GM 3.8 V-6 claimed to be the BEST ENGINE EVER by some here

Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter V-6 was the
BEST engine in world history? The little alley fight we had on that as I
suggested a rather LONG list of engines I felt were better.


Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to RECALL over
1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine because of ENGINE FIRES.

I await the apologies.

"krp" > wrote in message
news
> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter V-6
> was the BEST engine in world history? The little alley fight we had
> on that as I suggested a rather LONG list of engines I felt were
> better.
>
>
> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to
> RECALL over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine
> because of ENGINE FIRES.
>
> I await the apologies.

It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for engine
fires, more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They are being
recalled becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil could leak past a
heat shield and drip on the exhaust manifold. The National Highway
Traffic Safety Administration says that could start a small fire that
could spread to a plastic spark plug wire guide and beyond."

They are a total of three vehicles that have had this problem......

And before you comment that the engine is defective becasue it leaks
oil, the biggest oil leaker I ever owned was a Toyota.

The GM 3.8L engine is cheap to build, reliable, makes good power, etc.
While it may not be "sexy" (no over head cams, only 2 valves per
cylinder) it is a very good engine. Sure GM has made mistakes
(shrinking plastic manifolds for one), but the basic engine is very
good. And sho hasn't made mistakes? Latetly Toyota has been recalling
about as many cars as GM, and we only see a fraction of the worldwide
Toyota recalls (for instance, they just had to recall Yari becasue the
seat belt tensioner could set the interior on fire - which would you
rather have a fire in the engine compartment, or one in the passenger
compartment?).

Ed

Ed

"C. E. White" > wrote in message
news:49e4953b$1@kcnews01...
>
> "krp" > wrote in message
> news
>> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter V-6 was
>> the BEST engine in world history? The little alley fight we had on that
>> as I suggested a rather LONG list of engines I felt were better.
>>
>>
>> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to RECALL
>> over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine because of ENGINE
>> FIRES.
>>
>> I await the apologies.
>
> It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for engine fires,
> more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They are being recalled
> becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil could leak past a heat shield and
> drip on the exhaust manifold. The National Highway Traffic Safety
> Administration says that could start a small fire that could spread to a
> plastic spark plug wire guide and beyond."


Is there an apology in there somewhere?

On Tue, 14 Apr 2009 09:52:45 -0400, "C. E. White"
> wrote:

>
>"krp" > wrote in message
>news
>> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter V-6
>> was the BEST engine in world history? The little alley fight we had
>> on that as I suggested a rather LONG list of engines I felt were
>> better.
>>
>>
>> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to
>> RECALL over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine
>> because of ENGINE FIRES.
>>
>> I await the apologies.
>
>It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for engine
>fires, more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They are being
>recalled becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil could leak past a
>heat shield and drip on the exhaust manifold. The National Highway
>Traffic Safety Administration says that could start a small fire that
>could spread to a plastic spark plug wire guide and beyond."
>
>They are a total of three vehicles that have had this problem......
>
>And before you comment that the engine is defective becasue it leaks
>oil, the biggest oil leaker I ever owned was a Toyota.
>
>The GM 3.8L engine is cheap to build, reliable, makes good power, etc.
>While it may not be "sexy" (no over head cams, only 2 valves per
>cylinder) it is a very good engine. Sure GM has made mistakes
>(shrinking plastic manifolds for one), but the basic engine is very
>good. And sho hasn't made mistakes? Latetly Toyota has been recalling
>about as many cars as GM, and we only see a fraction of the worldwide
>Toyota recalls (for instance, they just had to recall Yari becasue the
>seat belt tensioner could set the interior on fire - which would you
>rather have a fire in the engine compartment, or one in the passenger
>compartment?).
>
>Ed
>
>Ed
>


You know the difference between a major GM recall and a similar Toyota
recall??? The media only cover the GM recall.

"krp" > wrote in message
...
>
> "C. E. White" > wrote in message
> news:49e4953b$1@kcnews01...
>>
>> "krp" > wrote in message
>> news
>>> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter V-6
>>> was the BEST engine in world history? The little alley fight we
>>> had on that as I suggested a rather LONG list of engines I felt
>>> were better.
>>>
>>>
>>> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to
>>> RECALL over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine
>>> because of ENGINE FIRES.
>>>
>>> I await the apologies.
>>
>> It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for engine
>> fires, more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They are being
>> recalled becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil could leak past a
>> heat shield and drip on the exhaust manifold. The National Highway
>> Traffic Safety Administration says that could start a small fire
>> that could spread to a plastic spark plug wire guide and beyond."
>
>
> Is there an apology in there somewhere?

