Brake pedal travel

'89 Grand Marquis, front disc / rear drum. For maintenance, I changed
front pads and changed the brake fluid. Now, pedal is firm and stopping
is good, BUT... first press on the brake gives low but firm pedal,
stopping is strong until the last few feet, then it feels like the
transmission is fighting the brakes. If I press, release, then press
the brake pedal again, travel is less, pedal is firm and stopping is
better. If I press, release, press, release, then use the brakes, the
pedal is nice and high and firm, and the stopping is just wonderful.
At any of the three pedal depths above the pedal is firm and does not
sink when pressing the brake pedal hard. What's doing this?

I did notice something like this before I changed the brake fluid, but
the fluid was so bad that the sponginess made it hard to identify.

--
I miss my .signature.

Any possibility the old brake fluid was contaminated, such as the common
mistake of someone adding p/s fluid to top off, seen this many times. There
is a way to check if there is oil in the m/c usually after time the seal on
the cover shrivels up and there is another test, post back if you can sample
the old fluid.
"clifto" > wrote in message
...
> '89 Grand Marquis, front disc / rear drum. For maintenance, I changed
> front pads and changed the brake fluid. Now, pedal is firm and stopping
> is good, BUT... first press on the brake gives low but firm pedal,
> stopping is strong until the last few feet, then it feels like the
> transmission is fighting the brakes. If I press, release, then press
> the brake pedal again, travel is less, pedal is firm and stopping is
> better. If I press, release, press, release, then use the brakes, the
> pedal is nice and high and firm, and the stopping is just wonderful.
> At any of the three pedal depths above the pedal is firm and does not
> sink when pressing the brake pedal hard. What's doing this?
>
> I did notice something like this before I changed the brake fluid, but
> the fluid was so bad that the sponginess made it hard to identify.
>
> --
> I miss my .signature.
>



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This sounds like classic misadjusted rear drum brakes. Maybe there is
something to check there.

Brian


"Shep" > wrote in message
...
> Any possibility the old brake fluid was contaminated, such as the common
> mistake of someone adding p/s fluid to top off, seen this many times.
> There is a way to check if there is oil in the m/c usually after time the
> seal on the cover shrivels up and there is another test, post back if you
> can sample the old fluid.
> "clifto" > wrote in message
> ...
>> '89 Grand Marquis, front disc / rear drum. For maintenance, I changed
>> front pads and changed the brake fluid. Now, pedal is firm and stopping
>> is good, BUT... first press on the brake gives low but firm pedal,
>> stopping is strong until the last few feet, then it feels like the
>> transmission is fighting the brakes. If I press, release, then press
>> the brake pedal again, travel is less, pedal is firm and stopping is
>> better. If I press, release, press, release, then use the brakes, the
>> pedal is nice and high and firm, and the stopping is just wonderful.
>> At any of the three pedal depths above the pedal is firm and does not
>> sink when pressing the brake pedal hard. What's doing this?
>>
>> I did notice something like this before I changed the brake fluid, but
>> the fluid was so bad that the sponginess made it hard to identify.
>>
>> --
>> I miss my .signature.
>>
>
>
>
> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
> News==----
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> Newsgroups
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> =----

Shep wrote:
> Any possibility the old brake fluid was contaminated, such as the common
> mistake of someone adding p/s fluid to top off, seen this many times. There
> is a way to check if there is oil in the m/c usually after time the seal on
> the cover shrivels up and there is another test, post back if you can sample
> the old fluid.

I have the old fluid in a clean gallon milk bottle in the garage. I
doubt it's contaminated, as the car was meticulously maintained before
I got it (and since :-), but it's worth checking.

--
I miss my .signature.

Clifto, if there is oil mixed with the fluid you will see an emulsion or
seperation of the 2 fluids, get the fluid in a clear container and let it
settle then take a look, but yeah Brian is on track with rear brake
adjustment suggestion.
"clifto" > wrote in message
...
> Shep wrote:
>> Any possibility the old brake fluid was contaminated, such as the common
>> mistake of someone adding p/s fluid to top off, seen this many times.
>> There
>> is a way to check if there is oil in the m/c usually after time the seal
>> on
>> the cover shrivels up and there is another test, post back if you can
>> sample
>> the old fluid.
>
> I have the old fluid in a clean gallon milk bottle in the garage. I
> doubt it's contaminated, as the car was meticulously maintained before
> I got it (and since :-), but it's worth checking.
>
> --
> I miss my .signature.
>



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Yup,
2nd the misadjusted rear brakes.
give the adjuster a spin and I bet the problem goes away.

--
Alan Gallacher
Born to Tinker!

"Brian" > wrote in message
...
> This sounds like classic misadjusted rear drum brakes. Maybe there is
> something to check there.
>
> Brian
>
>
> "Shep" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Any possibility the old brake fluid was contaminated, such as the common
>> mistake of someone adding p/s fluid to top off, seen this many times.
>> There is a way to check if there is oil in the m/c usually after time the
>> seal on the cover shrivels up and there is another test, post back if you
>> can sample the old fluid.
>> "clifto" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> '89 Grand Marquis, front disc / rear drum. For maintenance, I changed
>>> front pads and changed the brake fluid. Now, pedal is firm and stopping
>>> is good, BUT... first press on the brake gives low but firm pedal,
>>> stopping is strong until the last few feet, then it feels like the
>>> transmission is fighting the brakes. If I press, release, then press
>>> the brake pedal again, travel is less, pedal is firm and stopping is
>>> better. If I press, release, press, release, then use the brakes, the
>>> pedal is nice and high and firm, and the stopping is just wonderful.
>>> At any of the three pedal depths above the pedal is firm and does not
>>> sink when pressing the brake pedal hard. What's doing this?
>>>
>>> I did notice something like this before I changed the brake fluid, but
>>> the fluid was so bad that the sponginess made it hard to identify.
>>>
>>> --
>>> I miss my .signature.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
>> News==----
>> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+
>> Newsgroups
>> ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
>> =----
>
>

clifto wrote:
> '89 Grand Marquis, front disc / rear drum. For maintenance, I changed
> front pads and changed the brake fluid. Now, pedal is firm and stopping
> is good, BUT... first press on the brake gives low but firm pedal,
> stopping is strong until the last few feet, then it feels like the
> transmission is fighting the brakes. If I press, release, then press
> the brake pedal again, travel is less, pedal is firm and stopping is
> better. If I press, release, press, release, then use the brakes, the
> pedal is nice and high and firm, and the stopping is just wonderful.
> At any of the three pedal depths above the pedal is firm and does not
> sink when pressing the brake pedal hard. What's doing this?
>
> I did notice something like this before I changed the brake fluid, but
> the fluid was so bad that the sponginess made it hard to identify.
>
> --
> I miss my .signature.

If proper bleeding doesn't fix the problem, I would suspect a bad
master cylinder. Push down VERY LIGHTLY on the pedal with the engine
running -- just barely enough to create the slightest hydraulic
pressure. Wait and see if the pedal sinks to the floor under this
condition. If so, put a rebuilt master cylinder on it. Even MCs that
are going bad will stay firm if you mash on the pedal.

Toyota MDT in MO