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LaCrosse vs LaSabre



 
 
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  #1  
Old January 24th 05, 09:36 PM
HLS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default LaCrosse vs LaSabre

Presently have a 98 LaSabre which has been an excellent car. However, it is
known that some models of the 3800 V6 engine
have had severe problems when the plastic manfolds decompose or begin to
leak coolant into the crankcase.

Buick seems to shuffle its feet, look at the sky, and claim 'the dog did
it'?

Is the problem solved now, or is the dog still doing it? I just want to know
the status.

Here is the email and link I sent to Buick:
http://www.buick.com/contact/email/
''I sent an earlier email about the weaknesses in the 3800 engine.
I have received no answer.

It is well known that there has been a weakness in some of those engines.

It has to do with plastic manifolds disintegrating due to heat passing
through

a tube which was a poor job of engineering.

This is well known to serious mechanics and automotive buffs.

Has this defect been eliminated from the new models?

This message will be posted on newsgroup rec.autos.tech, and your answer,

or lack of it, will be noted on the net.''



Does anyone know the status of this problem? Any opinions on the LaCrosse?




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  #2  
Old January 25th 05, 12:37 AM
Daniel J. Stern
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I'm not aware of the 3800 having this problem, but GM's smaller V6s (3.1,
3.4) definitely have had chronic problems of exactly this nature
anything's possible from General "Mark of Excrement" Motors. I've
crossposted your query to alt.autos.gm, which may get you more replies,
faster.

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005, HLS wrote:

> Presently have a 98 LaSabre which has been an excellent car. However, it is
> known that some models of the 3800 V6 engine
> have had severe problems when the plastic manfolds decompose or begin to
> leak coolant into the crankcase.
>
> Buick seems to shuffle its feet, look at the sky, and claim 'the dog did
> it'?
>
> Is the problem solved now, or is the dog still doing it? I just want to know
> the status.
>
> Here is the email and link I sent to Buick:
> http://www.buick.com/contact/email/
> ''I sent an earlier email about the weaknesses in the 3800 engine.
> I have received no answer.
>
> It is well known that there has been a weakness in some of those engines.
>
> It has to do with plastic manifolds disintegrating due to heat passing
> through
>
> a tube which was a poor job of engineering.
>
> This is well known to serious mechanics and automotive buffs.
>
> Has this defect been eliminated from the new models?
>
> This message will be posted on newsgroup rec.autos.tech, and your answer,
>
> or lack of it, will be noted on the net.''
>
>
>
> Does anyone know the status of this problem? Any opinions on the LaCrosse?
>
>
>
>
>

  #3  
Old January 25th 05, 02:39 AM
Kruse
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


HLS wrote:
> Presently have a 98 LaSabre which has been an excellent car.

However, it is
> known that some models of the 3800 V6 engine
> have had severe problems when the plastic manfolds decompose or begin

to
> leak coolant into the crankcase.
>


Also be aware that GM had some of these V-6 engines that had a plastic
nipple that sits under the alternator between the banks. It hooks to a
bypass hose that connects from it from the water pump. When these
decide to "go", you will lose all of your coolant in about 10 seconds.
Not a pleasant thought if it is -5 degrees and you are in BFE. The GM
replacement nipple is made of steel. It is not too hard (or expensive)
to replace but the peace of mind is well worth it.
Something to think about if you have one of these "older" engines.

  #4  
Old January 25th 05, 04:22 AM
Hairy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Daniel J. Stern" > wrote in message
.umich.edu...
> I'm not aware of the 3800 having this problem, but GM's smaller V6s (3.1,
> 3.4) definitely have had chronic problems of exactly this nature
> anything's possible from General "Mark of Excrement" Motors. I've
> crossposted your query to alt.autos.gm, which may get you more replies,
> faster.
>


I wonder if HLS actually expected to get a response from such an
antagonistic email. If he did, he's a fool.
H

> On Mon, 24 Jan 2005, HLS wrote:
>
> > Presently have a 98 LaSabre which has been an excellent car. However,

it is
> > known that some models of the 3800 V6 engine
> > have had severe problems when the plastic manfolds decompose or begin to
> > leak coolant into the crankcase.
> >
> > Buick seems to shuffle its feet, look at the sky, and claim 'the dog did
> > it'?
> >
> > Is the problem solved now, or is the dog still doing it? I just want to

know
> > the status.
> >
> > Here is the email and link I sent to Buick:
> > http://www.buick.com/contact/email/
> > ''I sent an earlier email about the weaknesses in the 3800 engine.
> > I have received no answer.
> >
> > It is well known that there has been a weakness in some of those

engines.
> >
> > It has to do with plastic manifolds disintegrating due to heat passing
> > through
> >
> > a tube which was a poor job of engineering.
> >
> > This is well known to serious mechanics and automotive buffs.
> >
> > Has this defect been eliminated from the new models?
> >
> > This message will be posted on newsgroup rec.autos.tech, and your

answer,
> >
> > or lack of it, will be noted on the net.''
> >
> >
> >
> > Does anyone know the status of this problem? Any opinions on the

LaCrosse?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >



  #5  
Old January 25th 05, 04:42 AM
Daniel J. Stern
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005, Hairy wrote:

> I wonder if HLS actually expected to get a response from such an
> antagonistic email.


