable, don't you? I just need to find a good place for that switch.
Maybe in that empty box right under the radio.

> BTW, in regard to your other post, I was able to purchase the original
> antenna wrench from the dealer when I replaced the mast in our 92
> Accord.
> As for grease, mine had plenty of residual on the drive gears inside
> the
> antenna housing to self lube the new drive cable. Be sure to remove
> any
> broken cable inside the housing. After installation, torque antenna
> nut to
> 20lbs-in...HTH

Lucky you! I haven't been able to chase down that nut wrench yet,
though the new antenna arrived in the mail today. Bought it on eBay for
$16. Looks pretty much like the original but we'll see how long it
lasts. Considering how long the original Honda antenna lasted, I'm not
too concerned.
BTW, the torque wrench I have is a heavy duty one, used for wheel nuts
and such and I don't think I could use it for this one. Where do you get
those smaller ones for this kind of applications?

Oh, somebody suggested using lithium grease on the plastic drive cord
but I'm not sure.

Thanks again,
Rudy

"Mike" > wrote:
> BTW, in regard to your other post, I was able to purchase the original
> antenna wrench from the dealer when I replaced the mast in our 92
> Accord.
> As for grease, mine had plenty of residual on the drive gears inside
> the
> antenna housing to self lube the new drive cable. Be sure to remove
> any
> broken cable inside the housing. After installation, torque antenna
> nut to
> 20lbs-in...HTH

Well, finally I managed to remove the antenna motor today and sure
enough, inside the round plastic strip guide I found the last 8" of the
strip. Once I managed to fold away that stiff trunk liner, removing the
motor was easier than I first thought because it was secured with one
screw only and even that had to be unscrewed only partially because of
the way the bracket was designed. That was the only good news though I
wish Honda would have thought of providing easier access to that motor.
After all that antenna strip seems to break fairly often and getting out
the broken piece requires removal of the motor assembly.

I had no success at all with inserting the new antenna's plastic strip
into the motor assembly even though I followed the Service Manual's
instructions: having the radio on and trying to push in the antenna with
the teeth facing backward so the wheel of the motor would catch it and
pull it in when turning the radio off. The problem was that the
farthest I could push that antenna strip in while the telescop was fully
extended was still leaving about an inch of the strip free between the
bottom of the antenna mast and the spacer over the hole. That would
have required another person at the radio while I hold the mast over the
hole, though I'm not sure that would still have pulled in the antenna
fully when the radio is turned on. It seems that I should have been
able to wiggle in that plastic strip farther down before turning off the
radio though I noticed that the strip on the replacement antenna is
about an inch longer than on the old one when I account for the broken
off piece. I'd like to hear from anyone who has done this successfully
in the past if there is some trick to do this that I am missing. For
one, I'm not even sure if the motor's catch wheel can be forced to turn
by manually pushing that strip down. I had the feeling that it was able
to only slightly wiggle that wheel with the plastic strip but not really
turn it. I'm pretty sure there is no other broken off piece left there
in the motor, because the piece I picket out of it had the kind of
finished end the new antenna's cord has.

Rudy

"Mike" > wrote:
> The relay coil energizes and remains in that state as the antenna
> fully
> extends. The hot power feed passes through the relay contacts, motor,
> SPDT
> limit switch to ground. A timed rotating cam then engages the limit
> switch to off, which removes the power feed to the antenna motor after
> full extension. When the radio or ignition is turned off, the relay
> coil
> is de-energized and the re-directed hot power feed passes through the
> relay contacts, limit switch, motor and ground in a reverse polarity
> path,
> allowing the antenna mast to retract. Once again, the cam engages the
> limit switch to off, removing the power feed to the antenna motor
> after
> full retraction. That's my best diagram interpretation...

You must be right, because after I installed the 3-way antenna motor
override switch, things are working as expected. It will come really
handy in the freezing cold winter.

> BTW, in regard to your other post, I was able to purchase the original
> antenna wrench from the dealer when I replaced the mast in our 92
> Accord.

Finally my special order nut wrench also arrived today, so I'll be ready
for next time I need to replace the antenna mast.

Rudy