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#1
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Alignment/Measurement Question - Caster of Front Wheels
I recently replaced upper ball joints on a '96 Dodge 3500 (1-ton) van.
This vehicle uses pressed-in ball joints, and I replaced them with a standard C-frame tool. After a few months, one of the ball joints backed itself out (this is a poor design, IMO). I pressed it back in, and tack-welded it in a few spots. So far, it's holding just fine. In order to do the weld, I removed the upper A-frame. Of course, I didn't think to mark it's position (uses no shims, just slotted bolt holes to adjust caster/camber) until I'd already loosened the bolts and let things shift. I'd like to get the truck properly in alignment. If that's not possible, at least driveably close until I buy new tires and have a shop fine-tune it. I think I can measure camber with a plumb bob, and toe-in's a no-brainer, but how in the devil can I measure caster? Also, is there an online reference where I can find the alignment specs for my vehicle? best regards, Martin |
#2
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Go to dodgetalk.com,the ball joint problem is discussed often.Or often
disgusted.I am not certain about the vans but the late 90s trucks are a real problem.I hope you have a moog and not a dodge ball joint Martin wrote: > I recently replaced upper ball joints on a '96 Dodge 3500 (1-ton) van. > This vehicle uses pressed-in ball joints, and I replaced them with a > standard C-frame tool. After a few months, one of the ball joints > backed itself out (this is a poor design, IMO). I pressed it back in, > and tack-welded it in a few spots. So far, it's holding just fine. > > In order to do the weld, I removed the upper A-frame. Of course, I > didn't think to mark it's position (uses no shims, just slotted bolt > holes to adjust caster/camber) until I'd already loosened the bolts and > let things shift. > > I'd like to get the truck properly in alignment. If that's not > possible, at least driveably close until I buy new tires and have a > shop fine-tune it. > > I think I can measure camber with a plumb bob, and toe-in's a > no-brainer, but how in the devil can I measure caster? > > Also, is there an online reference where I can find the alignment specs > for my vehicle? > > best regards, > > Martin > |
#3
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Fundamentally, Castor is the angle of the "king pin axis" viewed from the
side, while camber is the angle of the wheel viewed from the front. You can indeed set camber using a plain level and a ruler, I do it all the time on my race car in fact. Castor is harder. I can think of a couple of fiddles to get it close, but I'd personally take a truck to an alignment shop and let them do it. Fiddles: My race car has a flat machined on the upright so I just put a digital level on and read the castor directly. You can measure castor indirectly by measuring it's effect on camber as you turn the wheels, usually 20 degrees left and right. You could probably get in the ball park by measuring how far back the upper ball joint is compared to the lower using your level and a ruler, and compare side to side. You could do it by adjusting until the truck tracks straight - that has the advantage of ignoring what the measurement actually is and gets the effect you want. Brian Brian "MK1" > wrote in message ... > Go to dodgetalk.com,the ball joint problem is discussed often.Or often > disgusted.I am not certain about the vans but the late 90s trucks are a > real problem.I hope you have a moog and not a dodge ball joint > > Martin wrote: >> I recently replaced upper ball joints on a '96 Dodge 3500 (1-ton) van. >> This vehicle uses pressed-in ball joints, and I replaced them with a >> standard C-frame tool. After a few months, one of the ball joints >> backed itself out (this is a poor design, IMO). I pressed it back in, >> and tack-welded it in a few spots. So far, it's holding just fine. >> >> In order to do the weld, I removed the upper A-frame. Of course, I >> didn't think to mark it's position (uses no shims, just slotted bolt >> holes to adjust caster/camber) until I'd already loosened the bolts and >> let things shift. >> >> I'd like to get the truck properly in alignment. If that's not >> possible, at least driveably close until I buy new tires and have a >> shop fine-tune it. >> >> I think I can measure camber with a plumb bob, and toe-in's a >> no-brainer, but how in the devil can I measure caster? >> >> Also, is there an online reference where I can find the alignment specs >> for my vehicle? >> >> best regards, >> >> Martin >> |
#4
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Turn the wheels full left and right and measure the camber change at each
position. The caster is 1/2 the difference if the wheels had turned to 90 degrees so you have to do some calculation there. Since you have one that hasn't been changed, you can compare between the two sides and make them equal. It is more important to have matched caster than an absolute value. -- Why isn't there an Ozone Hole at the NORTH Pole? |
#5
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Are you sure it was a press fit?? Most uppers in chrysler product
