things are stirring for lfs s2 users

Jeff Reid wrote:
> > > The graphics are so so
>
> > Compared to what?
>
> NR2003, F1C99-02 with RH2004 mod, GTR, GTLegends.
>
> Or arcade games like NFS:Most Wanted.

While LFS might not have the best gfx out there they are more than
serviceable, still it's the whole package that makes LFS the excellent
sim that it is.

EA has infinite budget. No one can compete with the one eye monopoly
monster.

wrote:
> Jeff Reid wrote:
>>>> The graphics are so so
>>> Compared to what?
>> NR2003, F1C99-02 with RH2004 mod, GTR, GTLegends.
>>
>> Or arcade games like NFS:Most Wanted.
>
> While LFS might not have the best gfx out there they are more than
> serviceable, still it's the whole package that makes LFS the excellent
> sim that it is.
>

"Jan Verschueren" > wrote in message
...
> "Tony Rickard" wrote...
>>>> <snip>
>>> <snip>
>> I respect your view, Jan, but on what basis? LFS is developing
>> along nicely but still has some way to go before it vies for such
>> a crown, if it ever does,
>
> Because of it being the best at communicating the virtual car to the driver
> and of where the difficulty with regard to going fast is at.
>
<snip>

Jan,
How do you rate the features of LFS for supporting league competitions, both
online and offline? I mean reporting of results, enforcement of rules etc.

Bart

"Bart Westra" wrote...
> Jan,
> How do you rate the features of LFS for supporting league competitions,
> both online and offline? I mean reporting of results, enforcement of rules
> etc.

For offline hotlapping the rules the game enforces are pretty strict. Even
something as harmless as running off the end of a kerb and twitching the car
sideways on the dirt invalidates a lap in some cases. For online racing
pitspeed is enforced to a ridiculous level as well and tyre stacks are in
put in position to guard against extreme cutting (once these are run over,
it takes some time to get them back, tho'). Some sections on some tracks
overstep the line with regard creating the possibility for using more than
"all of the track and then some", which irks me (Aston GP rev., e.g. has a
bit where one can enter a fast turn with the car completely the other side
of the kerb on the outside of the racing surface (there's this kind of
concrete tile which allows grass to grow through to guard against people
killing themselves if they run wide when the track is used in the normal
direction put down there).

There are tools which extract data from replays, but qualifying data is not
stored in a race replay (even when one doesn't do a "laglap" to make sure
everyone's ready when the race is started). Here's an example (link will
wrap):

http://www.vrl-simracing.be/exports/...6_results.html

It is also possible for league owners to tap into the data stored at
LFSWorld. One request every 4 seconds is free, or one can take out a premium
account to access the data directly at a small cost per request. The VRL
league pre-qualifying tool Sywix uses this option.

http://timpreza.proboards12.com/inde...d=11421594 14

Overall we (the VRL) rated LFS (pre-patch) as the most complete and league
friendly sim over GTR, GTL and rFactor and thus decided to organise a
championship. About 30 drivers are involved, of which about 25 compete on a
regular basis.

Jan.
=---

"Jan Verschueren" > wrote in message
...
> <a nice text on lfs usage for leagues>
> Jan.

Thanks Jan!

Jan Verschueren wrote:

> As I've been saying since day one of my involvement here, a lot of people
> who drive sims seem to think the harder actually getting the virtual car
> around the track is, the more realistic the sim. This is a false
> proposition. In my limited experience, operating racecars is extremely easy
> compared to road cars (it needs to be, given the speed the control actions
> need to be delivered at). Getting them around the racetrack faster than the
> next guy is the hard part, which, IMO, LFS models beautifully.

I think you could have argued the same with GP2. Whilst I agree on your
comments regarding difficulty, I do think race cars should be on
something of a knife edge when on the limit. The difference with sims is
that you reach that limit before you really have a feel for the car, in
real life you don't explore the limits on the outlap! NetKar pro is the
only sim I have found myself exploring the limits slowly, driving around
at a slowish pace and gradually increasing - just like real life.

I have spun more race cars on a corporate day out than 25 years normal
car driving - simply because I could go hell for leather - I didn't
deliberately spin them though!

> Before a particular style of driving combined with using setups which
> exploited certain parts of the model resulted in being proficient at LFS by
> treating it more as a game than as a sim, but first evidence suggests this
> is no longer the case. Hence my statement and the feeling of finally being
> on equal terms with those who adapted to LFS in favour of other sims.

I ventured online for a quick FOX race around South City. The overriding
feeling was the amount of lift off oversteer and the ease at holding
drifts. It was as if oversteer was on tap and just by the amount of lift
I could rear end steer to avoid understeering off and with the right
amount of right foot could avoid spinning. I still feel concerned this
easy drifting method could be employed in pretty much any car even more
easily than GPL which was criticised for too similar to a rally style
for open wheel track racing. Having said that I wasn't particularly
quick having zero practice with LFS, the cars and the tracks for a long
time, but the other guys were holding huge drifts. Hardly conclusive but
certainly my initial observation.

NetKar Pro has far more subtle lift off oversteer and is more likely to
be provoked to tuck in under braking. In LFS lifting completely on a
fast bend invokes huge amounts of oversteer.

>> The graphics are so so, a bit too arcade like for my tastes.
>
> Compared to what? -there's a couple of things in rFactor with regard to
> lighting which add to the experience, but this aspect fades to
> insignificance with regard to the way the driver has to compensate for the
> actual "lay of the land" with regard to his car.

I gave it a more extended go last night. I will confess I hadn't run lfs
since updating my graphics card so I didn't have a profile set up for it
so I was ruuning minimal AA/AF etc. It looks a lot better now but still
not up to GT Legends or NetKar Pro for me.

>> the cockpits especially,
>
> Err...what?

The cockpits really are poor especially compared with GTL and the
community produced GPL cockpits, they really contribute to the arcade
game feel.

>> . The Sauber only adds to the arcade feel IMHO.
>
> It's a fact of life current F1 cars accelerate and decellerate at a
> ridiculess rate compared to what the average human brain can cope with.
> Which is why computer aided gizmos are required to free up CPU cycles in the
> modern day F1 driver's head. Again, I think the LFS Sauber is not that much
> "off".

I guess simulated modern F1 just doesn't appeal to me any more
regardless of sim

> Try again and be more "in tune" about it next time, you buffoon.

I should spend more time with it but the overall atmosphere of the sim
doesn't seem to be working for me. Maybe a wheel to wheel online race
with some similar paced drivers might do it - picking it up after god
know how many months and launching straight into an online race (cos the
ai is truly bad) is not a real test.

I just need to extend the days by a few hours...

Cheers
Tony