No, none was intended or warranted. It is silly to imply that the
entire GM 3.8L engine family is bad becasue in three cases oil leaking
onto a manifold started a small fire. Using your logic, no company
builds good vehicles (or engines), since they have all had recalls.

Ed

"C. E. White" > wrote in message
news:49e4c1d8$1@kcnews01...
>
> "krp" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "C. E. White" > wrote in message
>> news:49e4953b$1@kcnews01...
>>>
>>> "krp" > wrote in message
>>> news >>>> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter V-6 was
>>>> the BEST engine in world history? The little alley fight we had on
>>>> that as I suggested a rather LONG list of engines I felt were better.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to RECALL
>>>> over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine because of
>>>> ENGINE FIRES.
>>>>
>>>> I await the apologies.
>>>
>>> It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for engine
>>> fires, more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They are being
>>> recalled becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil could leak past a heat
>>> shield and drip on the exhaust manifold. The National Highway Traffic
>>> Safety Administration says that could start a small fire that could
>>> spread to a plastic spark plug wire guide and beyond."
>>
>>
>> Is there an apology in there somewhere?
>
> No, none was intended or warranted. It is silly to imply that the entire
> GM 3.8L engine family is bad becasue in three cases oil leaking onto a
> manifold started a small fire. Using your logic, no company builds good
> vehicles (or engines), since they have all had recalls.


So we're back to the 3.8 being the BEST ENGINE ever built again?

"krp" > wrote in message
...
>
> "C. E. White" > wrote in message
> news:49e4c1d8$1@kcnews01...
>>
>> "krp" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> "C. E. White" > wrote in message
>>> news:49e4953b$1@kcnews01...
>>>>
>>>> "krp" > wrote in message
>>>> news >>>>> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter
>>>>> V-6 was the BEST engine in world history? The little alley
>>>>> fight we had on that as I suggested a rather LONG list of
>>>>> engines I felt were better.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to
>>>>> RECALL over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine
>>>>> because of ENGINE FIRES.
>>>>>
>>>>> I await the apologies.
>>>>
>>>> It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for
>>>> engine fires, more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They
>>>> are being recalled becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil could
>>>> leak past a heat shield and drip on the exhaust manifold. The
>>>> National Highway Traffic Safety Administration says that could
>>>> start a small fire that could spread to a plastic spark plug wire
>>>> guide and beyond."
>>>
>>>
>>> Is there an apology in there somewhere?
>>
>> No, none was intended or warranted. It is silly to imply that the
>> entire GM 3.8L engine family is bad becasue in three cases oil
>> leaking onto a manifold started a small fire. Using your logic, no
>> company builds good vehicles (or engines), since they have all had
>> recalls.
>
>
> So we're back to the 3.8 being the BEST ENGINE ever built again?

Define best.....

It is a very good engine for recent US automobiles , patrticualrly
considering it is a very cheap engine to build. I have never claimed
it was the best engine ever built. I don't think anyone else has made
that claim either (and if they did, they were not thinking). You might
be able to say a particualr engine is the best engine for a particualr
application and time period, but no way can you say it, or any other
engine, is the best engine ever built.

Ed

"C. E. White" > wrote in message
news:49ec99e5@kcnews01...

>>>>>> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter V-6
>>>>>> was the BEST engine in world history? The little alley fight we had
>>>>>> on that as I suggested a rather LONG list of engines I felt were
>>>>>> better.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to
>>>>>> RECALL over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine because
>>>>>> of ENGINE FIRES.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I await the apologies.
>>>>>
>>>>> It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for engine
>>>>> fires, more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They are being
>>>>> recalled becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil could leak past a
>>>>> heat shield and drip on the exhaust manifold. The National Highway
>>>>> Traffic Safety Administration says that could start a small fire that
>>>>> could spread to a plastic spark plug wire guide and beyond."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Is there an apology in there somewhere?
>>>
>>> No, none was intended or warranted. It is silly to imply that the entire
>>> GM 3.8L engine family is bad becasue in three cases oil leaking onto a
>>> manifold started a small fire. Using your logic, no company builds good
>>> vehicles (or engines), since they have all had recalls.
>>
>>
>> So we're back to the 3.8 being the BEST ENGINE ever built again?

