A Cars forum. AutoBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » AutoBanter forum » Auto makers » BMW
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

M60 Oil Pump bolt experience



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old January 6th 06, 04:54 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

I had previously read multiple accounts of people finding that the 3
fasteners that mount the oil pump (1 bolt and 2 nuts actually) have a
habit of coming loose on the M60 engines. M60s are the V8 engines found
in some of the mid 90's 5 and 7 series cars.

I knew that my 1994 540i has had the nikasil short block replaced with
Alusil (based on the block part number). I therefore sort of expected
that these oil pump fasteners would have been retorqued and lock-tited
during reassembly and therefore would be OK on mine. But I also figured
it was easy enough to drop the lower oil pan and take a gander at the
next oil change just to be safe. That next oil change was last weekend...

Well, I'm very glad that I did check because the bolt was lying in the
bottom of the pan and both of the nuts were considerably looser than the
torque spec. I reinstalled the bolt and snugged everything down to spec
using red loctite, so hopefully it won't come loose later.

A couple of things I found during this job:

One is that the drive chain to the pump was a bit loose. The spec is
10mm of slack and I measured 15mm. The adjustment is supposed to be the
hex things between the pump and the block, but I could not budge them
with an open end wrench but did not want to go crazy with cranking on
them. Has anyone here ever done this adjustment? Maybe I should just
not take chances and put a new chain on there since it has stretched so
much.

The second thing was that the steel oil pan had been significantly
deformed at each of the bolt holes. It seems that somebody cranked the
bolts down (ostensibly to eliminate an oil leak?) and the old style cork
gasket caused the pan to be bent up at each bolt. I was able to bend
the pan back into shape pretty well by supporting the pan with 2x4
blocks and hammering/punching the dents down with a 1/2" x 1/2" x 6"
block of pine. This was required due to the redesign of the gasket. It
is now a steel plate with a neoprene lip on the inside edge. In the
deformed condition the pan would not have even hit the lip and would
have leaked like a sieve. Good thing too because a new pan looks like
it runs a couple hundred bucks.

--
-Fred W

Ads
  #2  
Old January 6th 06, 05:18 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

In article >,
Fred W > wrote:
> I knew that my 1994 540i has had the nikasil short block replaced with
> Alusil (based on the block part number). I therefore sort of expected
> that these oil pump fasteners would have been retorqued and lock-tited
> during reassembly and therefore would be OK on mine.


You have more faith in a dealer than me. ;-)

--
*You! Off my planet!

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
  #3  
Old January 6th 06, 05:52 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
> In article >,
> Fred W > wrote:
>
>>I knew that my 1994 540i has had the nikasil short block replaced with
>>Alusil (based on the block part number). I therefore sort of expected
>>that these oil pump fasteners would have been retorqued and lock-tited
>>during reassembly and therefore would be OK on mine.

>
>
> You have more faith in a dealer than me. ;-)
>


well, not any more...

--
-Fred W
  #4  
Old January 6th 06, 06:11 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

In article >,
Fred W > wrote:
> >>I knew that my 1994 540i has had the nikasil short block replaced with
> >>Alusil (based on the block part number). I therefore sort of expected
> >>that these oil pump fasteners would have been retorqued and lock-tited
> >>during reassembly and therefore would be OK on mine.

> >
> >
> > You have more faith in a dealer than me. ;-)
> >


> well, not any more...


My best one was having the cam sensor replaced under warranty.
Later work (by me) showed they'd punched off the fan clutch by the damage
to the nut, and had replaced the pop up rivets on the fan shroud with
cable ties.

--
*Reality? Is that where the pizza delivery guy comes from?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
  #5  
Old January 14th 06, 06:54 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience


"Fred W" > wrote in message
...
> One is that the drive chain to the pump was a bit loose. The spec is 10mm
> of slack and I measured 15mm. The adjustment is supposed to be the hex
> things between the pump and the block, but I could not budge them with an
> open end wrench but did not want to go crazy with cranking on them. Has
> anyone here ever done this adjustment? Maybe I should just not take
> chances and put a new chain on there since it has stretched so much.


Luckily for you, you were unable to get that hex thing loose, because it's
called a main cap bolt and loosening it could contribute to crankshaft
failure.