trucks & older rear drive cars are screw in. Mabee they changed the design in the newer ones but if the joint has flat sides around the top, it's a threaded situation, which would explain it not staying put. I've welded quite a few of these that were stripped out with long lasting success but always on the vehicle. The best way to get proper alignment restored will be at an alignment shop. Good luck. |
#6
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pater wrote:
> Are you sure it was a press fit?? Most uppers in chrysler product > trucks & older rear drive cars are screw in. A lot of people *ruined* old Chrysler upper control arms by ASSuming they were just like other brands and pressing the screw-in joints out and new ones in. However, Chrysler cheaped-out on the trucks in the 90s and did use press-in joints. |
#7
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Yes, they are definitely pressed in. The holes in the a-frames have
smooth sides, and there are "grip ridges" but no threads on the ball joints. Some people look at the ball joints and think they are screw-in because there are flats on the outer portion, but that's deceptive. You'll quickly get tired of trying to unscrew them Martin |
#8
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Geezus Christ, go get it aligned, cheapskate
JR Dweller in the cellar and next time, buy a Ford Martin wrote: > I recently replaced upper ball joints on a '96 Dodge 3500 (1-ton) van. > This vehicle uses pressed-in ball joints, and I replaced them with a > standard C-frame tool. After a few months, one of the ball joints > backed itself out (this is a poor design, IMO). I pressed it back in, > and tack-welded it in a few spots. So far, it's holding just fine. > > In order to do the weld, I removed the upper A-frame. Of course, I > didn't think to mark it's position (uses no shims, just slotted bolt > holes to adjust caster/camber) until I'd already loosened the bolts and > let things shift. > > I'd like to get the truck properly in alignment. If that's not > possible, at least driveably close until I buy new tires and have a > shop fine-tune it. > > I think I can measure camber with a plumb bob, and toe-in's a > no-brainer, but how in the devil can I measure caster? > > Also, is there an online reference where I can find the alignment specs > for my vehicle? > > best regards, > > Martin > -- -------------------------------------------------------------- Home Page: http://www.seanet.com/~jasonrnorth If you're not the lead dog, the view never changes Doubt yourself, and the real world will eat you alive The world doesn't revolve around you, it revolves around me No skeletons in the closet; just decomposing corpses -------------------------------------------------------------- Dependence is Vulnerability: -------------------------------------------------------------- "Open the Pod Bay Doors please, Hal" "I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.." |
#9
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"JR North" > wrote in message ... > Geezus Christ, go get it aligned, cheapskate That is what I was thinking too. Caster doesn't effect tire wear, but might require the driver to grip the wheel with both hands to drive it to the alignment shop. Lane |
#10
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It's best to arrive at the shop with alignment in the ballpark.
Caster and camber are highly interactive on this vehicle, ie you loosen the upper A-frame mounts and wiggle everthing around to change both settings. If they are 'way off, you're far less likely to get a satisfactory result from some guy who's used to just setting the toe-in. Do you change your own oil? Some of us have curiousity that goes a little further Martin JR North wrote: > Geezus Christ, go get it aligned, cheapskate > JR > Dweller in the cellar > and next time, buy a Ford > > Martin wrote: > > I recently replaced upper ball joints on a '96 Dodge 3500 (1-ton) van. > > This vehicle uses pressed-in ball joints, and I replaced them with a > > standard C-frame tool. After a few months, one of the ball joints > > backed itself out (this is a poor design, IMO). I pressed it back in, > > and tack-welded it in a few spots. So far, it's holding just fine. > > > > In order to do the weld, I removed the upper A-frame. Of course, I > > didn't think to mark it's position (uses no shims, just slotted bolt > > holes to adjust caster/camber) until I'd already loosened the bolts and > > let things shift. > > > > I'd like to get the truck properly in alignment. If that's not > > possible, at least driveably close until I buy new tires and have a > > shop fine-tune it. > > > > I think I can measure camber with a plumb bob, and toe-in's a > > no-brainer, but how in the devil can I measure caster? > > > > Also, is there an online reference where I can find the alignment specs > > for my vehicle? > > > > best regards, > > > > Martin > > > > > -- > -------------------------------------------------------------- > Home Page: http://www.seanet.com/~jasonrnorth > If you're not the lead dog, the view never changes > Doubt yourself, and the real world will eat you alive > The world doesn't revolve around you, it revolves around me > No skeletons in the closet; just decomposing corpses > -------------------------------------------------------------- > Dependence is Vulnerability: > -------------------------------------------------------------- > "Open the Pod Bay Doors please, Hal" > "I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.." |
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