> Define best.....

YOU made the laughable claim - YOU define it! The engine starts on fire
and you have a laundry list of excuses for it. Reminds me of my days racing.
At the start of the festivities Chevy owners were the LOUDEST BRAGGARTS on
the track. The biggest honking super cars going. That is right up to the
point you beat their ass, then the EXCUSES were louder that their origanl
boatsm it was NEVER because the other guy's car was faster, NEVER. You know
it gets OLD after a while. You know if you had just said it was a "good
engine" I probably would have agreed with you. Claiming it was the BEST ever
or in the top ten is just such a STUPID claim as to be insulting with all
the really great power plants out there from so many brands of cars.

> It is a very good engine for recent US automobiles , patrticualrly
> considering it is a very cheap engine to build. I have never claimed it
> was the best engine ever built. I don't think anyone else has made that
> claim either (and if they did, they were not thinking). You might be able
> to say a particualr engine is the best engine for a particualr application
> and time period, but no way can you say it, or any other engine, is the
> best engine ever built.

It is not a "bad" engine. But I certainly wouldn't put it anywhere near
the top 10 or even 30 engines in history. I listed them before, Duesenberg,
Pierce Arrow, Studebaker, Hudson, Mercedes, Bugatti, Maseratti, Lamborghini,
Packard, some Cadillac and Lincoln engines. No - SORRY your 3.8 hardly makes
it to the middle of the pack must less WORLD'S BEST! Not even close. You
staked your claim on that because of the number of them built. There are
nearly 10 times as many Ladas and they are nothing but ****. Large volume
engines? The Ford 4 Cylinder engine for the 20's and early 30's, the VW bug
engine. A buttload of both and FAR more reliable.

"krp" > wrote in message
...
>
> "C. E. White" > wrote in message
> news:49ec99e5@kcnews01...
>
>>>>>>> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter
>>>>>>> V-6 was the BEST engine in world history? The little alley
>>>>>>> fight we had on that as I suggested a rather LONG list of
>>>>>>> engines I felt were better.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had
>>>>>>> to RECALL over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter
>>>>>>> engine because of ENGINE FIRES.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I await the apologies.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for
>>>>>> engine fires, more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They
>>>>>> are being recalled becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil
>>>>>> could leak past a heat shield and drip on the exhaust manifold.
>>>>>> The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration says that
>>>>>> could start a small fire that could spread to a plastic spark
>>>>>> plug wire guide and beyond."
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Is there an apology in there somewhere?
>>>>
>>>> No, none was intended or warranted. It is silly to imply that the
>>>> entire GM 3.8L engine family is bad becasue in three cases oil
>>>> leaking onto a manifold started a small fire. Using your logic,
>>>> no company builds good vehicles (or engines), since they have all
>>>> had recalls.
>>>
>>>
>>> So we're back to the 3.8 being the BEST ENGINE ever built again?
>
>> Define best.....
>
> YOU made the laughable claim - YOU define it!

I never made such a claim.

> The engine starts on fire and you have a laundry list of excuses for
> it.

I just pointed out the actual reason for the recall.

> Reminds me of my days racing. At the start of the festivities Chevy
> owners were the LOUDEST BRAGGARTS on the track. The biggest honking
> super cars going. That is right up to the point you beat their ass,
> then the EXCUSES were louder that their origanl boatsm it was NEVER
> because the other guy's car was faster, NEVER. You know it gets OLD
> after a while. You know if you had just said it was a "good engine"
> I probably would have agreed with you. Claiming it was the BEST ever
> or in the top ten is just such a STUPID claim as to be insulting
> with all the really great power plants out there from so many brands
> of cars.
>
>> It is a very good engine for recent US automobiles , patrticualrly
>> considering it is a very cheap engine to build. I have never
>> claimed it was the best engine ever built. I don't think anyone
>> else has made that claim either (and if they did, they were not
>> thinking). You might be able to say a particualr engine is the best
>> engine for a particualr application and time period, but no way can
>> you say it, or any other engine, is the best engine ever built.
>
> It is not a "bad" engine. But I certainly wouldn't put it
> anywhere near the top 10 or even 30 engines in history. I listed
> them before, Duesenberg, Pierce Arrow, Studebaker, Hudson, Mercedes,
> Bugatti, Maseratti, Lamborghini, Packard, some Cadillac and Lincoln
> engines.