The adjustment for the oil pump is actually done with an 8mm Allen key,
through the hole that the forward bolt goes in. The adjustment is in the
oil pump, against the head of that crank bolt, not the crank bolt itself.

> The second thing was that the steel oil pan had been significantly
> deformed at each of the bolt holes. It seems that somebody cranked the
> bolts down (ostensibly to eliminate an oil leak?) and the old style cork
> gasket caused the pan to be bent up at each bolt. I was able to bend the
> pan back into shape pretty well by supporting the pan with 2x4 blocks and
> hammering/punching the dents down with a 1/2" x 1/2" x 6" block of pine.
> This was required due to the redesign of the gasket. It is now a steel
> plate with a neoprene lip on the inside edge. In the deformed condition
> the pan would not have even hit the lip and would have leaked like a
> sieve. Good thing too because a new pan looks like it runs a couple
> hundred bucks.


This is very standard and was likely not just a case of someone trying to
stop a leak. When we were doing the Nikasil block replacements back in the
mid 90s, most pans would come off deformed, even on cars with less than 30K
miles and no record of a leak. I think it was a case of overtightening at
the production facility. We did the same thing as you, used a mandrel and
hammer to straighten the lip.

Brett Anderson
KMS







  #6  
Old January 15th 06, 02:12 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

KMS-Brett Anderson wrote:
>
>
> Luckily for you, you were unable to get that hex thing loose, because it's
> called a main cap bolt and loosening it could contribute to crankshaft
> failure.


Yeah, as I was working on it it just didn't look right to me, so I
didn't really try very hard to loosen it. The procedure I was looking
at in the Bentley manual showed their being an adjustment in only one
corner, yet each of the corners of the oil pump had the hex thing.

>
> The adjustment for the oil pump is actually done with an 8mm Allen key,
> through the hole that the forward bolt goes in. The adjustment is in the
> oil pump, against the head of that crank bolt, not the crank bolt itself.


Thanks. This was certainly not clear that this was the case either from
the Bentley or the parts breakdown s that I looked at. I'll try to make
the adjustment next oil change.

--
-Fred W
  #7  
Old January 15th 06, 02:21 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

KMS-Brett Anderson wrote:

>
> The adjustment for the oil pump is actually done with an 8mm Allen key,
> through the hole that the forward bolt goes in. The adjustment is in the
> oil pump, against the head of that crank bolt, not the crank bolt itself.
>


Brett,

OK I see the adjustment now. It's item #6 in the parts drawing (link
below), right? I sure wish it had been spelled out so clearly in the
Bentley or any of the other on-line references that I was looking at. I
wonder if the adjusment moved (hence the chain's slackness) when the
bolt loosened and dropped out, rather than the chain actually stretching.

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...& hg=11&fg=30

One further question for you: Mine did not have the plastic chain gaurd
and there were no signs of remains of one in the pan. Am I correct that
my '94 (manuf 9/93) did not come with that part. The parts breakdown
seems to infer that.

TIA for your expertise,

--
-Fred W
  #8  
Old January 19th 06, 12:04 AM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

Thanks for the verry acurate information! I have a 1994 530i m60 with 330,000
kilometers and my oil pressure has fallen to 4 psi at idle when warm running
but cold it 10 psi, so I,m not going to chance it and I have ordered new pump.
Your infowill help thank you.


