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#11
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Unibody rigidity
On Wed, 16 Apr 2014 12:17:25 -0700, dsi1 wrote:
> On Wednesday, April 16, 2014 2:09:38 AM UTC-10, > wrote: >> Steve W. wrote: "Most newer vehicles use the glass as a structural >> part. The glass is also used in concert with the airbags for passenger >> restraint during " >> >> >> >> Doesn't say much for the 'rigidity' of unibody does it? I guess it >> goes with the territory: Remove the subframe(body-on-frame vintage), >> and that strength has to some from someplace else. Thicker guage >> sheetmetal? Now that's an idea. >> >> >> > Reducing weight and increasing the stiffness of the parts that the > drivetrain is bolted to is a good thing to do. If you can meet both > goals at the same time, it's simply good engineering. It's not that > radical a comcept - some motorcycles have been using the engine as a > stressed part of the frame for a while. > > >> Utilizing the glass in concert with the airbag does, however, make >> sense. The 1934 Chrysler Airflow was very well designed as a unit body for that time. |
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#12
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Unibody rigidity
On 4/16/2014 12:38 PM, sctvguy1 wrote:
> > The 1934 Chrysler Airflow was very well designed as a unit body for that > time. > That is interesting. I did not know that. Thanks. |
#13
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Unibody rigidity
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#14
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Unibody rigidity
On Wed, 16 Apr 2014 15:37:55 -1000, dsi1 wrote:
> On 4/16/2014 12:38 PM, sctvguy1 wrote: >> >> The 1934 Chrysler Airflow was very well designed as a unit body for >> that time. >> > That is interesting. I did not know that. Thanks. Look on youtube for the video of the 1934 Airflow going off a cliff, then driving off under its own power! |
#15
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Unibody rigidity
On 4/17/2014 8:41 AM, sctvguy1 wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Apr 2014 15:37:55 -1000, dsi1 wrote: > >> On 4/16/2014 12:38 PM, sctvguy1 wrote: >>> >>> The 1934 Chrysler Airflow was very well designed as a unit body for >>> that time. >>> >> That is interesting. I did not know that. Thanks. > > Look on youtube for the video of the 1934 Airflow going off a cliff, then > driving off under its own power! > I have seen this famous footage. I'd like to see them do that using a modern car. That would be cool! |
#16
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Unibody rigidity
On Tue, 15 Apr 2014 18:41:57 -0400, "Steve W." >
wrote: >Ashton Crusher wrote: >> On Sun, 13 Apr 2014 01:33:00 -0700 (PDT), >> wrote: >> >>> On Sunday, April 13, 2014 1:48:51 AM UTC+8, I hate front wheel >>> drive, most torque must go to the rear wrote: >>>> Are we still in 4 figures Nm/degree-wise or we're long in 5 digit >>>> territory? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I see the % improvement in the press from time to time but no >>>> actual >>>> >>>> figures for any car[s]. >>> I had a 1997 car, and put lowered sports suspension on it. When >>> parked on uneven ground, the front doors were hard to close, which >>> means not enough rigidity. The next model was beefed up (probably >>> to get more stars in crash tests) and was quite stiff, had no such >>> problems. and was >> >> >> I had a 1980 Citation (MT Car of the Year!!!) and it was the most >> flexible car I have ever owned. Felt like a wet noodle. > > >NYS bought some of the first generation Chrysler mini-vans and >discovered that the chassis was not even close to sturdy. They would >open the sliding door and then discover that after they got the people >in that the door wouldn't close and you could see ripples in the roof >panels from the stress. Chrysler used the same approach to repair them >as they did the K-Car convertibles. Extra rocker panel braces to stiffen >the unibody. Years ago our agency bought a bunch of K-cars. They flatbedded them out to usage sites. On the flatbed they attached straps to the frame to anchor them to the trailer. Doing so bent the frames...... |
#17
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Unibody rigidity
On Thu, 17 Apr 2014 03:29:51 -0400, "Steve W." >
wrote: wrote: >> Steve W. wrote: "Most newer vehicles use the glass as a structural >> part. The glass is also used in concert with the airbags for >> passenger restraint during " >> >> Doesn't say much for the 'rigidity' of unibody does it? I guess it >> goes with the territory: Remove the subframe(body-on-frame vintage), >> and that strength has to some from someplace else. Thicker guage >> sheetmetal? Now that's an idea. >> >> Utilizing the glass in concert with the airbag does, however, make >> sense. > >Unibody has been in use far longer than a lot of people think. > >You also have to consider how the rigidity of the design effects the >ride quality and safety. > >You could design a vehicle that was very rigid and had no flex. It would >have the ride of a solid block of concrete and survivability would be >low in a major impact. > >For examples of unibody just look at Mustangs (and every variant of the >fox body), Camaros, Every Chrysler car since 1961. Pretty much every >other car built by all makers since the late 90's. Trucks and some >specific vehicles still have BOF construction but it's a very low count >these days. > >These days with safety and fuel mileage they look at everything for ways >to make the vehicle lighter. One of those is thinner stronger steel >alloys and using more of the components of the body to carry the weight. I believe the largest Unibody car ever built was the 1960 Lincoln. |
