Wheels falling off RX-7 redux

Leon van Dommelen wrote:

> As far as I am concerned, you are right on.

Leon, we are agreeing so much lately that it is just plain frightening.
I may find myself in a white miata soon if I don't watch it.

> As far as I know, the driver drove in on OEM wheels with OEM lug nuts,
> and swapped wheels with nonOEM lug nuts. Probably what he could find
> at Pep Boys, from the look of them. (They look familiar).

Did you get a chance to look at the car close-up?

> Suggestions that the problem was that the lug nuts were not torqued
> down do not require any comment for any thinking person. Even if
> they were not even finger tight, they could not all vibrate off at the
> exact same time.

Agreed.
I am changing my bet of 10 to 1 odds to my clear miata title against
somebody's $1.00 bill if they can prove that the lug nuts all vibrated
off at once because they were not tightened down. (that is roughly 6500
to 1 odds, anyone want to lose a dollar?)

Really, if it wasn't the lug nuts popping off, what was it? The wheel
gremlin? Your original suggestion is the only one that makes any sense.

> Dixie does not check lug nut torque. They also do not check for
> possible material defects, nor whether the driver is an alien. At
> least, I never had any problem.

Definitely no alien checks, then. ;-0

> The lug threads had damage, indicating to me that the lug nuts had been
> stripped off, but by and large not enough damage that they could not
> hold a full amount of torque with the OEM nuts put back on. This
> suggests to me that the other lug nuts did not fit that well.
>
> After downloading 5 Mb of video over my phone line, Flash Player was not
> kind enough to show me the results. Probably deletes it as soon as it
> gets it to protect copyright.
>
> Leon

Phone line? Arghhhh, it has been a long time since I have heard the 56K
modem firing up.

Pat

Lanny Chambers wrote:

> What, and spoil your fun? Heaven forfend, Pat. I'm too nice a guy to
> play such a dirty trick on my Usenet buddies.

It is kind of fun to watch a video that clearly shows all of the lug
nuts popping off of the car and then to read this when it is commented on.


"Some of you are making large assumptions about lugnuts, when in reality
we don't have any facts about why the wheels came off."

Let's see, 20 lug nuts pop off at once, but to think that the lug nuts
might be the problem is making a large assumption?
I really don't think so.

Pat

Notes at the club say wrong size lug nuts used, torqued up but not
enough thread engagement too handle the stress of a turn. Sheared of
the tops of the threads.

On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 04:05:07 GMT, Lanny Chambers
> wrote:

>Here's a video:
>
>http://www.teamjamoto.com/dixeregionpage.htm

demo wrote:
> Notes at the club say wrong size lug nuts used, torqued up but not
> enough thread engagement too handle the stress of a turn. Sheared of
> the tops of the threads.

Ha!
That is exactly what me and Leon "assumed".

I also tend to "make a large assumption" that a tire is flat when it
doesn't have air in it. Some things really are not that complicated. :-)

Pat

On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 23:51:07 GMT, (Leon van
Dommelen) wrote:

>Suggestions that the problem was that the lug nuts were not torqued
>down do not require any comment for any thinking person. Even if
>they were not even finger tight, they could not all vibrate off at the
>exact same time.

They didn't have to "vibrate off at the exact same time." Only the last one or
two on each wheel had to vibrate/shear/break off under maximum stress in the
same turn-in.

That would be immediately obvious to anyone who hasn't been permanently blinded
by ugly white paint. 8

-- Larry ('95 R -- black, of course...)

NOW PAT !,

Your English teacher would do a "slow roll" is her grave if she heard
you say what you did !

It is "Always" .... Leon and I ......

You NEVER put yourself FIRST when you speak ! :-) ... Ain't that so,
teacher ??? :-)

Bruce Bing '03 LS

In article >,
pws > wrote:

> "Some of you are making large assumptions about lugnuts, when in reality
> we don't have any facts about why the wheels came off."
>
> Let's see, 20 lug nuts pop off at once, but to think that the lug nuts
> might be the problem is making a large assumption?

No, asserting the exact sequence of events with no data was a large
assumption. It was obviously something involving the lugnuts.

With more data now, it does seem likely that 1/2" nuts were used on 12mm
studs, torqued to spec, but with the threads barely engaged. But this
was still an educated guess, not the first-hand account of the owner.

No matter, I'm sure it'll buff right out.

That would be one hell of a "buffer" :-)

Bruce Bing '03 LS

Lanny Chambers wrote:

> No, asserting the exact sequence of events with no data was a large
> assumption. It was obviously something involving the lugnuts.

Leon made an educated guess that I agreed with as almost certainly being
the cause once I saw the video, and we were exactly right.

Barring a full set of defective lug nuts, something I have never seen
before, what else could it have been besides them being the wrong size?

My bet is still open for anyone who thinks that they were not tightened
down enough.

> With more data now, it does seem likely that 1/2" nuts were used on 12mm
> studs, torqued to spec, but with the threads barely engaged. But this
> was still an educated guess, not the first-hand account of the owner.

Again, no broken wheels, lug studs intact, lug nuts stripped right off
almost immediately. Pretty strong evidence there.

> No matter, I'm sure it'll buff right out.

Certainly. :-)

Pat

BRUCE HASKIN wrote:
> NOW PAT !,
>
> Your English teacher would do a "slow roll" is her grave if she heard
> you say what you did !
>
> It is "Always" .... Leon and I ......
>
> You NEVER put yourself FIRST when you speak ! :-) ... Ain't that so,
> teacher ??? :-)
>
> Bruce Bing '03 LS

Hey, my last English teacher should only be about 55 to 60 by now.

Sorry, I just finished reading "Emergence" by David Palmer. Written in
first person without using the words "the", "my", or "I".

Not the easiest read in the world.... :-)

Now I'm fixin' to hit the sack.

Pat