Fred W wrote:
>I had previously read multiple accounts of people finding that the 3
>fasteners that mount the oil pump (1 bolt and 2 nuts actually) have a
>habit of coming loose on the M60 engines. M60s are the V8 engines found
>in some of the mid 90's 5 and 7 series cars.
>
>I knew that my 1994 540i has had the nikasil short block replaced with
>Alusil (based on the block part number). I therefore sort of expected
>that these oil pump fasteners would have been retorqued and lock-tited
>during reassembly and therefore would be OK on mine. But I also figured
>it was easy enough to drop the lower oil pan and take a gander at the
>next oil change just to be safe. That next oil change was last weekend...
>
>Well, I'm very glad that I did check because the bolt was lying in the
>bottom of the pan and both of the nuts were considerably looser than the
>torque spec. I reinstalled the bolt and snugged everything down to spec
>using red loctite, so hopefully it won't come loose later.
>
>A couple of things I found during this job:
>
>One is that the drive chain to the pump was a bit loose. The spec is
>10mm of slack and I measured 15mm. The adjustment is supposed to be the
>hex things between the pump and the block, but I could not budge them
>with an open end wrench but did not want to go crazy with cranking on
>them. Has anyone here ever done this adjustment? Maybe I should just
>not take chances and put a new chain on there since it has stretched so
>much.
>
>The second thing was that the steel oil pan had been significantly
>deformed at each of the bolt holes. It seems that somebody cranked the
>bolts down (ostensibly to eliminate an oil leak?) and the old style cork
>gasket caused the pan to be bent up at each bolt. I was able to bend
>the pan back into shape pretty well by supporting the pan with 2x4
>blocks and hammering/punching the dents down with a 1/2" x 1/2" x 6"
>block of pine. This was required due to the redesign of the gasket. It
>is now a steel plate with a neoprene lip on the inside edge. In the
>deformed condition the pan would not have even hit the lip and would
>have leaked like a sieve. Good thing too because a new pan looks like
>it runs a couple hundred bucks.
>
>--
>-Fred W


--
Message posted via
http://www.carkb.com
  #9  
Old January 19th 06, 03:06 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

Hi Fred.

Many of the early cars came with the chain guard and BMW had us remove them
due to the risk of, of all things, an oil pump bolt falling out and getting
caught by the gaurd, jamming the chain and exploding the motor.

So the short answer is that if your car came with one, a dealer removed it
many years ago.

Brett Anderson
KMS



"Fred W" > wrote in message
...
> KMS-Brett Anderson wrote:
>
>>
>> The adjustment for the oil pump is actually done with an 8mm Allen key,
>> through the hole that the forward bolt goes in. The adjustment is in the
>> oil pump, against the head of that crank bolt, not the crank bolt itself.
>>

>
> Brett,
>
> OK I see the adjustment now. It's item #6 in the parts drawing (link
> below), right? I sure wish it had been spelled out so clearly in the
> Bentley or any of the other on-line references that I was looking at. I
> wonder if the adjusment moved (hence the chain's slackness) when the bolt
> loosened and dropped out, rather than the chain actually stretching.
>
> http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...& hg=11&fg=30
>
> One further question for you: Mine did not have the plastic chain gaurd
> and there were no signs of remains of one in the pan. Am I correct that
> my '94 (manuf 9/93) did not come with that part. The parts breakdown
> seems to infer that.
>
> TIA for your expertise,
>
> --
> -Fred W



  #10  
Old January 19th 06, 03:16 PM posted to alt.autos.bmw
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default M60 Oil Pump bolt experience

KMS-Brett Anderson wrote:
> Hi Fred.
>
> Many of the early cars came with the chain guard and BMW had us remove them
> due to the risk of, of all things, an oil pump bolt falling out and getting
> caught by the gaurd, jamming the chain and exploding the motor.
>
> So the short answer is that if your car came with one, a dealer removed it
> many years ago.
>
> Brett Anderson
> KMS


Thanks again, Brett.

I'm wondering, have you ever heard the oil pump chains make any noise if
they are loose?

The reason I ask is that mine is making a randomly intermittent
"clicking" noise that seems to be coming from the lower front of the
engine at idle and just above. The clicking happens sporadically but
will usually reoccur within 10-15 seconds. It seems to increase in
frequency when I rev the engine just above idle.

I'm not driving the car at all until I can get back in and adjust the
chain tension with the hope that this will remedy that situation.
Otherwise, I suppose one of the drive belt pulleys or driven accessories
might have a bearing on the way out. I will have to remove the belts
and see if the noise goes away (engine only run briefly)

--
-Fred W
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
to change a Honda Accord 1988 model timing belt Jacko Honda 132 November 30th 05 07:20 PM
Can I "service" a noisy fuel pump? Christoph Bollig Audi 9 March 24th 05 04:01 PM
Golf 2 fuel pump relay ok, what next? dan VW water cooled 0 February 7th 05 01:15 AM
Chrysler Fuel pump and battery Questions. Mike Romain Technology 26 January 25th 05 07:36 PM
In-the-tank fuel pumps cause death and destruction Silver Surfer Chrysler 293 November 7th 04 04:41 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:55 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 AutoBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.