#19
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Unibody rigidity
On Fri, 18 Apr 2014 10:06:21 -0400, "Steve W." >
wrote: >Ashton Crusher wrote: >> On Thu, 17 Apr 2014 03:29:51 -0400, "Steve W." > >> wrote: >> >>> wrote: >>>> Steve W. wrote: "Most newer vehicles use the glass as a structural >>>> part. The glass is also used in concert with the airbags for >>>> passenger restraint during " >>>> >>>> Doesn't say much for the 'rigidity' of unibody does it? I guess it >>>> goes with the territory: Remove the subframe(body-on-frame vintage), >>>> and that strength has to some from someplace else. Thicker guage >>>> sheetmetal? Now that's an idea. >>>> >>>> Utilizing the glass in concert with the airbag does, however, make >>>> sense. >>> Unibody has been in use far longer than a lot of people think. >>> >>> You also have to consider how the rigidity of the design effects the >>> ride quality and safety. >>> >>> You could design a vehicle that was very rigid and had no flex. It would >>> have the ride of a solid block of concrete and survivability would be >>> low in a major impact. >>> >>> For examples of unibody just look at Mustangs (and every variant of the >>> fox body), Camaros, Every Chrysler car since 1961. Pretty much every >>> other car built by all makers since the late 90's. Trucks and some >>> specific vehicles still have BOF construction but it's a very low count >>> these days. >>> >>> These days with safety and fuel mileage they look at everything for ways >>> to make the vehicle lighter. One of those is thinner stronger steel >>> alloys and using more of the components of the body to carry the weight. >> >> I believe the largest Unibody car ever built was the 1960 Lincoln. > >Car maybe. The GM vans were unibody up until 96. They built cargo trucks >on that design. 1994 G20 Chevy Van.. wheelbase 125 inches, overall length 204.1 1960 Lincoln wheelbase 131 inches, overall length 227 |
#20
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Unibody rigidity
Ashton Crusher wrote:
> On Fri, 18 Apr 2014 10:06:21 -0400, "Steve W." > > wrote: > >> Ashton Crusher wrote: >>> On Thu, 17 Apr 2014 03:29:51 -0400, "Steve W." > >>> wrote: >>> >>>> wrote: >>>>> Steve W. wrote: "Most newer vehicles use the glass as a structural >>>>> part. The glass is also used in concert with the airbags for >>>>> passenger restraint during " >>>>> >>>>> Doesn't say much for the 'rigidity' of unibody does it? I guess it >>>>> goes with the territory: Remove the subframe(body-on-frame vintage), >>>>> and that strength has to some from someplace else. Thicker guage >>>>> sheetmetal? Now that's an idea. >>>>> >>>>> Utilizing the glass in concert with the airbag does, however, make >>>>> sense. >>>> Unibody has been in use far longer than a lot of people think. >>>> >>>> You also have to consider how the rigidity of the design effects the >>>> ride quality and safety. >>>> >>>> You could design a vehicle that was very rigid and had no flex. It would >>>> have the ride of a solid block of concrete and survivability would be >>>> low in a major impact. >>>> >>>> For examples of unibody just look at Mustangs (and every variant of the >>>> fox body), Camaros, Every Chrysler car since 1961. Pretty much every >>>> other car built by all makers since the late 90's. Trucks and some >>>> specific vehicles still have BOF construction but it's a very low count >>>> these days. >>>> >>>> These days with safety and fuel mileage they look at everything for ways >>>> to make the vehicle lighter. One of those is thinner stronger steel >>>> alloys and using more of the components of the body to carry the weight. >>> I believe the largest Unibody car ever built was the 1960 Lincoln. >> Car maybe. The GM vans were unibody up until 96. They built cargo trucks >> on that design. > > > 1994 G20 Chevy Van.. wheelbase 125 inches, overall length 204.1 > 1960 Lincoln wheelbase 131 inches, overall length 227 That would be a "normal" van. They also sold them as cab/chassis or cut-aways to companies who then installed regular cargo boxes and ambulance bodies as well as motorhome bodies on them, Many added frame rails to the rear but there were quite a few that simply changed the rear axle to a dually design and bolted the stuff onto the factory floor pan. Something like these http://cyberauctions.com/ItemPics/63074_1.jpg http://imganuncios.mitula.net/1992_g...1214204318.jpg -- Steve W. |
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