"Brent P" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, jaybird wrote:
>>
>> "Brent P" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> In article >, jaybird wrote:
>>>
>>>> I can explain that. A great expectation of privacy is inside our home.
>>>
>>> Why?
>
>> Ask the courts.
>
> They aren't arguing it here. You are. Defend your arguement.
>
>>>> It
>>>> lessens in our vehicle because it is in a public place and is mobile
>>>> (in
>>>> a
>>>> nutshell).
>
>>> Why?
>
>> Again, ask the courts. Read up on some case law about it and that should
>> answer it for you.
>
> It doesn't. You're presenting the arguement here. Your job to defend it
> HERE.

It is not my job to give you a class on case law. Just because you don't
understand the levels of one's expectation of privacy does not make it my
responsibility to teach you. I googled a few examples for you, but you'll
just have to research it yourself. I didn't read through these completely,
but they came up:

United States v. Knotts
Kyllo v. United States

>
>>>> Where the line has been drawn for K9 sniffs is that while it is
>>>> true that your vehicle and its contents are "effects", the air that is
>>>> around it is not private property.
>
>>> Neither is the heat signature of your home visable from the street. Nor
>>> the sounds that can be picked up with a sensitive microphone.
>
>> ...which are more intrusive means than smelling air outside your vehicle.
>
> Maybe to you. I find the use of any equipment or trained animal subject
> to the interpetation and honesty of the operator. That operator I do not
> trust. Thusly regardless of how intrusive you or I find it, to me, it is
> all equally objectionable _without_ warrant.

And that's fine that you have your own opinion. I choose to operate
according to our courts' opinions. A K9 sniff outside of a vehicle does not
require a warrant.

>
>>>> If your vehicle has air coming from it
>>>> to the outside, that air is not your property either. If a dog, or
>>>> other
>>>> means are used to detect an illegal substance in that air which is
>>>> coming
>>>> from private property, that gives cops the same reason to investigate
>>>> where that air is coming from as it would if they were to look in your
>>>> vehicle's windows from the outside and see something illegal.
>
>>> And if they hear you say something suspicious they should be able to
>>> burst right into your home to.
>
>> Not necessarily. If you say something like "I've killed 3 people and set
>> a
>> nuclear device inside my house", then yes. If you say "don't tell that
>> cop
>> about the porn mags under my bed", that's not going to be enough.
>
> Porn is still legal in most forms. But you show your true colors here,
> you have no problem with the warrantless monitoring itself.

I have no problem with warrantless activities when done in accordance with
our laws.

>
>>> There is no difference in the logic. Once you erase the bill of rights
>>> in
>>> one place, you effectively doom it everywhere.
>
>> No, you just need a better understanding of what our courts have ruled
>> on.
>> Individuals have different opinions, but we have to look to the court
>> system
>> to be a place where we can come to an agreement.
>
> The consitution is in plain and simple language. Every year these courts
> you call 'a place of agreement' slide us ever so closer to a police
> state. Ruling time and time again for the powers of the state and its
> police forces. Unlike you, I don't have a special pass so I must be
> concerned about things.
>
> I live in the state from where this court case came. It has blessed the
> use of canine searches at whim. The speed limits here are set artifically
> low. Dangerously low. I have no freedom of travel any more. At any time I
> may be stopped, detained for hours, searched, questioned, forced to
> produce documents, etc and so forth. That's not a free country. The only
> thing still working in my favor is that the probability of it occuring is
> low. That's not comforting.

I know we have different opinions. All I can do is offer reasons why.

--
---
jaybird
---
I am not the cause of your problems.
My actions are the result of your actions.
Your life is not my fault.