Service manual for 98 Camry: Haynes or Chilton?

On Tue, 28 Jun 2005 19:07:53 -0400, Daniel J. Stern wrote:

> On Tue, 28 Jun 2005, hachiroku wrote:
>
>> > Chiltons and Haynes manuals will be around $30 and cover the repairs
>> > most homeowners would attempt themselves.
>>
>> CarQuest sells them for $19.95
>
> ...and they're equally worthless whether the price be $20 or $30.

I find them adequate for filling holes in my knowledge for things *I*
would tackle.

On Tue, 28 Jun 2005 15:29:39 -0700, "Jeff Strickland"
> wrote:

>I assume the reader has basic automotive knowledge, or he wouldn't be buying
>a service manual in the first place. If this is true, then certainly Chilton
>and Haynes also assume a certain degree of basic knowledge.

If the person is a rank beginner at doing their own car repairs the
Factory Manuals are the most expensive way to go - but at least they
have it all complete and correct, even if the terminology used goes
over their head a bit.

The Chilton and Haynes manuals are the most dangerous books out
there to use as the primary reference when placed in the hands of a
totally clueless noob - because those books have some stuff slightly
wrong and others totally wrong, and the newbie doesn't know enough
about cars to tell what's right and what isn't.

The book writer (on behalf of the publisher) took one or two cars
apart and photographed the process, and they ASSUME that they're all
about the same - which is a very dangerous assumption to make.

They'll get the whole transmission torn apart, wondering why the
pictures don't look right - and THEN figure out the book is way wrong
because the instructions are for a different transmission model...

--<< Bruce >>--

--
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Electrician for Westend Electric - CA726700
5737 Kanan Rd. #359, Agoura CA 91301 (818) 889-9545
Spamtrapped address: Remove the python and the invalid, and use a net.

On Wed, 29 Jun 2005, hachiroku wrote:

> >> > Chiltons and Haynes manuals will be around $30 and cover the
> >> > repairs most homeowners would attempt themselves.
> >> CarQuest sells them for $19.95
> > ...and they're equally worthless whether the price be $20 or $30.

> I find them adequate for filling holes in my knowledge for things *I*
> would tackle.

You're making the faulty assumption that the "knowledge" contained in
these pieces of garbage is accurate, which it often is not.

On Tue, 28 Jun 2005, larry moe 'n curly wrote:

> I looked at the library's Chilton and Haynes manuals for my 1997 Nissan
> and found them to be really deficient, with pictures that were too
> fuzzy or dark to let me identify the parts and information that either
> wasn't there or applied to a different vehicle.

http://u225.torque.net/haynes_instructions.html

In article >,
Jeff Strickland > wrote:
>In my experience, anybody that needs a manual to change oil should give
>seriouis consideration to the Quick Change Joint down the street.

However, the manual may have such specifications like the torque
values for the oil drain bolt, wheel nuts / bolts, or other things
that one may come across during normal maintenance. Better to use
the correct torques than just guessing.

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy J. Lee
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No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.

In article >,
hachiroku > wrote:
>What about Bentley's?

They (and Helm) are fine for the brands and models of cars that they
make manuals for. Neither does the 1998 Toyota Camry service manual,
the original subject of this thread.

--
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Timothy J. Lee
Unsolicited bulk or commercial email is not welcome.
No warranty of any kind is provided with this message.

On Wed, 29 Jun 2005, Timothy J. Lee wrote:

> the manual may have such specifications like the torque values for the
> oil drain bolt, wheel nuts / bolts, or other things that one may come
> across during normal maintenance. Better to use the correct torques
> than just guessing.

Haynes/Chilton books are so often wrong on these values that just guessing
is more reliable.

"Timothy J. Lee" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> Jeff Strickland > wrote:
> >In my experience, anybody that needs a manual to change oil should give
> >seriouis consideration to the Quick Change Joint down the street.
>
> However, the manual may have such specifications like the torque
> values for the oil drain bolt, wheel nuts / bolts, or other things
> that one may come across during normal maintenance. Better to use
> the correct torques than just guessing.


You raise a good point, this sort of data should arguably be included in the
Owner's Manual. Nobody should have to buy a service manual of any sort to
properly torque stull like lug nuts and oil drain bolts. Obvioulsy, there
isn't room inthe Owner's Manual for every torque spect that is out there,
but the automakers should reasonably expect that owners will be changing
tires and oil. The owners probably won't be draining the trans or the diffs,
at least no on purpose, but they would easily think they could handle
draining the crankcase and refilling it. All the Owner's Manual would have
to say on the subject is show where the drain plug is, and list the torque
spec. The manual tells stuff about the spark plugs, it could tell about the
drain plug.

Having said that, I can't encourage anybody to buy a Haynes or a Chilton. If
one needs to know the stuff between those covers, and can reasonably use the
information contained therein, they would be much better off with the vastly
superior factory service manual, even with a cost differential of quadruple
the cost. A single mistake averted can cover the cost of the manual.

"hachiroku" > wrote in message
news
>
> What about Bentley's?
>

I have a Bentley for my BMW, and it's remarkably good. If there is a Bentley
for a Toyota, it should be as good as they are for the BMW.

hachiroku, 6/28/2005, 6:53:49 PM,
> wrote:

> On Tue, 28 Jun 2005 16:40:11 -0500, Ray O wrote:
>
> Found out where Jim Petrin went. He's at a dealer about 14 miles away.
> Perhaps if I can I'll swing down and tell him you said "Hi"
>
> If I get a free minute sometime!


Hachiroku,
I think you are one of the reasonable regulars here and would like to
show something to you.

What you have done here is called "hijacking a thread" and
unfortunately is far too common in this group. We had a perfectly good
automotive discussion going on and all of a different OT subject is
interjected into the mix.

This is a mild example of why filtering on OT in the subject line is
useless within this mostly OT group.

--
No matter what happens, someone will find a way to take it too
seriously.