Good question. I certainly never expected (and never got) a response to my
e-mail to the Fram people asking if their oil filters would stop sucking
**** now that the company had been bought by Honeywell.
  #6  
Old January 25th 05, 05:03 AM
shiden_kai
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Daniel J. Stern wrote:

> I'm not aware of the 3800 having this problem, but GM's smaller V6s
> (3.1,
> 3.4) definitely have had chronic problems of exactly this nature
> anything's possible from General "Mark of Excrement" Motors. I've
> crossposted your query to alt.autos.gm, which may get you more
> replies, faster.


Yes, it is/was a very common problem with the Generation II 3800
engine. The lower manifold has been revised and is "reputed" to
be better. Only time will tell. The new GenIII engine now has
eliminated the plastic upper plenum....so this will no longer be
an issue. Though the intake manifold gaskets on the 3800 do
disintegrate over time....but certainly not at the rate of the 60 degree
v-6's.

All the manufacturers have their problems...which is what keeps
technicians hard at work. Certainly wouldn't want them to
make them so good that we'd be standing around all day.

Ian


  #7  
Old January 25th 05, 05:11 PM
Steve
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Daniel J. Stern wrote:

> I'm not aware of the 3800 having this problem, but GM's smaller V6s (3.1,
> 3.4) definitely have had chronic problems of exactly this nature
> anything's possible from General "Mark of Excrement" Motors. I've
> crossposted your query to alt.autos.gm, which may get you more replies,
> faster.
>


The 3.1/3.4 have one problem, the 3.8 has another and only certain years
of the 3.8 were affected from what I've read. The *specific* problem
with the 3.8 was that the EGR gasses (hot!) were routed through a small
pipe that in turn passed through the intake maifold and gasket right
next to a water jacket. The manifold upper plenum (plastic) and/or
gasket would warp and distort from the heat, breaking the seal and
sending DexCool straight into the oil pan.

Classic example of a screwed-up design on a $2.00 part wrecking a lot
of otherwise rugged and well-designed engines (something you can't say
about the 3.1/3.4 engines, which pretty much stink in all aspects.)

The "fix" for the 3.8 is a smaller diameter EGR tube that leaves an
insulating gap between itself and the surrounding manifold and gasket
material preventing the distortion.

  #8  
Old January 25th 05, 05:13 PM
Steve
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hairy wrote:


>
> I wonder if HLS actually expected to get a response from such an
> antagonistic email. If he did, he's a fool.
> H


I got a kick out of that too. "Your response or lack thereof will be
published on the net..." indeed! I don't care if I was at the most
buyer-supportive company in the world, if I got an E-mail like that I'd
laugh my head off as I hit the "delete" key.

  #9  
Old January 26th 05, 04:18 PM
HLS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Hairy" > wrote in message
...

>
> I wonder if HLS actually expected to get a response from such an
> antagonistic email. If he did, he's a fool.
> H


Well, I'm definitely not a fool, but I am certainly antagonistic. I asked
some questions via the Buick link, and they were ignored.

Now I just trying to needle them a bit.


  #10  
Old January 26th 05, 04:25 PM
HLS
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"shiden_kai" > wrote in message
news:ayjJd.163727$8l.30291@pd7tw1no...
> Daniel J. Stern wrote:
>
> > I'm not aware of the 3800 having this problem, but GM's smaller V6s
> > (3.1,
> > 3.4) definitely have had chronic problems of exactly this nature
> > anything's possible from General "Mark of Excrement" Motors. I've
> > crossposted your query to alt.autos.gm, which may get you more
> > replies, faster.

>
> Yes, it is/was a very common problem with the Generation II 3800
> engine. The lower manifold has been revised and is "reputed" to
> be better. Only time will tell. The new GenIII engine now has
> eliminated the plastic upper plenum....so this will no longer be
> an issue. Though the intake manifold gaskets on the 3800 do
> disintegrate over time....but certainly not at the rate of the 60 degree
> v-6's.
>
> All the manufacturers have their problems...which is what keeps
> technicians hard at work. Certainly wouldn't want them to
> make them so good that we'd be standing around all day.
>
> Ian



This was the kind of answer I would have hoped Buick would have been honest
enough to provide. Thanks, Ian.

Certain models of the 3800 were pretty nearly bulletproof. Others were not.
The 98 LeSabre we drive is possibly one of the riskier engine
configurations, but it has not failed.

Buick chose not to recall the afflicted engines and repair the problem, but
rather waits to see if they will fail and if they can avoid warranty
repairs.

I like many things about the Buick, and was impressed by their overall
reliability standing in the market...a year or two ago it was second only to
Lexus.

Have you seen the LaCrosse, and if so what do you think about it?
I have not yet seen it, was impressed by the specs of the new engine, but
would not buy one of these high output jobs until I feel better about their
reliability.


 




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