It would be interesting to understand your rating system that makes
those engine all time great engines. Any of them may have been really
great in their time, but compared to a modern engine? They would all
come off as unreliable, heavy, under-powered, and hideously expensive.

> No - SORRY your 3.8 hardly makes it to the middle of the pack must
> less WORLD'S BEST! Not even close. You staked your claim on that
> because of the number of them built. There are nearly 10 times as
> many Ladas and they are nothing but ****. Large volume engines? The
> Ford 4 Cylinder engine for the 20's and early 30's, the VW bug
> engine. A buttload of both and FAR more reliable.

I doubt this is true. The old flat four VW engines were simple, but
relaible? I think not, at least not by modern standards.

Ed

"C. E. White" > wrote in message
news:49edbe2b$1@kcnews01...

>>>>>>>> Can we do a time warp back to the claims that the GM 3.8 liter V-6
>>>>>>>> was the BEST engine in world history? The little alley fight we
>>>>>>>> had on that as I suggested a rather LONG list of engines I felt
>>>>>>>> were better.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Interesting news - SOON TO BE Bankrupt General Motors has had to
>>>>>>>> RECALL over 1.5 MILLION of its cars with the 3.8 liter engine
>>>>>>>> because of ENGINE FIRES.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I await the apologies.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It is not exactly correct to say they are being recalled for engine
>>>>>>> fires, more an oil fire that spreads to the engine. They are being
>>>>>>> recalled becasue: "Under hard braking, engine oil could leak past a
>>>>>>> heat shield and drip on the exhaust manifold. The National Highway
>>>>>>> Traffic Safety Administration says that could start a small fire
>>>>>>> that could spread to a plastic spark plug wire guide and beyond."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is there an apology in there somewhere?
>>>>>
>>>>> No, none was intended or warranted. It is silly to imply that the
>>>>> entire GM 3.8L engine family is bad becasue in three cases oil leaking
>>>>> onto a manifold started a small fire. Using your logic, no company
>>>>> builds good vehicles (or engines), since they have all had recalls.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So we're back to the 3.8 being the BEST ENGINE ever built again?
>>
>>> Define best.....

>> YOU made the laughable claim - YOU define it!

> I never made such a claim.

It was made never-the-less.

>> The engine starts on fire and you have a laundry list of excuses for it.

> I just pointed out the actual reason for the recall.

Excuses.

>> Reminds me of my days racing. At the start of the festivities Chevy
>> owners were the LOUDEST BRAGGARTS on the track. The biggest honking super
>> cars going. That is right up to the point you beat their ass, then the
>> EXCUSES were louder that their origanl boatsm it was NEVER because the
>> other guy's car was faster, NEVER. You know it gets OLD after a while.
>> You know if you had just said it was a "good engine" I probably would
>> have agreed with you. Claiming it was the BEST ever or in the top ten is
>> just such a STUPID claim as to be insulting with all the really great
>> power plants out there from so many brands of cars.
>>
>>> It is a very good engine for recent US automobiles , patrticualrly
>>> considering it is a very cheap engine to build. I have never claimed it
>>> was the best engine ever built. I don't think anyone else has made that
>>> claim either (and if they did, they were not thinking). You might be
>>> able to say a particualr engine is the best engine for a particualr
>>> application and time period, but no way can you say it, or any other
>>> engine, is the best engine ever built.
>>
>> It is not a "bad" engine. But I certainly wouldn't put it anywhere
>> near the top 10 or even 30 engines in history. I listed them before,
>> Duesenberg, Pierce Arrow, Studebaker, Hudson, Mercedes, Bugatti,
>> Maseratti, Lamborghini, Packard, some Cadillac and Lincoln engines.

> It would be interesting to understand your rating system that makes those
> engine all time great engines. Any of them may have been really great in
> their time, but compared to a modern engine? They would all come off as
> unreliable, heavy, under-powered, and hideously expensive.

Oh golly - a consensus of automotive design engineers and mechanics who
are experts with engines.

>> No - SORRY your 3.8 hardly makes it to the middle of the pack must less
>> WORLD'S BEST! Not even close. You staked your claim on that because of
>> the number of them built. There are nearly 10 times as many Ladas and
>> they are nothing but ****. Large volume engines? The Ford 4 Cylinder
>> engine for the 20's and early 30's, the VW bug engine. A buttload of both
>> and FAR more reliable.

> I doubt this is true. The old flat four VW engines were simple, but
> relaible? I think not, at least not by modern standards.

Sorry that flat 4 was considered one of the most reliable ever built.